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D850 vs 5DM4??


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#1 Squalo305

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Posted 02 April 2018 - 02:33 PM

Looking to buy new camera, any thoughts on this?? I am not looking that much into video, mainly stills. Macro and wide angle.
Thank you!

#2 Undertow

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Posted 03 April 2018 - 05:23 PM

Either will be fantastic. Mostly people will make subjective suggestions depending what they shoot. Brand-wise I've spent time shooting both and always preferred Nikon - I find both their ergonomics and lenses to be better. But it's splitting hairs. Most pros shoot one or the other. 

 

Generally considered Canon better for video and Nikon better for stills. 

 

Out of curiosity I checked DXO Mark and the 5DMkIV did surprisingly well considering Nikons have been mostly slaughtering Canons in the technical measurement realm for the past few years. Its the top scoring Canon but Nikon's D600/610/750/800/810/850 all outscored it.

 

Not that it's really significant when it comes to actually shooting images. 

 

You can't go wrong with either. 

 

I also tell people now that unless the know for sure they want a DSLR, they should go mirrorless. They've come such a long way and the quality gap is realistically minimal. The small size translates to much smaller UW rigs. DSLR rigs are huge and heavy and a pain-in-the-ass. 

 

Cheers,

 

Chris



#3 Squalo305

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Posted 04 April 2018 - 06:27 PM

Thank you Undertow for your reaponse! I just decided to go for D850!! Can you recommend me the best WA rectilinear lens for that camera? I know some nikon shoters say that some are not that sharp for that kind of resolution, so it would be great to have some advice, I was looking into the 16-35 but some say 14-24 is way better, and wich size of some will be better for it? Thank You!
Dome* sorry

#4 Land & Sea

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Posted 04 April 2018 - 07:36 PM

My understanding is that the Nikon 16-35mm f/4 does better underwater than the Nikon 14-24mm f/2.8.  I can't remember the specifics but it has to do with distortion caused by shooting through water.  Apparently, the 16-35mm does a better job handling the distortion and focusing.  Better and more precise info can be found doing a google search.  Best of luck!  


Edited by Land & Sea, 04 April 2018 - 07:38 PM.


#5 Squalo305

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Posted 04 April 2018 - 07:46 PM

Thank You Land & Sea Ill try to look for more reviews on that lense in google and wait to see if anyone here has some experience with them to get more info. Thank you!

#6 Undertow

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Posted 05 April 2018 - 08:31 AM

There's been a couple threads recently about best wide lenses for D850. Granted some people believe the 'extra' resolution seems to change the game on what wide lenses are appropriate, which to me is a bit silly. We've had some debate on the topic. Granted I don't do tests, I just shoot a lot, currently the D810 UW (website link below). 

 

Definitely the 16-35mm over the 14-24mm (its usable but people struggle with it), but you need to pair it with a large dome, at least 8"/200mm but preferably 9"/230mm+, and shoot it carefully as soft corners can be a real issue with non-fisheye lenses UW. 

 

The simplest option is to use a fisheye as they do perform better optically UW and can be used with smaller domes. I believe the best option is the Nikon 8-15mm or alternatively the Sigma 15mm (the Nikon 16mm is sharper but has poor close focusing and generally not used). 

 

There is another interesting new option, the Nauticam WACP. Its a port built as an optical lens and is paired with a midrange zoom (I think 28-70mm lens) but offers a superwide angle of view with fantastic optical performance. 

 

Search these forums or call a knowledgable UW photo store like Backscatter, Reef Photo, Bluewater Photo etc. They are generally very helpful. 

 

Again I'd reiterate that mirrorless cameras are serious contenders and the UW rigs are far easier to handle. Also I'd consider the D500, its an amazing camera. I've shot it alongside my D810 and its absolutely in the same league. There have been recent threads about D850 vs D500 for UW. 

 

Cheers,

 

Chris


Edited by Undertow, 05 April 2018 - 08:49 AM.


#7 Squalo305

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Posted 05 April 2018 - 01:05 PM

Thank you Undertow, I just bought the D850! I also looked into mirrorles cameras but I do preffer a DSLR. Ok I understand the issue with the le ses and Ill look into that 28-70 option, but seems that the 16-35 is the way to go! For the 8-15 fisheye which dome do you think will be best, I know there are smaller domes for fisheyes but some divers use a big dome with it.
Thank You!

#8 Undertow

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Posted 05 April 2018 - 05:40 PM

Congrats on your purchase. A new camera is always exciting. 

 

You can definitely use a big dome with fisheyes, in fact for any wide angle bigger is virtually always better optically. Big domes however are cumbersome and heavy. Smaller domes are easier to carry and work with, especially for CFWA (close focus wide angle) where a big dome interferes with the ability to light a close subject properly. 

 

Swimming with a 9" dome is challenging, much more so than a macro port. Its a lot to push through the water. Fin choice and dive skills become very important. 

 

Regarding specific domes for a fisheye, I can't say. Best to consult the housing manufacturer or UW camera shop or search through these forums. 

 

Cheers,

 

Chris



#9 Squalo305

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Posted 05 April 2018 - 08:11 PM

Thank you! Really appreciate it!

#10 Land & Sea

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Posted 06 April 2018 - 05:25 PM

My vote would be for full frame vs crop sensor.  I owned the D500 and it is a nice camera, but it doesn't have the same image quality as a full frame camera.  The crop sensor can be useful for certain applications, but with the massive image size given by the D850, cropping will provide similar perspective with increased image quality.  Besides cost, since size difference is negligible, there are not many instances where "added reach" would be a tremendous benefit underwater besides potentially for macro applications.  I would always prefer the native full frame field of view along with their respective high aperture lenses.



#11 Squalo305

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Posted 06 April 2018 - 08:27 PM

I agree Land & Sea, thank you
Different question, is nauticam the way to go for the housing? Or any other brand like subal, aquatica or sea and sea?

#12 TimG

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 11:00 AM

I agree Land & Sea, thank you
Different question, is nauticam the way to go for the housing? Or any other brand like subal, aquatica or sea and sea?

 

I'd suggest that once you get into the high-end housings, personal choice becomes a major factor. What feels right to the user? Nauticam, Subal, Aquatica - they're all good. I've used Subal since 1999 and think they're brilliant!


Tim
(PADI IDC Staff Instructor and former Dive Manager, KBR Lembeh Straits)
Nikon D500, Nikkors 105mm and 8-15mm, Tokina 10-17mm,  Subal housing

http://www.timsimages.uk
Latest images: http://www.shutterst...lery_id=1940957


#13 Squalo305

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 11:59 AM

Subal is 1kg lighter than nauticam and it has a top window, I believe ergonomics on both are amazing. Is there a big difference in port prices?

#14 Undertow

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 12:20 PM

All the major high end brands seem to make excellent quality housings. Consider not only the housings, but the extras like ports, extension rings, zoom gears, viewfinders. Also they need to be sent somewhere for service from time to time and its not cheap.

 

Personally I chose Aquatica many years ago partly as they seemed the most reasonable cost-wise of the high end housings. Been very happy with them, they're built like a tank. They've improved dramatically over the years and my latest D810 housing has absolutely brilliant ergonomics, beyond what I ever expected from a housing. 

 

I wouldn't be too fussed about a top window - my old housings had them but I found it very hard to actually see the LCD, like peering into a cave from outside. I'm happy its gone on my D810 housing as the space is used for more ergonomic top controls. Now its all about using the "Info" button and viewing shooting info on the rear LCD. Much better. 



#15 Squalo305

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 06:05 AM

Thank you Undertow! And yes all major brands make great quality housings, but its a tough decision when you have to make that investment, you get married to one brand, I just want insight to make the best choice for me. Just bought the new camera I want a great hoysing that can survive a lifetime with my camera and dont worry about changing my equipment soon.

#16 trimix125

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 12:12 PM

Hi,
a top window / lcd is easy to view with a Nikon camera, as you just have to pull back the power on / of switch to lighten up the display...
What i only do when diving at night, deep or in a cave. Otherwise reading is no problem.

For finding out which brand is the right one, there are some points like ergonomics, price of the setup, service possibilities, spares....
And often as well, a shop or dealer who helps you when needed...
The "best" housing is useless, when an order for an needed part will take longer than you have time...

A lot of companies is offering port adaptors, so changing the brand is easy. But then ist harder to find out the right port extensions...

Regards,
Wolfgang



#17 Squalo305

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 08:23 PM

You are right Wolfgang, thank you for your advice