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SubSee Adapters?


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#1 Cal

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 06:36 PM

Hey guys

I've been doing a bit of searching on these Subsee adapters.

http://www.uwphotogr...diopters-subsee

Has anyone used one? if so, can they give some feed back please?

Cheers

Cal
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#2 elbuzo

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 08:01 PM

Hey guys

I've been doing a bit of searching on these Subsee adapters.

http://www.uwphotogr...diopters-subsee

Has anyone used one? if so, can they give some feed back please?

Cheers

Cal



They look very compact and light . I'm using a macromate but a friend of mine just ordered one Subsee, so i will be able to tell you next week .

Regards

#3 scubamarli

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 09:25 PM

I have heard great things so far from a friend that has been using one. I would love to hear about performance in darker conditions. I am concerned about having to use manual focus, which frankly I hate. :good:
I will probably be ordering one for Lembeh. It probably isn't suitable for use with less than a 90mm due to focusing distance to subject issues.

Cheers,
Marli

Edited by scubamarli, 14 April 2009 - 09:26 PM.

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#4 meister

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 11:42 PM

Do a search and you'll find a couple of threads I'm aware of, one here on Wetpixel and another on Digitaldiver.net.
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#5 Alex_Mustard

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 12:13 AM

I want to try one of those - I have heard that they are good, but always like to prove things to myself.

That's a nice site, BTW.

Alex

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#6 Mariozi

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 01:03 AM

They are very nice!!!
I got one, will try it out on the sea later this month.
Posted Image
It is VERY well finished and very compact.
I heard ReefNet Inc. changed the design a little bit to accommodate a wider range of lenses.

Posted Image
On my Nikkor 105mm/2.8D it gives 2.1:1 both on land or uw (tested in the tub :good:)

This is all n my SuperMacro pages
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#7 AllisonFinch

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 11:37 AM

Hmmmm looks like a lot of focus loss top and bottom.

I heard an explanation of narrow depth of field, but that is a flat surface!

Edited by AllisonFinch, 15 April 2009 - 11:40 AM.


#8 craig

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 11:57 AM

It's not necessarily depth of field, but I agree the edges are soft and that's disappointing for a DX sensor camera.
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#9 SlipperyDick

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 02:26 PM

@AllisonFinch - The left and right edges of Mariozi's photo are in focus, meaning the ruler must have been slightly angled, putting the top and bottom out of the plane of focus. If taken straight-on, the entire field of view would've been in focus.

@Craig - There actually shouldn't be any edge softening at all with this achromat, especially at maximum magnification. BTW - GREAT shots from the indo trip! Looks like it was very productive!!

@Mariozi - Still looking forward to seeing some of your results...stay in touch!

@Alex - Rand, Todd, and Jamie will probably all have SubSees with them in Hardy come September, so I'm sure you can do some arm twisting to get to play with one :good:


Kudos to Scott Gietler for putting together his new site. There's a ton of great info there.
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#10 yahsemtough

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 02:28 PM

Ahh nevermind Keri just answered the question... typing the same time as I did.

Share with Alex. I suppose one of the Nikon shooters could lend him. :good: I will gladly share.

Cheers

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#11 sgietler

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 03:42 PM

Keri, Alex - thanks for the nice feedback on the site.

I just did a couple more tests on a card on my table, which was flatter than the ruler I used in the pool tests.

Even with a perfectly flat surface, It wasn't easy getting the entire frame in focus at 2:1 magnification, either due to the small depth of field or my own jitteriness. It was difficult to hold my rig perfectly parallel, and at the correct distance.

Here's one of my better attempts, at F25

Posted Image

Edited by sgietler, 15 April 2009 - 03:47 PM.


#12 craig

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 03:50 PM

@Craig - There actually shouldn't be any edge softening at all with this achromat, especially at maximum magnification.

People have these problems with wet diopters so I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss a flawed example image as user error. I'm curious what the aperture used is.

P.S. After seeing the second sample which is also flawed but in a different way, the flaws need more explanation. What are apertures used in these test shots? At a true magnification of less than 1.5:1, DOF shouldn't be so bad as to make a flat image test shot impossible.
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#13 sgietler

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 05:42 PM

Craig, You made some good points.

I just redid my test a little more carefully, try to make sure there was no "user error", at the same aperture, F25, at a magnification of 2:1. I shot a different subject, resting my housing on a table so it could be perfectly still.

Posted Image

#14 craig

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 05:55 PM

I still see edge softness and CA. I'd like to see one at f/11 instead of f/25. Much harder to shoot without a tripod or copy stand though.
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#15 craig

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 07:00 PM

Here's a pic of some text on a pamphlet. F/11, 1/320, D300, Sigma 150, Hoya +3 achromat. It's about 1.8:1. Sigma needs a bit more for 2:1. Working distance is 5".

japantext.jpg

I made no special effort to shoot the paper completely flat and it is not. As you can see, there is no particular problem getting sharp corners and f/11 is adequate for DOF.
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#16 sgietler

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 07:45 PM

Keri suggested I will get better results out of the water by flipping the diopter. The results look a little better with the diopter flipped.


I shot at F11, and your right, I had no problem getting adequate DOF.

Posted Image

#17 craig

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 08:36 PM

That's better.

On my recent trip there were several trying these out and it was clear that diopter orientation was important. Trouble was that they were mislabeled. Since I didn't try one myself I can't comment. The concern was edge softness so that's why it's important to see it working right. It would be nice to see an example with full frame.
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#18 TomR1

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Posted 15 April 2009 - 09:08 PM

I have one of these. I had it on my Nikon Af-105-VR for 3 diving days in Tulamben and 10 diving days in Wakatobi.

The device was very difficult for me to use and will take considerable practice for me. If you get it right it will take an awesome shot. However, on a wall where it is uncool to grab hold I found getting a focus lock very difficult. Then too, one needs a VERY small subject to want to magnify a 105 past 1:1.

I found that using a light was critical for focus and that proper positioning of the strobes so the camera could see the preflash equally importent. I used autofocus. I also experimented with release priority and focus priority for the shutter release. In my pool at home release priority was fine but in the ocean I needed focus priority because the depth of field was so shallow that shots I thought were in focus were not. (My eyes are not good enough to make a decision using the camera's viewer.) Jeff Mullins told me he gets 1 of 10 in focus using an E-330/50mm.

I did get some shots but nothing worth posting much less framing.

This nudi was shot at F/32 1/160.

I'll try to find some more.

TomR1

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#19 Mariozi

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 04:16 AM

Hmmmm looks like a lot of focus loss top and bottom.


Don't overthink it, I don't even remember the aperture used, I had to check it.
It was at f/11... that would have given me 0.6mm of DoF
I just shot that to check the reproduction ratio...
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#20 craig

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Posted 16 April 2009 - 12:14 PM

Don't overthink it, I don't even remember the aperture used, I had to check it.
It was at f/11... that would have given me 0.6mm of DoF
I just shot that to check the reproduction ratio...

Don't underthink this either. It's important to know that the device is capable of sharp results. Your image showed it is capable of 2:1 apparent on a DX camera but it did not show a sharp result edge-to-edge. If could be a DOF issue but we shouldn't accept things that aren't demonstrated.

Does that 0.6mm DOF calculation take into account the CoC appropriate to a 400px wide final image you provided? I think not. If you accept a CoC of 60 microns (24mm/400px or 1 pixel) then my calculation shows 1.62mm of DOF at 1.4x actual magnification. That's enough for the ruler to be in focus.
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