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What's wrong with my settings ? (Canon g7x mark II and Inon s2000)


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#1 LAROUX

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 12:53 PM

Hello everyone,

 

Could you please let me know why my uw photos are really awful ? I have been using canon g7x mark ii and inon s2000 strobe. 

 

I've dived today and took some photos with canon g7x mark II manual mode 1/100  -  ISO 120 - f8 and the strobe setup was STTL, B

 

My photos look like not enough lightening ? Where is my fault ? What settings are wrong ? Could someone please help me ?

 


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Thanks in advance. 


Edited by LAROUX, 22 March 2018 - 12:58 PM.


#2 tursiops

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 03:56 PM

Is the magnet perhaps removed from the s2000? You want the magnet switch installed, because the G7X II has no preflash.

 

"Basically, if your camera flash outputs a preflash, the  magnetic switch should be REMOVED. If your camera flash does not output a pre-flash, the magnetic switch should be INSTALLED.

Preflash – Magnet Switch Removed.

No Preflash – Magnet Switch Installed."


Edited by tursiops, 22 March 2018 - 03:58 PM.


#3 LAROUX

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Posted 22 March 2018 - 09:34 PM

Tursiops,

Yes magnet was removed. I wasn't know that canon g7x mark ii no preflash.


Edited by LAROUX, 23 March 2018 - 12:23 AM.


#4 ChrigelKarrer

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 05:45 AM

Well,
There is some light from the strobe, the cuttlefish photo shows that, so it seems that the strobe is triggered the right way.
Consider also that the S-2000 is a very small and not very strong strobe and will not illuminate for a longer distance,
that may be the case of the picture of the turtle.

 

1/100  -  ISO 120 - f8 and the strobe setup was STTL, B

1/100 - Iso 120 - f/8 was probably on the low side and the pictures is slightly underexposed.
Try to shoot agan in automatic mode, either ISO Auto or aperture auto and lock speed at 160/sec to avoid microunsharpness.
This should show if the sTTL is working right or not.

 

Chris

 

Set the camera strobe output to lowest and make sure you have no EV correction set.


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#5 ChrisRoss

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Posted 24 March 2018 - 07:57 PM

Typically S-TTL will work for macro where pretty much 100% of the frame is flash lit, but mostly won't work so well for distant shots with lots of water in the frame.  You can test this out, put the camera in the housing and shoot some images on land, if TTL works there at your settings and  same distances, then the problem is the camera not exposing properly for TTL underwater.  

 

The strobe may struggle a little with your exposure, but should put out more light than that.  Having said that you have a 1" sensor with a 2.7x crop factor, the DOF at f8 is equivalent to a full frame at f22, so you can afford to open up a little, try f4 or f5.6.  f4 is equivalent to f11 and at 24mm equivalent should be enough depth of field.   You could also go up to ISO200.  This will increase your flash range.  Also how far away are you?  you need too be really close for effective UW flash.

 

If that does not work switch to manual exposure for flash.

 

This guy seems to get the camera to work on TTL, but mostly for macro, might try following his settings:  http://uw-pix.com/be...ot-g7x-mark-ii/



#6 LAROUX

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Posted 25 March 2018 - 04:46 AM

Typically S-TTL will work for macro where pretty much 100% of the frame is flash lit, but mostly won't work so well for distant shots with lots of water in the frame.  You can test this out, put the camera in the housing and shoot some images on land, if TTL works there at your settings and  same distances, then the problem is the camera not exposing properly for TTL underwater.  

 

The strobe may struggle a little with your exposure, but should put out more light than that.  Having said that you have a 1" sensor with a 2.7x crop factor, the DOF at f8 is equivalent to a full frame at f22, so you can afford to open up a little, try f4 or f5.6.  f4 is equivalent to f11 and at 24mm equivalent should be enough depth of field.   You could also go up to ISO200.  This will increase your flash range.  Also how far away are you?  you need too be really close for effective UW flash.

 

If that does not work switch to manual exposure for flash.

 

This guy seems to get the camera to work on TTL, but mostly for macro, might try following his settings:  http://uw-pix.com/be...ot-g7x-mark-ii/

 

Thanks a lot for your response. I appreciated. 

 

I do not have any lightening problem while shooting macro. Macro results are nice. I think problem is with TTL mode. It isn't working well with canon compact cameras. (my camera is g7x mark ii) 

Also someone said I should install magnet switch in the strobe and use the strobe on manual mode. I'll give a try next time only manual mode.  

 

I'm really beginner at uw photography and I should do more practice. 



#7 dhaas

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Posted 25 March 2018 - 09:12 AM

If your camera flash is set to TTL  my understanding is the Canon camera's flash fires a preflash in M, P, Tv and Av modes.

 

It also does TTL flash in M mode unlike some earlier Canon compact models which had no TTL dash in M mode.

 

Canon G7X II

Camera flash set to TTL 

M Shooting Mode, various shutter speed / f-stop, ISO combinations

 

Inon S2000 strobes on S-TTL middle control in B

No magnets installed

 

At wide and medium focal lengths as some commented you don't need to close down the 1" sensor Canon G7X II aperture too much more than f 5.6.

Macro maybe f8 (and boost ISO to 160) as anything past that introduces more diffraction than any gain in depth of field.

 

I probably stopped these down too much but they came out in focus and well exposed. The camera's TTL flash and Inon S2000 S-TTL flash worked fine.

 

Just one old guy's experience :)

 

 

 

 

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#8 tursiops

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Posted 25 March 2018 - 10:34 AM

I find nothing in the G7Xii manual (visual and pdf search) regarding TTL or preflash. 



#9 dhaas

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Posted 25 March 2018 - 02:35 PM

I looked too and maybe it's the Inon S2000 circuitry that ignores any TTL preflash in any of those modes. 

 

All I know is the way I've used it this way for 2 years. It fires fine and synchs with the camera in TTL and strobe on S-TTL with middle triangular control set to B.

 

Any flash compensation (+/-) I do in camera menu versus on the strobe.

 

Your mileage may vary :)


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#10 tursiops

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Posted 25 March 2018 - 05:43 PM

I looked too and maybe it's the Inon S2000 circuitry that ignores any TTL preflash in any of those modes. 

 

All I know is the way I've used it this way for 2 years. It fires fine and synchs with the camera in TTL and strobe on S-TTL with middle triangular control set to B.

 

Any flash compensation (+/-) I do in camera menu versus on the strobe.

 

Your mileage may vary :)

Is your magnet in or out?

Are you sure you're not just firing the flash at mid-power, and then adjusting with the camera for the proper exposure?


Edited by tursiops, 25 March 2018 - 05:44 PM.


#11 dhaas

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Posted 26 March 2018 - 03:52 AM

I'm 100% sure the Inon S2000 magnets are out and have never been in my two Inon S2000 strobes since I bought them.

 

I'm also sure shooting the Canon G7X II in M mode my flash MENU setting has been on AUTO since I bought the camera. I shot with the original Canon G7X for a year before buying a G7X II and have always shot TTL flash on these compacts.

 

In fact, the one reason I bought the original G7X was it was the first canon Powershot that OFFERED TTL flash when shooting in M mode just like SLRs with hot shoe attached flash.

 

I have looked for preflash details in my print and online Canon manual. In P, Tv, Av and M Flash Control menu choices. All info simply labels TTL flash as AUTO.  

 

If there's any preflash difference in AUTO between Av, Tv, P and M modes the Inon S2000 flash automatic (S-TTL) circuitry likely makes the camera's flash to Inon S2000 S-TTL automatically synch.

 

Thousands of shots of my personal experience confirms it works exactly as I describe.

 

One big reason I see people with minimal flash color is usually from shooting too far away. Also closing the aperture down too far as even in S-TTL the flash can only dump a full power max output even automatically plus ISO choice.

 

I lock my ISO at either 125 to a max of 200 unless shooting ambient light only.

 

Just one old guy's information from actual use :)


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#12 sunnyboy010101

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Posted 26 March 2018 - 08:18 AM

I don't have Inon2000, but looking at your initial photos, it really looks to me like you are too far away. In some, the subject has some light, but the backgrounds, which are farther away, are showing no strobe light (just ambient).

 

You also say that macro is fine.

 

So my conclusion is the power from the strobe simply doesn't go as far as you would hope on those longer shots and so isn't lighting the scene.

 

You could try the strobe on manual full power in a similar shot and see if it lights the scene completely, but I'm betting it won't. However, that will be the tell. If manual full power DOES light the whole scene, then you need to play with either the TTL settings or some other strobe setting until you are happy. If full power manual does NOT light the whole scene, then you either need multiple slave flashes or a bigger strobe. In the latter case somehow you need to get more light than the strobe alone can give.



#13 Undertow

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 03:04 PM

Ok wow...

 

Please forgive my cynicism but 11 replies and no one has mentioned the primary issue here??? Apologies guys, but some of these replies are just confusing the situation. 

 

 

Laroux,

 

Your ambient exposure is too bright.

 

Your strobe clearly works, but the TTL circuit sees plenty of exposure from the ambient light and doesn't 'need' to add much to create a 'properly' exposed image. Dial down your ambient exposure. 

 

Also, as mentioned, you need to be a bit closer for best results but decent images can be had at your shooting distances. 

 

White balance is also way off. If your files are raw, crank up the magenta in post and you'll see a difference. For the future, start with the camera's 'Cloudy' white balance (usually a cloud symbol). 

 

Plan a dive to sit in one spot for 15+mins and experiment with exposure and flash settings. Set everything to manual and play around. Find what works for a given subject (even just a rock...) then switch to TTL and see if you can replicate it. 

 

Cheers,

 

Chris



#14 LAROUX

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Posted 28 March 2018 - 08:19 PM

Thank you for all suggestions and responses. Next time I will try all recommended settings. First I will try manual mode on the strobe then STTL mode and I will be close to the subject as possible. 

 

Thanks to all :) !!!


Edited by LAROUX, 28 March 2018 - 10:40 PM.


#15 ChrigelKarrer

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 05:33 AM

 

Plan a dive to sit in one spot for 15+mins and experiment with exposure and flash settings. Set everything to manual and play around. Find what works for a given subject (even just a rock...) then switch to TTL and see if you can replicate it.

 

What i do if ei either have a new camera or tracking down a problem is to use my pool at it offers shallow depths, long bottom times, no deco and clear water.
You may buy a bag of small plastic dinosaurus, insects, figures and use them as models, they are pacient...
Some of them float, so you may stick/glue them on a tile to avoid that they move around.
Chris


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#16 LAROUX

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 06:37 AM

 

What i do if ei either have a new camera or tracking down a problem is to use my pool at it offers shallow depths, long bottom times, no deco and clear water.
You may buy a bag of small plastic dinosaurus, insects, figures and use them as models, they are pacient...
Some of them float, so you may stick/glue them on a tile to avoid that they move around.
Chris

 

Yes exactly what I was planing in this weekend. I will do that. Camera flash should be set up auto right ? Not manual ?



#17 sunnyboy010101

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 12:56 PM

Another question - what are you using for ISO? If you are using Auto for ISO, it will quite happily increase the ISO in a natural light setting to give you the results in your photos. So if you are using Auto ISO, switch to a manual setting and see if that helps.



#18 LAROUX

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 08:55 PM

Another question - what are you using for ISO? If you are using Auto for ISO, it will quite happily increase the ISO in a natural light setting to give you the results in your photos. So if you are using Auto ISO, switch to a manual setting and see if that helps.

 

I always use manuel ISO between 120 to 160



#19 PS_DiveDoctor

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Posted 14 April 2018 - 03:34 PM

You should try setting your background first without any flash. Adjust your ISO and shutter speed to get the background you want. After that set your flash on manual and use one flash first to get the lighting effect you want then bring in the second strobe for fill lighting.