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new seacam flash for nikon and canon


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#21 UWphotoNewbie

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Posted 31 October 2005 - 01:16 PM

Sounds like a sweet strobe. Fantstic to hear that the manufactuers are starting to cross the TTL devide. Also nice to see some higher powered digital strobes are in the offing.

Alex, love to see some photos if you have them.

Interesting the different tact that manufactuers are taking to deal with iTTL/eTTL.

With seacam it looks like they are building specific models for each system to be compatable with all housings (with the right connector)

With Ikelite they are building strobes to be compatable with all cameras and only compatable with their housings that control the TTL conversion.

Any bets what Sea and Sea will do?

But at 1600 eu each! Wow, I think I'll wait to see Ikelite's DS200. I can't see how that would be more than $1000, probably $900. And the recycle time seems like a bummer. I wonder what Ikelite will do?

With DS-125, I pretty much use only full power and occasionally 1/2 power most of the time. If I only need 1/2 power or 1/4 power most of the time with the Seacam when shooting say F18-F22 for macro, that would be very tempting.


I would love to see how this could improve my wide angle. I don't however see how you could say that the DS-125 is underpowered for macro if the strobes are aimed properly. Even at small apertures the thing dumps out more light than you need, and two is overkill. But of course every man wants more power. A DS-500 would be just about right for me. :lol:

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#22 james

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Posted 31 October 2005 - 01:33 PM

For macro, a strobe needs to dump a lot of light into a small area, thus making a small bright area... (no duh, eh?)

The DS125 and SS200 dump a lot of light into a BIG area, because they have round flashtubes and a wide reflector behind. So the area that you are photographing with your macro lens may actually be dimmer when using a SS200 than when using a DS50.

Seems weird eh? But it makes sense. It took me a while to understand this one too - but I've tried it, and it's true.

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#23 ssra30

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Posted 31 October 2005 - 03:02 PM

So it will also be possible to shoot one in ttl and the other one in manual mode .... the strobe everyone seeemed to wait ...... just a precision : 1600 euros for a piece  :lol:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Hmmm... I wonder if that will work. From my experience, SB 800 with iTTL does not play well at all with another manual strobe. I am not sure if it is iTTL fault or Nikon creative lighting system or what but I have a feeling that unless both strobes are iTTL and can communicate with each other, it might not work well together. At 1600 euros, that would cost as much as 2 Ike DS200 (assume that it is the same price as SS200). Hmm....


I would love to see how this could improve my wide angle. I don't however see how you could say that the DS-125 is underpowered for macro if the strobes are aimed properly. Even at small apertures the thing dumps out more light than you need, and two is overkill.

Initially I never thought it was a big deal. With Oly C5050 at F8, I could do 3 dives easily and not have to worry about strobe batteries as I was shooting 1/8 and 1/4 power pretty much all the time with macro.
With dSLR, the main strobe pretty much need to be on full or at least 1/2 power all the time and pretty much full power if I use 2x teleconverter.
Not a big deal when I am on a liveaboard where I can charge the strobe after every dive ( a bit of a pain but doable) but if I am out on a small boat for half or full day, that's when it start to get a bit tricky.

#24 Tom_Kline

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Posted 31 October 2005 - 10:11 PM

Any specs on the wet diopters? Are they achromats, etc. ? :D

To the strobe:
123 manual settings!!! Can someone elaborate?
120 degrees is pretty wide-angle and accounts for the low GN for the w-s of output. I would assume a meter-based GN. It would be way cool if the flashtube could be focused into a narrower beam ala Subsea MK150. This could make the GN go way up.
How much does this puppy weigh! :lol: On land as well as in the sea! <_<

Tom

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Canon EOS-1Ds MkII and MkIII and Nikon D1X, D2X, D2H cameras. Lens focal lengths ranging from 8 to 180mm for UW use. Seacam housings and remote control gear. Seacam 150D and 250D, Sea&Sea YS250, and Inon Z220 strobes.
www.flickr.com/photos/tomkline/

 

 


#25 Alex_Mustard

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 01:15 AM

Steve Jones sent me the pictures last night. So here it is:

Posted Image

The digital display tells you how much light the strobe has just fired. Obviously this is not much use when on manual, but a big help on TTL as you will know how close to full power you are.

Otherwise on the surface it looks very similar to the Subtronics. Flash tubes and switches look the same. But obviously it is very different underneath.

Alex

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#26 Steve Jones

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 03:05 AM

Any specs on the wet diopters? Are they achromats, etc. ?  :D

To the strobe:
123 manual settings!!! Can someone elaborate?
120 degrees is pretty wide-angle and accounts for the low GN for the w-s of output. I would assume a meter-based GN. It would be way cool if the flashtube could be focused into a narrower beam ala Subsea MK150. This could make the GN go way up.
How much does this puppy weigh!  :lol:  On land  as well as in the sea!  <_<

Tom

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


As for the wet diopters they come in 2 strengths, +2 and +4. I didn't ask if they were achromats but Harald did tell me they use very high quality glass. They are so neat and easy to carry. I bought a +2 as a starting point.

As for the manual settings, I didn't ask about the 123 settings so can't confirm that, but you can set the strobe to full, half power etc - or any point in between any power settings - hence (I'm assuming) if you set half way between full and half - you get 3/4 power, set it 3/4 of the way between full and half and you get 7/8's power etc.

As for narrowing the beam on these babies, I use the old fashioned method - a snoot made of a bit of old drainpipe. Using 2 Subtronics I generally get a full extra stop with the snoots on.

As for weight, Seacam flashes are generally neutral or near neutral under water - Paul Kay or Stephen Frink are better to comment on this though, as I've never used them myself (yet :D )

Steve
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#27 StephenFrink

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 06:41 AM

As for weight, Seacam flashes are generally neutral or near neutral under water - Paul Kay or Stephen Frink are better to comment on this though, as I've never used them myself (yet  :lol: )

Steve

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



I haven't tried it yet either Steve, but have one on order of course. I'll let you all know what I think once I give it a thorough test. Meanwhile, here is the Seacam spec sheet:



SEAFLASH 250 digital


FEATURES TECHNICAL DETAILS

• Fully digital electronic, controlled by a fast microcontroller
• Nikon digital i-TTL, Canon digital e-TTL, easy update to a next ttl generation
• Nikon / Canon standard TTL

• Capacity 250 Ws
• Uw-guide number 20 - ISO 100 / 1m at full power
• Coverage angle 120°, precision reflector and corrected dome glass
• 190 flashes at full power
• Recycle time 0,3 – 5 sec.
• Color temperature 4300°K – 5200°K, two selectable flash bulbs
• Manual light level selection in 7 + 5 different steps

• Digital multi function display, fully illuminated with automatic dimming
• Display of power delivered in each shoot
• Underexposure signalled by an audio and a visible alarm
• Ready light external and in the camera display
• Battery status indicator and fully automatic battery charger
• Auto shut off and audible alarm for preserving battery life
• Automatic charger, fully controlled –dV, temp. and time, charging time 100 min.

• Power LED in 3 manual power steps and automatic, continuous burn time 6h
• Slave sensor, high intensive for all manual settings, with/without pilot light
• True SOS signal for approx. 3h
• Synchro socket Nikonos V or S6, charging socket
• High quality Sanyo and easy to replace internal battery pack (service only)
• Lightweight power supply, 110-240V, 12V adapter

• SEACAM silver housing, sea-water resistant aluminium, precision machined
• Macro focusing and protection ring
• Neutrally buoyant
• Dimension L x Ø: 250 x 110 (120) mm, 2100 g, -80m depth rating
Stephen Frink - www.stephenfrinkphoto.com
Publisher - Alert Diver Magazine
Distributor/North America - Seacamusa.com
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#28 bobf

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 07:53 AM

Stephen,

I'll upload this data into the Strobe Finder.

Few questions:

Confirm NiCad battery?
Are diffusers available? Optional? Standard?
Pilot light=Target light?
USD MSRP?

thanks for keeping us informed,
b
oly 4040 and a pair of DS 125's
Inon Macro and an Oly WAL

#29 acroporas

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 08:41 AM

Wow, this sounds like it will be an awsome strobe. BUT can we expect simialr seacam housing:ikelite housng and secam flash:ikelite flash price ratios? If so I think I'll happly make due with ikelites offerings.
William

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#30 UWphotoNewbie

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 09:52 AM

Nikon digital i-TTL, Canon digital e-TTL, easy update to a next ttl generation


God I hope that with Nikon releasing new strobes this week that iTTL is here to stay for a while.

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#31 Alex_Mustard

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 11:40 AM

Unfortunately there are slightly different flavours of Nikon iTTL - and while both the D2X and D70 will both iTTL with the same Nikon flashes they do not use exactly the same protocol. And Seacam have wisely made provisos in case Nikon change it again for the D200.

Alex

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#32 Tom_Kline

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 11:07 PM

As for the wet diopters they come in 2 strengths, +2 and +4.  I didn't ask if they were achromats but Harald did tell me they use very high quality glass.  They are so neat and easy to carry.  I bought a +2 as a starting point.

As for the manual settings, I didn't ask about the 123 settings so can't confirm that, but you can set the strobe to full, half power etc - or any point in between any power settings - hence (I'm assuming) if you set half way between full and half - you get 3/4 power, set it 3/4 of the way between full and half and you get 7/8's power etc.

As for narrowing the beam on these babies, I use the old fashioned method - a snoot made of a bit of old drainpipe.  Using 2 Subtronics I generally get a full extra stop with the snoots on. 

As for weight, Seacam flashes are generally neutral or near neutral under water - Paul Kay or Stephen Frink are better to comment on this though, as I've never used them myself (yet  ;) )

Steve

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Thanks for the added info. I did not think they rounded up empty Coke bottles to melt down to use as optical glass! :) However, it would nice to know how they compared in design to others on the market, which includes achromats. ;)
You description makes it sound like the manual setting is infinitely variable.
I think Steve Frink may have a replacement for you snoot.
I was actually more concern about travel weight ;) but UW is important too :) .
Tom

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Canon EOS-1Ds MkII and MkIII and Nikon D1X, D2X, D2H cameras. Lens focal lengths ranging from 8 to 180mm for UW use. Seacam housings and remote control gear. Seacam 150D and 250D, Sea&Sea YS250, and Inon Z220 strobes.
www.flickr.com/photos/tomkline/

 

 


#33 Tom_Kline

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Posted 01 November 2005 - 11:13 PM

I haven't tried it yet either Steve, but have one on order of course.  I'll let you all know what I think once I give it a thorough test.  Meanwhile, here is the Seacam spec sheet:

 

SEAFLASH 250 digital
FEATURES              TECHNICAL DETAILS

snip
• Manual light level selection in 7 + 5 different steps

snip

• Macro focusing and protection ring

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


7 + 5 = 12 ??? ;)
Could you elaborate on 'macro focusing and protection ring'?
Does this narrow the beam and increase the GN? :)
Thanks
Tom

Thomas C. Kline, Jr., Ph. D.
Oceanography & Limnology
Canon EOS-1Ds MkII and MkIII and Nikon D1X, D2X, D2H cameras. Lens focal lengths ranging from 8 to 180mm for UW use. Seacam housings and remote control gear. Seacam 150D and 250D, Sea&Sea YS250, and Inon Z220 strobes.
www.flickr.com/photos/tomkline/

 

 


#34 AndreSmith

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Posted 02 November 2005 - 09:33 AM

[quote name='StephenFrink' date='Nov 1 2005, 06:41 AM']
I haven't tried it yet either Steve, but have one on order of course. I'll let you all know what I think once I give it a thorough test. Meanwhile, here is the Seacam spec sheet:



SEAFLASH 250 digital
FEATURES TECHNICAL DETAILS

• Synchro socket Nikonos V or S6, charging socket


Does that mean either Nik V or S6 or both??? I presume you will need the S6 to get the iTTL/ETTL functionality or no???
It would be nice to see a picture of the whole strobe to see all the connections

#35 ikelite

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Posted 02 November 2005 - 10:36 PM

Dumb but not stupid strobe & TTL progression strategy:

http://www.ikelite.c...dsttlplans.html

#36 Tom_Kline

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Posted 02 November 2005 - 11:13 PM

Clever to put the adaptation circuitry in the cord. :) I hope it does not make them too expensive! ;)
Tom

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www.flickr.com/photos/tomkline/

 

 


#37 ssra30

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Posted 03 November 2005 - 12:43 AM

Dumb but not stupid strobe & TTL progression strategy: 

http://www.ikelite.c...dsttlplans.html

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Ike, DS200 is already on top of my way too long shoping list and I already pestered my local Ikelite dealer about wanting one already ;)
The iTTL cord will be icing on the cake too :)
I hope it will work with D2X as it is a bit different from D70 iTTL.
Now get the whip out and start making more strobes!

#38 james

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Posted 03 November 2005 - 06:24 AM

Thanks for posting the update Ike. I think putting the conversion circuitry into the cord is a smashing idea!

Cheers
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#39 Paul Kay

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Posted 03 November 2005 - 11:24 AM

"Could you elaborate on 'macro focusing and protection ring'?"

The macro protection ring is a slip on machined plastic ring (like a lens hood) which protects the rounded strobe port from damage when moving very close to the subject, as doing so risks knocking the flash front on hard surfaces. I know that this shouldn't happen, but it does, so Seacam offer the ring to protect the strobe front (I leave mine on unless shooting wide).
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#40 Chris Bangs

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Posted 03 November 2005 - 05:27 PM

As for narrowing the beam on these babies, I use the old fashioned method - a snoot made of a bit of old drainpipe.  Using 2 Subtronics I generally get a full extra stop with the snoots on. 

Steve

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



I did a lot of experimenting when I was shooting 10:1 macro and I found the best way to narrow the beam on a flash is to use a magnifier in front of the strobe.

land flashes use this technique. the use what is very similar to a fensel ( sp ) magnifier on the face of the flash. the flash tube moves back and forth to change the beam angle. fyi, Fensel magnifiers are sold in sheets for helping those like me who are a bit visually challenged.

I have not tried one of these underwater yet but I have tried Woody's diopter over my Ike 50s with good results. the key is being able to guess how far from the strobe face to place the diopter in order to focus the beam. Basically the farther away the diopter narrower the beam,just like using a magnifying glass to focus sunlight to start a fire. I haven't thought about trying to combine a snoot and the diopter? now that may work better. I experimented by using a C8 light in the bath tub with the diopter and it does work. The macro mate would work better but is not cost effective. just buy narrow beam strobes

As for the Seacam flash, It has some great features but a non user replaceable battery scares me away big time since I live far away from any service centers. Hopefully Ike will come up with a digi TTL controller that will work on any system
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