Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Resource for translating latin fish names?


  • Please log in to reply
42 replies to this topic

#1 RebreatherDave

RebreatherDave

    Sting Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 237 posts
  • Location:Los Angeles
  • Interests:rebreathers, marine life, mountain biking, flying hang gliders, paragliders and sailplanes.

Posted 11 September 2006 - 06:57 AM

I am trying to see if anyone has some tips for some online resource where I can take scientific fish names and translate them.... As an example, I thik longirostrus means long nose.....

I am working on a HiDef video documentary and hope a few viewers might be interested in the origins of the latin names....problem is maybe some of the names have Greek roots too....

I have tried a few latin to English translators online, but they haven't worked at all, even when I broken the names up into their parts......
Inspiration Closed Circuit w/Vision electronics
Sony HDR-FX1 3CCD HiDef
Amphibico Phenom
Amphibico dual 35-50 HID's
whatever other toys I can
accumulate b4 I die

#2 mattdiver

mattdiver

    Tiger Shark

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 698 posts
  • Location:Singapore
  • Interests:Photography (duh!), billiards, modern architecture.

Posted 11 September 2006 - 07:16 AM

I often use this website:
http://www.fishbase.org/

I'm not sure how it compares with others, but it's generally enough for me.

#3 Leslie

Leslie

    Worm Girl

  • Critter Expert
  • 1816 posts
  • Location:Natural History Museum of Los Angeles County
  • Interests:marine inverts (especially polychaetes), micro- and macrophotography

Posted 11 September 2006 - 08:13 AM

I often use this website:
http://www.fishbase.org/

I'm not sure how it compares with others, but it's generally enough for me.


Hi Dave -- I'm unfamiliar with web latin/greek name translators but I do have a lot of reference books so feel free to send me any names you want translated.

#4 acroporas

acroporas

    Beach Bum

  • Critter Expert
  • 1776 posts
  • Location:Atlanta, Georgia

Posted 11 September 2006 - 08:13 AM

There is explanation of the latin names on fishbase? Where?

I often use this website:
http://www.fishbase.org/

I'm not sure how it compares with others, but it's generally enough for me.


William

Canon 5D Ikelite Housing and strobes
15FE | 24/2.8 | 35/1.4 | 85/1.8 | 150/2.8 macro

#5 RebreatherDave

RebreatherDave

    Sting Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 237 posts
  • Location:Los Angeles
  • Interests:rebreathers, marine life, mountain biking, flying hang gliders, paragliders and sailplanes.

Posted 11 September 2006 - 08:20 AM

Matt, great resource.......thanks a bunch.

It seems the orange spooted filrefish....Oxymonocanthus Longirostris means "One long nosed sharp thorn" ...what a crackup....

However it seems that sight does not handle invetebrates......so I have one remaining sacred task that you must complete.........no, it is not cutting down the mightest tree in the forest with......

A Herring!

Any similar resources for invertebrates?
Inspiration Closed Circuit w/Vision electronics
Sony HDR-FX1 3CCD HiDef
Amphibico Phenom
Amphibico dual 35-50 HID's
whatever other toys I can
accumulate b4 I die

#6 jander4454

jander4454

    Wolf Eel

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 194 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Scotland

Posted 12 September 2006 - 03:26 AM

TRy going here - http://www.teachyour...o.uk/llatin.htm :lol:

Sony a6000 in Nauticam with Inon D-2000 flashes
www.nudibranch.org/


#7 Paul Kay

Paul Kay

    Giant Squid

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1730 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Wales, UK

Posted 12 September 2006 - 03:43 AM

I have an old book "Key to the names of British Fishes" by R D Macleod (1956) which explains the derivations of both Scientific and common names. Unfortunately, many of the scientific names are not latin - some are of Greek origniation and others derive from a variety of other languages too. If you are interested in any specific British Fish I'll email you those specific details (if they are in it) but not too many please!
Paul Kay, Canon EOS5D/5DII, SEACAM/S45, 15, 24L, 60/2.8 (+Ext12II) & 100/2.8 Macros - UK/Ireland Seacam Sales underseacameras & marinewildlife & paulkayphotography & welshmarinefish

#8 RebreatherDave

RebreatherDave

    Sting Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 237 posts
  • Location:Los Angeles
  • Interests:rebreathers, marine life, mountain biking, flying hang gliders, paragliders and sailplanes.

Posted 12 September 2006 - 07:12 AM

Actually it is some shrimp I am interested in...

Periclimenes tenuipes
Periclimenese brevicarpalis
Cinetorhynchus as in the hinge beack shrimp that liked to hang around moray eels
Thor Amboinensis...named for the island of Ambon in Indonesia although I am trying to determine the etyology of Thor in association with such.
Inspiration Closed Circuit w/Vision electronics
Sony HDR-FX1 3CCD HiDef
Amphibico Phenom
Amphibico dual 35-50 HID's
whatever other toys I can
accumulate b4 I die

#9 Rocha

Rocha

    Salty Dog

  • Senior Moderator
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:California Academy of Sciences, San Francisco, CA

Posted 12 September 2006 - 03:42 PM

Thor is the Norse god of thunder. He is a son of Odin and Jord, and one of the most powerful gods. :lol: I am serious, this is probably where the name came from, a strong little shrimp. Many of the names of genera have no meaning at all, like Abudefduf.

brevicarpalis = short legs (or arms); brevi = short

tenuipes = probably from tenuis = thin, slender

Periclimenes = probably from the Greek Peryklymenon = honeysuckle (maybe the shrimp legs and colors look like honeysuckles?)

Luiz Rocha - www.luizrocha.com
Nikon D800, Aquatica AD800, Ikelite strobes.


#10 RebreatherDave

RebreatherDave

    Sting Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 237 posts
  • Location:Los Angeles
  • Interests:rebreathers, marine life, mountain biking, flying hang gliders, paragliders and sailplanes.

Posted 12 September 2006 - 06:32 PM

Thor is the Norse god of thunder. He is a son of Odin and Jord, and one of the most powerful gods. :lol: I am serious, this is probably where the name came from, a strong little shrimp. Many of the names of genera have no meaning at all, like Abudefduf.

brevicarpalis = short legs (or arms); brevi = short

tenuipes = probably from tenuis = thin, slender

Periclimenes = probably from the Greek Peryklymenon = honeysuckle (maybe the shrimp legs and colors look like honeysuckles?)




Oh man, you guys rock!

I figured it was the Norse god Thor.....but the other stuff.....

So Thor Amboinensis appears to me Thunder God from Ambon (Indonesia island)

I figured brevi was from abbreviated or in Italian, brevette (sp?) carpalis from what I find is Latin and is the equivalent to the Greek "karpos" meaning wrist. In English we use the term carpal. So Brevicarpalis appears to mean "Short armed" so if we put them all together Periclimenes Brevicarpalis appears to mean "Short Armed Honeysuckle".

I did some research on tenuipes....seems tenui is a prefix indicating the characteristic of being slender. Tenuipes tranbslates to meaning "with a slender stalk" or probably in this instance slender bodied" so it looks like Periclimenes Tenuipes would loosely translate to "Slender bodied honeysuckle"

Now, considering I have to narrate this stuff over HiDef footage, how does one properly pronounce tenuipes? Ten-oo-ip-ess? I figure periclimines as peri as in periscope, and clim-in-ess as opposed to cli-meens, but that also leaves the question of which syllable receives the emphasis if at all.

Here is where I researched some of this stuff:

http://www.etymologi.../us-__ca__.html

Edited by RebreatherDave, 12 September 2006 - 06:58 PM.

Inspiration Closed Circuit w/Vision electronics
Sony HDR-FX1 3CCD HiDef
Amphibico Phenom
Amphibico dual 35-50 HID's
whatever other toys I can
accumulate b4 I die

#11 Paul Kay

Paul Kay

    Giant Squid

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1730 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Wales, UK

Posted 13 September 2006 - 12:13 AM

Pronouncing scientific names is tricky and variable - I've seen one book (on Sussex marine life in UK) which actually tried to include 'pronouciations' but very few ever attempt to indicate how names should be spoken - potential authors could consider this as variable pronounciation does cause confusion at times. Its bizarre to discover that what you thought was a different creature that someone was talking about is actually one you know but didn't recognise the name the way it was pronounced!
Paul Kay, Canon EOS5D/5DII, SEACAM/S45, 15, 24L, 60/2.8 (+Ext12II) & 100/2.8 Macros - UK/Ireland Seacam Sales underseacameras & marinewildlife & paulkayphotography & welshmarinefish

#12 Rocha

Rocha

    Salty Dog

  • Senior Moderator
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:California Academy of Sciences, San Francisco, CA

Posted 13 September 2006 - 12:47 AM

Call me a purist, but I pronounce everything as close to Latin (and Portuguese :lol: ) as possible... Meaning, i and y are pronounced "ee" and not "ai". For example, I've heard many people pronouncing Centropyge, centropAIGUE, while I pronounce it centropEEGEE, but I guess in the end it doesn't matter, as long as you write it correctly :lol:

Now, one rule holds for pronounciation across languages, OE and AE are pronounced as E only. This is very obvious in family names, all of which end in AE but are pronounced E. For example, the correct pronounciation is LabridE and not LabridAE, the A has no sound. The same holds for things like Halichoeres, the O in OE has no sound.

Luiz Rocha - www.luizrocha.com
Nikon D800, Aquatica AD800, Ikelite strobes.


#13 acroporas

acroporas

    Beach Bum

  • Critter Expert
  • 1776 posts
  • Location:Atlanta, Georgia

Posted 13 September 2006 - 06:03 AM

Call me a purist, but I pronounce everything as close to Latin (and Portuguese :lol: ) as possible... Meaning, i and y are pronounced "ee" and not "ai". For example, I've heard many people pronouncing Centropyge, centropAIGUE, while I pronounce it centropEEGEE, but I guess in the end it doesn't matter, as long as you write it correctly :lol:

Now, one rule holds for pronounciation across languages, OE and AE are pronounced as E only. This is very obvious in family names, all of which end in AE but are pronounced E. For example, the correct pronounciation is LabridE and not LabridAE, the A has no sound. The same holds for things like Halichoeres, the O in OE has no sound.


You can call me stupid, but my approch is much easier. I say them however they come out when I give them a quick glance. Often with an extra syllable somewhere and usually leaving another out. :lol: This works out fine since I normally only say them to myself when I am reading something.

Then I just avoid pronouncing them infront of people who will notice.

For example I pronounce Halichoeres hail-EE-O-cor-EEs Now do not ask me where that O came from :D
William

Canon 5D Ikelite Housing and strobes
15FE | 24/2.8 | 35/1.4 | 85/1.8 | 150/2.8 macro

#14 Rocha

Rocha

    Salty Dog

  • Senior Moderator
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:California Academy of Sciences, San Francisco, CA

Posted 13 September 2006 - 10:45 AM

Then I just avoid pronouncing them infront of people who will notice.


Hehehe, that's the way to go! Unfortunately for me I always present in scientific conferences where people do notice, but since most of these conferences are in English speaking countries I am in the minority and the English pronnounciation always wins!

Luiz Rocha - www.luizrocha.com
Nikon D800, Aquatica AD800, Ikelite strobes.


#15 Leslie

Leslie

    Worm Girl

  • Critter Expert
  • 1816 posts
  • Location:Natural History Museum of Los Angeles County
  • Interests:marine inverts (especially polychaetes), micro- and macrophotography

Posted 13 September 2006 - 11:00 AM

A lot of the older marine invert names come from Greek & Latin mythology & literature with lots of references to marine themes. Periclimenes is an adaptation of Periclymenus (greek)who's listed as one of the argonauts accompanying Jason in the quest for the golden fleece.

Brevicarpalis refers to the short proportions of the "hand" so it's Periclimenes' short-handed shrimp.

Periclimenes tenuipes was probably named for the very long & thin first pair of arms. Incidentally, this & other long-armed Periclimenes have been transferred to the genus Kemponia so the new name is Kemponia tenuipes. P. kororensis is another one that's been put into Kemponia. Kemponia is probably named for the british crustacean expert S.W. Kemp.

Cinetorhynchus is a re-arrangement of the genus name Rhychocinetes. Names like this indicate the close relationship between two genera.

#16 Leslie

Leslie

    Worm Girl

  • Critter Expert
  • 1816 posts
  • Location:Natural History Museum of Los Angeles County
  • Interests:marine inverts (especially polychaetes), micro- and macrophotography

Posted 13 September 2006 - 11:13 AM

Hehehe, that's the way to go! Unfortunately for me I always present in scientific conferences where people do notice, but since most of these conferences are in English speaking countries I am in the minority and the English pronnounciation always wins!


Which english? :lol: American english or English english? Vowels are pronounced differently & stress points vary. English english speakers use the same pronounciations (allowing for accent, of course) as most european language speakers. Americans don't. Typical yanks..... :lol:

But I'm with William - a few extra syllables just make the names sound better!

#17 Graham Abbott

Graham Abbott

    Manta Ray

  • Industry
  • PipPipPip
  • 434 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bali, Indonesia
  • Interests:Diving, diving, diving, marine life, critters, rare animals, new species, mountain biking, Indonesia in general, San Francisco, music and a growing interest in art of all kinds!

Posted 13 September 2006 - 11:57 AM

Hey Dave,

If you happen to find a book or anything that explains how to translate the latin names please do let me know. I must be like you, I wanna know what some of these names mean? Though diving with guys like Gerry Allen, you may wonder if he is just having a joke when he makes his fish name up!

As for the pronunciations, yeah right! Come on now, most of the world pronounces common place names differently, you can't expect divers to try and pronounce latin names correctly as well!

I have to go along with Leslie here as we are obviously speaking the real Queens English, tho I ope no one picks me up on me grammer or me spellin!

#18 RebreatherDave

RebreatherDave

    Sting Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 237 posts
  • Location:Los Angeles
  • Interests:rebreathers, marine life, mountain biking, flying hang gliders, paragliders and sailplanes.

Posted 13 September 2006 - 12:21 PM

Well, we have one opinion that periclimenes means honeysuckle in Greek, although I can't seem to find a Greek dictionary to confirm, and another opinion that is comes from Greek mythology, which I did find this:

Periclymenus

by Micha F. Lindemans
The son of Nereus. He participated in the voyage of the Argonauts. He was renowned for his strength, and also because Poseidon had given him the ability to change himself into various animal shapes. He was killed by Heracles during the destruction of Pylos (Ovid XII, 556).
The son of Poseidon and Chloris, one of the defenders of Thebes during the attack of the Seven.
Inspiration Closed Circuit w/Vision electronics
Sony HDR-FX1 3CCD HiDef
Amphibico Phenom
Amphibico dual 35-50 HID's
whatever other toys I can
accumulate b4 I die

#19 Graham Abbott

Graham Abbott

    Manta Ray

  • Industry
  • PipPipPip
  • 434 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bali, Indonesia
  • Interests:Diving, diving, diving, marine life, critters, rare animals, new species, mountain biking, Indonesia in general, San Francisco, music and a growing interest in art of all kinds!

Posted 13 September 2006 - 12:27 PM

Or you could try...

per·i·cline (pr-kln)
n.
A variety of albite occurring as elongated white crystals.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[From Greek periklins, sloping on all sides : peri-, peri- + klnein, to slope; see klei- in Indo-European roots.]

#20 Leslie

Leslie

    Worm Girl

  • Critter Expert
  • 1816 posts
  • Location:Natural History Museum of Los Angeles County
  • Interests:marine inverts (especially polychaetes), micro- and macrophotography

Posted 13 September 2006 - 12:37 PM

An excellent book is Brown, R.W. 1985. Composition of scientific words. Smithsonian Press, 892 pp. It's out of print so you'll have to track it down through a web book seller. I need a copy too!