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Gopro Dual Hero 3D Thread


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#41 hellhole

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 05:03 AM

I would really like to see gopro add in the hero 4 silver to be compatible with the dual hero.. But alas they seem not really going to do that...

I have previously read somewhere that you can actually achieve similar result if u get the distance right between the lens and then a lot of post work...

#42 Barry C

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 09:38 AM

Hi Barry: Thnaks for the advise on how you think would be best to use the Gopro 3D UW, without a doubt using the Gopro silver 4 as a monitor will be best for framing the scene and getting some really nice footage. The lack of a good viewfinder is without a doubt the Gopros weakest link, I have been shown umpteen shots of UW Gopro footage thats completely forgettable for lack of being able to frame the shot well. I think to begin with I am going to mount it on the my Gates  housing, I have used housings that are light , small, mid weight and heavy and there is something to said for a lot of mass in giving stability for really smooth video if your movimg either finning or going with the current. When I here about how your fin invention turns out, if your really happy with it , I may change. Water does help in smoothing things out. The Sony TD-10 I use has great image stabilization, however on land several times I have shot the same scene hand held and also on a tripod and the results are MUCH  BETTER on a tripod, actually I have quit shooting hand held because the loss in quality is that much. Shooting the same camera in 2D the results are great hand held!! Just the slightest bit of degradation in the 3D footage makes the results on the big screen a lot less nice. 
                The Sony A7 you bought will be a real adventure to use, they are extraordinary!!! The sensors they have are almost like science fiction, it makes you think ............what will we have in 4-5 years time. Are you also into Astrophotography with telescopes?? Best Regards , Steve

Yep, when it comes to stability in the water, its all about weight & mass.  Actually, if you have sufficient mass, the weight is less crucial.  On land, for hand held, weight is definitely important.  That being said, I recall you saying that you don't like to do a lot of work in post.  I would urge you to rethink this and really make friends with your NLE :)  While shooting good content is indeed half the story, effective editing in post along with taking advantage of the amazing tools that are out there, is the other half. For instance, when it comes to stabilization, there is some absolutely AMAZING software out there. While I always try to be as careful as possible with the initial handheld  shooting, its the post software fine tuning which really gets it over the top in many cases. There is a short 3D skiing video on my channel where I was testing the Dual helmet mounted. You can well imagine what the vibrations were like.  I ran the clips through Mercalli V4 Sal which was nothing short of miraculous.  My NLE, Edius, also has a good stabilizer, but sometimes, for the really heavy lifting, Mercalli 4 is the ticket!  It will take a somewhat shaky hand held pan and often turn it smooth as butter. And for vibrations, it just kills  them.  It's available as a stand alone app and also a plugin for Edius.  The advantage to the plugin is that it will process the paired clips, whereas with the stand alone version, you have to run the left and right through separately.  Of course, the main thing to avoid is jerky movements, since there is nothing that will help there. The other trick you can do in post, which can help in addition to stabilization on some clips is applying a bit of slowmo, as that can also help smooth things out. For me, I really love working in post as it gives me projects to do after the shooting is done.  I get really bored when I don't have a project. This summer, besides spending 8 days shooting 3D in Cozumel, I'm planning on at least 4 Yosemite trips for a daytime and nighttime timelapse project.  I'll be quite happy if I can get enough good content for at least a couple of months of post work.  Regarding astro through a telescope, I used to do a bit of it back in the early 90s when I was using the moon composited into some magazine and poster projects I had going, but now its just through the camera lens.
 
On another note, if you get a GP4 Silver for your viewfinder, you will need to make a mounting platform for it. If you decide to go this route, let me know and I'll give you the specs for one which you can have made at your local plastic fab shop. Actually, as I recall, it's a piece of about 1/16th inch thick plastic which is 2" wide and is 2" at the top and 2 3/8" up the back with a 90 degree bend. I also cut a hole in it so I can see the flashing LED. It attaches to the Dual with Velcro and has a Gopro adhesive backed mount on the top. The thing to do is preaim it to coincide with the camera view.  You can do this by using the live view in the phone app. Then, once aimed, tighten the mount nob tight. That way, every time you put it on, you won't have to readjust it.
 
Regarding the A7SII sensor, it really is hard to believe how far we've come. And, I'm with you in wondering where we'll be in 5 years!
 
Regards,
                  Barry

Edited by Barry C, 19 April 2016 - 03:59 PM.


#43 Barry C

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 10:07 AM

I would really like to see gopro add in the hero 4 silver to be compatible with the dual hero.. But alas they seem not really going to do that...

I have previously read somewhere that you can actually achieve similar result if u get the distance right between the lens and then a lot of post work...

I'm with you. It would have been great if they'd made a Dual for the Silver.  Actually, a lot of people, myself included, were hoping that they would do a firmware revision for the 4 Black which would be all that is needed for it to work in the housing. But, as you say, "alas,"  The sad thing about 3D is that, when they rolled it out in 2010-11, they royally *!^%//ed it up!!  They put out a lot of inferior products which weren't ready for prime time and soured the general public on it.  Then, just as it was really starting to get really good, they ran from it as fast as they could and on to the next big thing, 4K.  So, the way I look at it is that we 3D true believers are like lepers, or Rodney Dangerfield- no respect. I don't expect any manufacturer to give us any love or new products for the foreseeable future- with perhaps the exception being very expensive 360 degree cameras for VR devices.  So, we just have to make the best of it.  Fortunately, when used well, things like the Dual really do a pretty good job!  I got my first 3D camera- 35mm Realist- in the early 70s and in the early 90s was using a rail system solo camera medium format lenticular 3D system. The pattern seems to be something new in 3D every 15 or 20 years. Sure would be nice if they'd speed it up a bit. How about 4K 3D camcorders with adjustable IA, timelapse capability, and 3D slomo!! :banana:

 

As for trying to adapt two GPs which aren't synced- genlocked- through the cable, I know several folks who have tried this.  The main reason they had was they wanted a wider IA (interaxial separation between the lenses).  The problem which they all discovered was that no matter what they did, there was always at least 1/2 frame or so difference between the 2 cameras.  When shooting a static subject, this is not a problem, however, when shooting anything in motion, it's a HUGE problem.  They finally gave up and decided to try to adapt the cable to make it a bit longer. They also ran into the problem when they did increase the separation too much, was any near objects looked eye crossingly terrible. Bottom line was another 10mm, or so, was OK but much more than that created issues. I've never had much desire to mess with the IA as I believe that GP did a pretty good job on setting it where it is and, if used well, works just fine for the majority of situations where 3D can be used.


Edited by Barry C, 19 April 2016 - 10:12 AM.


#44 Rockfish 770

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 10:38 PM

Yep, when it comes to stability in the water, its all about weight & mass.  Actually, if you have sufficient mass, the weight is less crucial.  On land, for hand held, weight is definitely important.  That being said, I recall you saying that you don't like to do a lot of work in post.  I would urge you to rethink this and really make friends with your NLE :)  While shooting good content is indeed half the story, effective editing in post along with taking advantage of the amazing tools that are out there, is the other half. For instance, when it comes to stabilization, there is some absolutely AMAZING software out there. While I always try to be as careful as possible with the initial handheld  shooting, its the post software fine tuning which really gets it over the top in many cases. There is a short 3D skiing video on my channel where I was testing the Dual helmet mounted. You can well imagine what the vibrations were like.  I ran the clips through Mercalli V4 Sal which was nothing short of miraculous.  My NLE, Edius, also has a good stabilizer, but sometimes, for the really heavy lifting, Mercalli 4 is the ticket!  It will take a somewhat shaky hand held pan and often turn it smooth as butter. And for vibrations, it just kills  them.  It's available as a stand alone app and also a plugin for Edius.  The advantage to the plugin is that it will process the paired clips, whereas with the stand alone version, you have to run the left and right through separately.  Of course, the main thing to avoid is jerky movements, since there is nothing that will help there. The other trick you can do in post, which can help in addition to stabilization on some clips is applying a bit of slowmo, as that can also help smooth things out. For me, I really love working in post as it gives me projects to do after the shooting is done.  I get really bored when I don't have a project. This summer, besides spending 8 days shooting 3D in Cozumel, I'm planning on at least 4 Yosemite trips for a daytime and nighttime timelapse project.  I'll be quite happy if I can get enough good content for at least a couple of months of post work.  Regarding astro through a telescope, I used to do a bit of it back in the early 90s when I was using the moon composited into some magazine and poster projects I had going, but now its just through the camera lens.
 
On another note, if you get a GP4 Silver for your viewfinder, you will need to make a mounting platform for it. If you decide to go this route, let me know and I'll give you the specs for one which you can have made at your local plastic fab shop. Actually, as I recall, it's a piece of about 1/16th inch thick plastic which is 2" wide and is 2" at the top and 2 3/8" up the back with a 90 degree bend. I also cut a hole in it so I can see the flashing LED. It attaches to the Dual with Velcro and has a Gopro adhesive backed mount on the top. The thing to do is preaim it to coincide with the camera view.  You can do this by using the live view in the phone app. Then, once aimed, tighten the mount nob tight. That way, every time you put it on, you won't have to readjust it.
 
Regarding the A7SII sensor, it really is hard to believe how far we've come. And, I'm with you in wondering where we'll be in 5 years!
 
Regards,
                  Barry

 

Yep, when it comes to stability in the water, its all about weight & mass.  Actually, if you have sufficient mass, the weight is less crucial.  On land, for hand held, weight is definitely important.  That being said, I recall you saying that you don't like to do a lot of work in post.  I would urge you to rethink this and really make friends with your NLE :)  While shooting good content is indeed half the story, effective editing in post along with taking advantage of the amazing tools that are out there, is the other half. For instance, when it comes to stabilization, there is some absolutely AMAZING software out there. While I always try to be as careful as possible with the initial handheld  shooting, its the post software fine tuning which really gets it over the top in many cases. There is a short 3D skiing video on my channel where I was testing the Dual helmet mounted. You can well imagine what the vibrations were like.  I ran the clips through Mercalli V4 Sal which was nothing short of miraculous.  My NLE, Edius, also has a good stabilizer, but sometimes, for the really heavy lifting, Mercalli 4 is the ticket!  It will take a somewhat shaky hand held pan and often turn it smooth as butter. And for vibrations, it just kills  them.  It's available as a stand alone app and also a plugin for Edius.  The advantage to the plugin is that it will process the paired clips, whereas with the stand alone version, you have to run the left and right through separately.  Of course, the main thing to avoid is jerky movements, since there is nothing that will help there. The other trick you can do in post, which can help in addition to stabilization on some clips is applying a bit of slowmo, as that can also help smooth things out. For me, I really love working in post as it gives me projects to do after the shooting is done.  I get really bored when I don't have a project. This summer, besides spending 8 days shooting 3D in Cozumel, I'm planning on at least 4 Yosemite trips for a daytime and nighttime timelapse project.  I'll be quite happy if I can get enough good content for at least a couple of months of post work.  Regarding astro through a telescope, I used to do a bit of it back in the early 90s when I was using the moon composited into some magazine and poster projects I had going, but now its just through the camera lens.
 
On another note, if you get a GP4 Silver for your viewfinder, you will need to make a mounting platform for it. If you decide to go this route, let me know and I'll give you the specs for one which you can have made at your local plastic fab shop. Actually, as I recall, it's a piece of about 1/16th inch thick plastic which is 2" wide and is 2" at the top and 2 3/8" up the back with a 90 degree bend. I also cut a hole in it so I can see the flashing LED. It attaches to the Dual with Velcro and has a Gopro adhesive backed mount on the top. The thing to do is preaim it to coincide with the camera view.  You can do this by using the live view in the phone app. Then, once aimed, tighten the mount nob tight. That way, every time you put it on, you won't have to readjust it.
 
Regarding the A7SII sensor, it really is hard to believe how far we've come. And, I'm with you in wondering where we'll be in 5 years!
 
Regards,
                  Barry

 

Hi Barry: Yes I know at times I should be more active editing, I usually just color correct to the best of my abilities and to the ambience of what time of day I shot the video. I never try to get total white balance right on........... if Im shooting in the late afternoon or early morning, its kind of like wiping out a great sunset photo. I used to really have to slave over color correction when I shot Sonys with a Red filter and getting crummy white balance. The Panasonic HMC-sdt750 I use now gets outstanding WB all the way down to 75ft with good viz and light and NO red filter with a F1.5 lens and shoots vivid  sharp1080P60 !! So now  I do a lot less. I also correct for Contrast and Brightness giving just a nudge positive (.07 )for contrast and  (.05) negative for brightness in Sony Vegas Pro, that makes the video really pop, I usually shoot a tad over exposure so that I can pull out the shadow areas if needed. Thanks for explaining about the Mercalli 4, I will probably buy it I have jumpy 3D footage from the Gopros, probably will, I saw they have the Plugin for Edius and Vegas and also the standalone.Thats a neat trick about applying a bit of SloMo to smooth out the video also, I will have to try it, thanks for the tip!!  Im going to try the 3d housing with a viewfinder to begin with and if thats a flop maybe go to GoPro Silver 4  after the next dive trip...............not even sure where we are going yet for the next dive trip and much less for the one after !!! Thats great that you are doing so many different types of photography, you really have varied interests. I shot UW photography for about 15 years and then got into video the last 6 years to capture the Few remaining good reefs that are still there before everything gets turned into GREAT MACRO DIVESITES!!!!! Thanks for being so generous as to offering me your plans of the Silver camera adaptation that you have fabricated, thats rare that you find someone that takes as much time as you have to help others, especially is such an in-depth way as you have. Cheers, Steve N.



#45 hellhole

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 12:30 AM

Yep, when it comes to stability in the water, its all about weight & mass.  Actually, if you have sufficient mass, the weight is less crucial.  On land, for hand held, weight is definitely important.  That being said, I recall you saying that you don't like to do a lot of work in post.  I would urge you to rethink this and really make friends with your NLE :)  While shooting good content is indeed half the story, effective editing in post along with taking advantage of the amazing tools that are out there, is the other half. For instance, when it comes to stabilization, there is some absolutely AMAZING software out there. While I always try to be as careful as possible with the initial handheld  shooting, its the post software fine tuning which really gets it over the top in many cases. There is a short 3D skiing video on my channel where I was testing the Dual helmet mounted. You can well imagine what the vibrations were like.  I ran the clips through Mercalli V4 Sal which was nothing short of miraculous.  My NLE, Edius, also has a good stabilizer, but sometimes, for the really heavy lifting, Mercalli 4 is the ticket!  It will take a somewhat shaky hand held pan and often turn it smooth as butter. And for vibrations, it just kills  them.  It's available as a stand alone app and also a plugin for Edius.  The advantage to the plugin is that it will process the paired clips, whereas with the stand alone version, you have to run the left and right through separately.  Of course, the main thing to avoid is jerky movements, since there is nothing that will help there. The other trick you can do in post, which can help in addition to stabilization on some clips is applying a bit of slowmo, as that can also help smooth things out. For me, I really love working in post as it gives me projects to do after the shooting is done.  I get really bored when I don't have a project. This summer, besides spending 8 days shooting 3D in Cozumel, I'm planning on at least 4 Yosemite trips for a daytime and nighttime timelapse project.  I'll be quite happy if I can get enough good content for at least a couple of months of post work.  Regarding astro through a telescope, I used to do a bit of it back in the early 90s when I was using the moon composited into some magazine and poster projects I had going, but now its just through the camera lens.
 
On another note, if you get a GP4 Silver for your viewfinder, you will need to make a mounting platform for it. If you decide to go this route, let me know and I'll give you the specs for one which you can have made at your local plastic fab shop. Actually, as I recall, it's a piece of about 1/16th inch thick plastic which is 2" wide and is 2" at the top and 2 3/8" up the back with a 90 degree bend. I also cut a hole in it so I can see the flashing LED. It attaches to the Dual with Velcro and has a Gopro adhesive backed mount on the top. The thing to do is preaim it to coincide with the camera view.  You can do this by using the live view in the phone app. Then, once aimed, tighten the mount nob tight. That way, every time you put it on, you won't have to readjust it.
 
Regarding the A7SII sensor, it really is hard to believe how far we've come. And, I'm with you in wondering where we'll be in 5 years!
 
Regards,
                  Barry

Hey Barry.
Can I take you up on your idea sharing of a mount to add a hero 4 silver to the dual housing. I got a 3d printer and thought that might do the trick.

Edited by hellhole, 10 July 2016 - 07:10 AM.


#46 Barry C

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 08:27 AM

Hey Barry.
Can I take you up on your idea sharing of a mount to add a hero 4 silver to the dual housing. I got a 3d printer and thought that might do the trick.

Go for it!  Just one slight correction on the dimensions I previously provided.  It is actually 2 inches wide x 2 1/4 inches up the back x 2 inches over the top with a 90 degree bend between the back and the top.  The 2" at the top is perfect for placing a Gopro adhesive mount which will allow for the adjustment of the GP4 Silver's viewfinder to coincide with the view from your GP Dual.  After you make it, just go to Home Depot or elsewhere and buy some wide Velcro to put on the inside of your mount and the backside of the Dual. I also put a couple of small Velcro tabs on the top as well, for further stability.



#47 hellhole

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 06:04 PM

Hm..... Any pictures?

#48 Barry C

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 07:14 PM

Here are a couple pictures. The camera is currently in an open frame but can be just as easily put in an underwater housing on the mount. The back inside has Velcro which attaches to the corresponding piece on the back of the Dual.  The hole in the back is so that I can see the flashing LED which is on when the camera is filming.

Attached Files



#49 hellhole

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 07:35 PM

Ah... I get it...
Mounted in top of the dual... When I need to remove the cameras from dual... I take it off with the Velcro attached...

Okay. I will some measurements... I intend to mount the whole thing on a tray.. Maybe I find another way of doing it...

Edited by hellhole, 10 July 2016 - 07:37 PM.


#50 Barry C

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 08:11 PM

Also keep in mind, as I mentioned in a previous post, I would strongly recommend a stabilization solution and not just using the Dual stand alone without a stabilizer of some kind.

#51 hellhole

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Posted 18 July 2016 - 01:48 AM

Yes. I got a tray and that should sort out the stability.

I got a question... I have designed the bracket that will allow me to put a hero 4 silver on top.. But my question is to which gopro should I align the H4 silver to.. The main dual Camera on the right or between the two dual Camera?

#52 Barry C

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 04:46 AM

I don't think it matters, unless you're into extreme macro. I just align to either one and it works out fine.

#53 Barry C

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 05:05 AM

I'm leaving Cozumel today after 7 days of diving. Somehow- not sure how or why- I got water in one of my 2 Dual housings. Miraculously, one of the cameras survived but one did not. I generally shoot with one Dual set to medium FOV and the other wide. Givin the choice with only one housing, I'll shoot medium, unless I'm doing wrecks. Then wide is preferable. Shooting medium FOV at 2.7K allows easy cropping to narrow while still maintaining true 1080 res. Last year, I had Protune at raw WB but still used GP color setting. This year, color is also set to flat. Much better workflow, IMO. WAY BETTER control in post for adjusting color combined with increased dynamic range. Furthermore, there is clearly less hassle with compensating for the purplish water that can sometimes come from the red filter. In fact, just making some preliminary adjustments on my laptop, this issue now seems to be nonexistant. So, from now on, color will always be set to flat in Protune along with the raw WB.

#54 hellhole

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Posted 21 July 2016 - 02:27 AM

Here is my setup... 76bf377cdd8d91eac05cebf44c67906f.jpg

3a57917ebdc5fb37f740b14d066665d8.jpg

#55 Barry C

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Posted 21 July 2016 - 06:29 AM

Looks good!

#56 Rockfish 770

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 03:07 PM

 Barry: How did your Cozumel footage turn out? I'm really sorry to hear that you have had bad luck with one of your housings......the ever present risk of UW housings!!! Ive lost one sony video camera and had a couple of minor floods in Nikonos that I was able to save with fresh water and hair driers, super Lucky!!!!



#57 Barry C

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Posted 23 September 2016 - 07:53 AM

Barry: How did your Cozumel footage turn out? I'm really sorry to hear that you have had bad luck with one of your housings......the ever present risk of UW housings!!! Ive lost one sony video camera and had a couple of minor floods in Nikonos that I was able to save with fresh water and hair driers, super Lucky!!!!

Other than the camera issue, all went really well. I think I got some of the best 3D footage on this trip I've ever taken. Conditions were great and great scenery and fish were abundant. Some years, I've really had to sift through the clips and do a lot of post processing to come up with enough good content for a 15 minute film. This year may be exactly the opposite. Just so much great 3D material to work with. There may be enough for two films.

I'm hoping to be able to start on it in the next couple of weeks. For the last month, I've been spending almost 6 hours a day in the post faze of the timelapse & 4K Yosemite & high Sierra project I started filming last March and just finished filming last month. Hope to have it done and on YouTube by the end of next week. Then, after a few days break, it will be time to start on the Cozumel project.

I like to have everything finished by the start of ski season!

Did you have a chance to try out your new rig yet? If so, how did it work out?

#58 Barry C

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Posted 16 October 2016 - 02:54 PM

Here is this year's Cozumel 3D video which I just completed editing. All but about 30 seconds of this approx. 15 minute film was shot with the Gopro Dual Hero. This year I shot it with the Protune color setting at flat in addition to the RAW white balance setting I used last year. I couldn't be happier.  The flexibility I had in post with color management was a real joy!