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High CRI video lights for macro work

cri light macro

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#1 EspenB

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Posted 30 January 2016 - 03:25 PM

I'm looking into getting some high CRI lamps first and foremost for macro work.

 

I'm tempted by the FIX NEO 2200 pro lights http://www.fixneo.co...premium-2200-dx .

These are rated for 2200 lumens and a cri of 95 with a color temperature of 4000 kelvin.

 

But I fear they might not give enough light for macro video work?

 

What are the other high cri options?

 

I know of the Keldan Video 8m CRI but it's out of my price range.

 

The other option I know of are the I-Torch Venom c92 with CRI 92 and 4000 lumens. http://www.itorch.ca/venom-c92.html

 

 



#2 thetrickster

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 06:03 AM

The 4000k temp rating doesn't sound great either.


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#3 Interceptor121

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 06:03 AM

For macro work you don't need 2000 lumens.

In order to achieve 20000 lux on 100 degrees (wasted for macro) 1000 lumens are adequate and will already get your fish blind


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#4 EspenB

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 07:24 AM

The 4000k temp rating doesn't sound great either.


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Should be more like 5500 kelvin?



#5 EspenB

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 07:37 AM

For macro work you don't need 2000 lumens.

In order to achieve 20000 lux on 100 degrees (wasted for macro) 1000 lumens are adequate and will already get your fish blind

 

Which high CRI lamps can you recommend.



#6 Interceptor121

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 07:45 AM

I have no idea but if you buy 2000-4000 lumens dim them or you will have fried fish

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#7 Nick Hope

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 10:58 AM

I don't like wide lights like 100 degrees for macro because they light up the crap in the water column between your lens and your subject, and they also often light up the background too much. I use 3D-printed shades now on my Keldan Luna 4X lights most of the time for macro, and quite often a snoot.

 

Also, as Interceptor says, you don't need a high output.

 

I would say 30 degrees is about right. No wider. The FIX Neo 1500 DX SWR and FIX Neo 1000 DX SW are probably better choices for macro than the FIX Neo Premium 2200 DX and FIX Neo 3000 DX. They don't list the CRI values, which is a bit worrying, but then I think sometimes high-CRI is over-rated compared to other features.

 

There was also an attractive FIX Neo 2000 DX SWR with 720 lumens at 30 degrees angle (and maybe a remote control). Kay Burn Lim shot some lovely macro with them with his A7S. But they're no longer listed on the site and I don't know if they're still available.

 

Finding top-quality, high-CRI lights for macro is surprisingly difficult. I really want something more appropriate than my Keldans but nothing seems to fit the bill. Everyone's going after higher and higher output ratings. There's a gap in the market.



#8 Interceptor121

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Posted 31 January 2016 - 10:55 PM

I second what Nick says. In Europe now light bulbs under 80 CRI are illegal. Most of the led you see have higher than 80 anyway and when you have a daylight beam at 6500K the color rendition is pretty accurate. However once you go for a warmer light it gets more difficult to render colour properly. The color temperature can be adjusted for by the white balance So generally I think this is a bit overrated and a set of daylight video lights will do just fine

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#9 EspenB

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 02:25 PM

Really, I'm not wiser after reading this!



#10 tursiops

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 05:56 PM

In Europe now light bulbs under 80 CRI are illegal.

So Europe does not allow Sodium Vapor lights (CRI=0) or even cool white fluorescent lights (CRI=62)?

Remarkable.



#11 Nick Hope

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 12:18 AM

Really, I'm not wiser after reading this!

 
I should have saved myself the time and effort then!

#12 thetrickster

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 12:38 AM

Really, I'm not wiser after reading this!

 

1. Its been stated that for macro work 1000lm (or below is plenty) for a narrow beamed light.
2. There doesn't exist low powered (<2000lm) lights with high CRI

3. The lights you mentioned have a 'warm' mid morning temp to them, where as higher quality lights have a more direct sunlight (5400k) temp

4. A beam angle of 30' is a suggested max for macro

4. Recommended the FIX Neo 1500 DX SWR (6000k temp)

 

I think there is a lot to take away from this thread! :)


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#13 EspenB

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 09:06 AM

 
I should have saved myself the time and effort then!

 

Maybe I didn't read what I would like to see...



#14 EspenB

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 09:45 AM

 

There was also an attractive FIX Neo 2000 DX SWR with 720 lumens at 30 degrees angle (and maybe a remote control). Kay Burn Lim shot some lovely macro with them with his A7S. But they're no longer listed on the site and I don't know if they're still available.

 

 

Fisheye FIX Neo 2000 DX SWR is not listed anylonger as you say and older material list them as having a color temp of 7500 kelvin. It seems to have a possibility to run the red emitters together with the white ons to warm up the ligh however.

#15 EspenB

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 10:16 AM

 

1. Its been stated that for macro work 1000lm (or below is plenty) for a narrow beamed light.
2. There doesn't exist low powered (<2000lm) lights with high CRI

3. The lights you mentioned have a 'warm' mid morning temp to them, where as higher quality lights have a more direct sunlight (5400k) temp

4. A beam angle of 30' is a suggested max for macro

4. Recommended the FIX Neo 1500 DX SWR (6000k temp)

 

I think there is a lot to take away from this thread! :)

 

The FIX NEO 1000 is cheaper and have more light in the spot mode 600 vs 500 lumens... Color temp is rated the same. Could be better. They are only listed for 369 euro a piece.

 

But still sceptical that 600 lumen spot is enough for a high f setting on my GH4...



#16 EspenB

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 03:35 PM

I decided to do a quick dry run.

 

Gh3 + Olympus 60 macro.

 

shutter at 1/25 (25 fps video)

 

f stop started at f16 and ended at f8.

 

lighting was a scubapro nova 700 (rated at 700 lumens and its a narrow tight spot)

 

I also tried to light the scene with a 100 degree video lamp, but that was a waste like you guys allready have stated.

 

sorry for the shake, it was bad tripod not suided or the weight of the camera, and autofocus was running continously.

 

still I found it interessting that the narrow beam was up for the job.

 

https://youtu.be/Z-gwH-fiJDE


Edited by EspenB, 03 February 2016 - 03:39 PM.


#17 Nick Hope

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 11:27 PM

The FIX NEO 1000 is cheaper and have more light in the spot mode 600 vs 500 lumens... Color temp is rated the same. Could be better. They are only listed for 369 euro a piece.


I've just noticed the FIX Neo Mini 1000 SW too. Looks like a focus light but the specs aren't so far off the FIX Neo 1000 DX SW. There are no CRI specs published, and no output adjustment [Edit: It says 25% steps], but you can put them nearer or further away from your subject, and your camera has plenty of things to adjust anyway. And what's not to love about tiny lights like this at less than $300? I do think they're worthy of serious consideration for macro. A while ago I was considering the previous Mini 500 version as a 3rd "backlight", behind my subject. Topside tests were promising, but I decided to save myself the hassle of a 3rd light for now.
 

But still sceptical that 600 lumen spot is enough for a high f setting on my GH4...

 

Be wary of high f settings on the Olympus 60mm macro lens. Diffraction kicks in at smaller apertures, as on any lens, and degrades the image. Take a look at line 7 below. In my tests it's sharpest at f4, good at f2.8 to f5.6, OK at f6.3 to f13, bad at f14 to f18, terrible at f20 and f22. I have a mini version of line 7 actually stuck to my macro port to remind me what to use and what not to. Lines 2 and 3 are for the Olympus 12-50 in wide mode and macro mode.

Olympus-lens-sharpness.png


Edited by Nick Hope, 03 February 2016 - 11:57 PM.


#18 kc_moses

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Posted 04 February 2016 - 08:36 AM


shutter at 1/25 (25 fps video)

 

f stop started at f16 and ended at f8.

 

You shutter should be 1/50 for 25 fps video.



#19 EspenB

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Posted 06 February 2016 - 02:15 PM

 

You shutter should be 1/50 for 25 fps video.

 

The camera let me do 1/25. :)



#20 Nick Hope

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Posted 06 February 2016 - 11:06 PM

The traditional standard for movies and video is a shutter speed of half the frame rate (known as 180 degree shutter because old rotary shutters were open half of a 360 degree rotation) i.e. 1/50 for 25fps. 1/60 for 30fps. This gives a natural smoothness to motion without being too staccato (from faster shutter speeds) or too blurry (from slower shutter speeds). But the shutter absolutely doesn't have to be set to that. If there is no motion in the video then it doesn't matter, and a 360 degree shutter (e.g. 1/25 at 25fps) can be useful in low light situations where your aperture is wide open and you don't want to increase ISO any more because of noise. Conversely, loads of the footage in my Mucky Secrets documentary was shot at shutter speeds faster than 1/50 because I had too much light and I was out of the habit of using ND filters. However if you're shooting 25fps video with 1/25 shutter speed and there is substantial movement then the result is going to be blurry and you're better off adjusting other parameters to get more light if you can.







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