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Are video people smarter than stills people?


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#41 TheRealDrew

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 11:07 AM

Canada - which state is that in again ?


The one that likes hockey the most.

#42 loftus

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 11:09 AM

:D
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#43 PRC

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 11:11 AM

Ha - that's fair enough!

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#44 Poliwog

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 12:14 PM

Canada - which state is that in again ?


Ahem... Up here they are known as Provinces or Territories -- 10 provinces and 3 territories, we could divvy them all up into fifty different little parcels but we don't want to support all that redundant bureaucracy. :D

But it's O.K. to call them states, we got used to our American neighbours calling them that a long time ago. ;)

Oh, and if you do come for a visit, please remember not to bring your downhill skis across the border during the months of April through to November as we will not have any snow for you to play in. :P :D :)

Edited by Poliwog, 30 November 2010 - 12:31 PM.

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#45 PRC

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 12:37 PM

Ah Canada - I remember now - back in April I nearly got stuck there - was trying to enter the USA - for some daft reason. Canadian boarder guard was asking why I was overstaying / missing my return flight - my reply was that it was all due to a volcano in Iceland that had closed European airspace, the reply will remain etched in my memory - "I ain't heard about no volcano - where is Iceland anyhow?"

Given the weather here I may need my downhill ski's myself here shortly.

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#46 ronscuba

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 01:03 PM

Photography vs. Videography = Art vs. Entertainment ?


The typical videographer is trying to sell footage but also spends time editing and producing videos. I think the big difference btw photo and video is the video editing. Cutting footage, soundtrack, dialog, synchronizing the footage with the audio. All to make the finished product watchable, entertaining or educational.

#47 DeanB

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 02:58 PM

Photography vs. Videography = Art vs. Entertainment ?


The typical videographer is trying to sell footage but also spends time editing and producing videos. I think the big difference btw photo and video is the video editing. Cutting footage, soundtrack, dialog, synchronizing the footage with the audio. All to make the finished product watchable, entertaining or educational.



Maybe to you Ron but Why is a still pic 'art' and a moving image not?... Also you can be a great editor however given a load of rubbish to cut will make your job a lot more difficult. Personally I try to shoot with the constructive thought of a 'still' image that comes to life. So in a way I try to be a videographer with the creativeness of a stills shooter. Producing excellent footage is the hardest part without that you have no film... Being a shooter with the mind of an editor is another talent...

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#48 ronscuba

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 04:00 PM

Hey Dean. I posted it as a question for discussion. Not saying I agree or disagree. I think the question is interesting. We've all seen photos displayed as art, but moving images ?

I do think it takes a lot of time, effort and talent for a single person to shoot and edit an entertaining video. Add in the different tastes in music, editing style, genre, etc.. It's easy to see how and why video might not be regarded as art. Maybe viewers have seen so many bad youtube videos they are jaded against the possibility of video being artistic ?

#49 Pfuller

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 04:22 PM

As I follow some of the threads on the video forum, I am lead to believe that video people are smarter than stills people, and folks doing VDSLR are stills people trying to be smart.
Anyone have any thoughts on this? ;)


The only way to solve this debate, is for people to enter a photo or video that demonstrates why their artform is better than the other :D

#50 photovan

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 04:38 PM

A piece of created work is Art if the artist says it is... and people either agree, or not.

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#51 TomR1

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 06:04 PM

Now look, intelligence and the ability to do art are unrelated. For example, I am undoubtedly the smartest person on this form but......Oh wait......I'm the best photographer also.

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#52 dw-dan

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 08:05 PM

Cinematography (from Greek: kinema - κίνημα "movement" and graphein - γράφειν "to record"), is the making of lighting and camera choices when recording photographic images for the cinema. It is closely related to the art of still photography. Many additional issues arise when both the camera and elements of the scene may be in motion, though this also greatly increases the creative possibilities of the process.

Why all those photographers do slideshows or galleries so that people can sea multiple images ? :D
Why all those videographers love freezing to a still image when they get a perfect shot ? ;)

The definition said it all : videographers have (or should have) a greater creativity, that's all ...
:P

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#53 photovan

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 10:32 PM

but, the "videographer" conjures up the thought of a technician that has capability to handle all aspects of the production with varying levels of expertise in all the ares... director, camera operator, audio technician, lighting specialist, gaffer, editor ... Jack of all trades?

"Cinematographer" is the more appropriate term for the visual artist that captures their subject in motion pictures.. and concentrates on that --although I'm sure some (if not many?) cinematographers have a command, in varying degrees, of the other disciplines too.

As for the smarts... in this crossover period we seem to be going through I think;

the talented and smart photographers will work on tuning their skills to become good cinematographers, and pick-up the necessary bits of the other stuff they need as they go along..

And the smart videographers will add stills to their long list of tools/abilities.

Most videographers in the past didn't have access to the tools/options needed to create the cinematic look as they do now with big sensor capture devices like viDslrs. I've recently seen some great examples of how the more visually creative of those videographers, are really shining once they get their hands on lens/sensor combos that give them options. But mostly they shoot blurry stills :D

And while photographic prints can still be lasting, cinema is still transitory... (but I do like it) :0

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#54 DeanB

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 11:46 PM

folks doing VDSLR are stills people trying to be smart.



Just look at the video forum stills guys are buying DSLR's with video capabilities by the truck load! and only a few vid guys are swapping to VIDslr?...

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#55 photovan

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 12:15 AM

Just look at the video forum stills guys are buying DSLR's with video capabilities by the truck load! and only a few vid guys are swapping to VIDslr?...

Dive safe

DeanB


probably just the smart video
guys :D

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#56 DeanB

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 12:45 AM

probably just the smart video
guys :P


:D or the rich ones ;)

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#57 John Bantin

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 02:06 AM

I have now devised a reply to this deeply philosophical question.

A still photograph is a moment in time, frozen in perpetuity.

A video is a sequence of events joined together to represent an event that never happened.

I have made a few worthy films in my time but none were longer than 30 seconds. They each had a middle, a beginning and an end. I won a few awards including in New York. The cardinal rule of all professional film makers was never to show your rushes.

Why do people with video cameras insist on showing raw uncut footage? If they were intelligent they would only show the finished production. That is; with a beginning, a middle and an end.

Ergo - it is more intelligent to shoot snaps underwater than to be a video bore.

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#58 DeanB

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 02:31 AM

I have now devised a reply to this deeply philosophical question.

A still photograph is a moment in time, frozen in perpetuity.

A video is a sequence of events joined together to represent an event that never happened.

I have made a few worthy films in my time but none were longer than 30 seconds. They each had a middle, a beginning and an end. I won a few awards including in New York. The cardinal rule of all professional film makers was never to show your rushes.

Why do people with video cameras insist on showing raw uncut footage? If they were intelligent they would only show the finished production. That is; with a beginning, a middle and an end.

Ergo - it is more intelligent to shoot snaps underwater than to be a video bore.


I know many stills people that shoot hundreds of images to get one 'good one' I have seen/heard lots of "I should have been quicker with the shutter on this one" and " I took this on auto that's why the W/B isn't brilliant" and also "Here are a few of my holiday pics from the Red Sea, they aren't brilliant as they were taken on my P&S as my DSLR is being fixed" so you sit through a few crap ones... You are right, personally I never show bad sequences to clients or even family and a good stills shooter will only show 'The few' good images out of, maybe, hundreds. I find it's either the excited New camera owner or amateur in both fields that tends to show nearly everything.

It is more viewer friendly to show a great film than a hundred dreary still images.

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#59 John Bantin

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 04:28 AM

I know many stills people that shoot hundreds of images to get one 'good one' I have seen/heard lots of "I should have been quicker with the shutter on this one" and " I took this on auto that's why the W/B isn't brilliant" and also "Here are a few of my holiday pics from the Red Sea, they aren't brilliant as they were taken on my P&S as my DSLR is being fixed" so you sit through a few crap ones... You are right, personally I never show bad sequences to clients or even family and a good stills shooter will only show 'The few' good images out of, maybe, hundreds. I find it's either the excited New camera owner or amateur in both fields that tends to show nearly everything.

It is more viewer friendly to show a great film than a hundred dreary still images.

Dive safe

DeanB


I should have added that if you shoot hundreds of still shots of the same subject, on average you will get hundreds of average shots. :D

I buy my own photographic kit. Diving equipment manufacturers and diving services suppliers get even-handed treatment from me whether they choose to advertise in the publications I write for or not. All the equipment I get on loan is returned as soon as it is finished with. Did you know you can now get Diver Mag as an iPad/Android app?

 

#60 PRC

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 04:35 AM

if you shoot hundreds of still shots of the same subject, on average you will get hundreds of average shots.


Ok, so we have tried philosophy and now we are onto math - think the above probably just proves 1 = 1 (on average) John :D

Maybe it is that all of the truly 'smart' ones are staying out of this topic completely - thus we are a self selecting group and statistically invalid by our own inclusion.

Paul C

Edited by PRC, 01 December 2010 - 04:37 AM.

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