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Ikelite DS 160


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#1 davephdv

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Posted 20 June 2008 - 02:11 PM

Apparently Ikelite has announced an upgrade to the DS 125. Everything the same but power boosted 160.

- 160 watt-sec. power
- Built-in 5-watt LED modeling light
- TTL, Full, plus 9 fractional powers
- 1.5 second recycle time
- 225 full power flashes per charge
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#2 acroporas

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Posted 20 June 2008 - 02:58 PM

Sounds great. But it seems to make the DS-200 seem a bit big/bulky and expensive for just an extra 40WS. I wonder if they are planning to upgrade the DS-200 as well.
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#3 ATJ

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Posted 20 June 2008 - 03:10 PM

Sounds very cool. I wonder why they don't have it on their site: http://www.ikelite.c...ges/newest.html

#4 davephdv

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Posted 20 June 2008 - 03:56 PM

Announcement says details on website by end of month and limited availability by end of July.
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#5 james

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Posted 20 June 2008 - 04:29 PM

Dang, that sounds pretty good! I just did a whole trip shooting w/ DS125's. I also own DS200's but didn't bring them 'cuz I wanted to give the 125's a fair chance. My conclusion: the wider beam of the 200's makes them a LOT easier to use. But the 125's weren't underpowered - just not as wide.

An extra 1/2 stop will make a lot of difference in the power though!

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#6 Islandbound

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Posted 20 June 2008 - 06:05 PM

Is there an upgrade price as well?

#7 davephdv

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Posted 21 June 2008 - 05:09 PM

James, according to the Ikelite website the 125 and 200 have the same angle of coverage. The 125 has a watt power of 110, the 200 one of 200 and the 160 according to the memo 160.

I switched from the old style 200s to the 125s years ago and never regretted it. The new 160 is just icing on the cake.
Dave Burroughs, Nikon D300, D2X, Subal housing, DS160 strobes

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#8 ATJ

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 01:58 AM

http://www.ikelite.c.../ss_dig160.html

http://www.ikelite.c...obe_chart2.html

It has a LED modeling light. Nice.

#9 Lionfish43

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 05:08 AM

No iTTL or eTTL......I'd skip it.
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#10 james

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 05:34 AM

It looks like it does TTL to me with Ikelite housings and compatible cameras - just like the DS125. Did I miss something?

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#11 Lionfish43

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 05:42 AM

It looks like it does TTL to me with Ikelite housings and compatible cameras - just like the DS125. Did I miss something?

Cheers
James

Your right. It does TTL in conjunction with an Ikelite housing or adapter but otherwise, no. Not a step forward as far as I'm concerned. I would like to see strobes come out of the dark ages and natively support advanced TTL features. Rather than do that they would rather use it as marketing tool.
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#12 ATJ

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 07:32 PM

Your right. It does TTL in conjunction with an Ikelite housing or adapter but otherwise, no. Not a step forward as far as I'm concerned. I would like to see strobes come out of the dark ages and natively support advanced TTL features. Rather than do that they would rather use it as marketing tool.

His right what? :P

And which make of camera do you think Ikelite should dedicate their strobes to be working natively with? Canon? Nikon? Perhaps they could standardise on Sony or Pentax. That would be really useful.

#13 Lionfish43

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 08:24 PM

His right what? :P

And which make of camera do you think Ikelite should dedicate their strobes to be working natively with? Canon? Nikon? Perhaps they could standardise on Sony or Pentax. That would be really useful.

Canon and Nikon would be fine. It doesn't seem like it would be that hard to make a base strobe model with interchangeable TTL modules for Nikon and Canon. They do it now except they don't build it into the strobe. They either want to sell you an additional gizmo (TTL adapter) or one of their housings. The problem with external TTL adapters is they're not real reliable and if I wanted an Ikelite housing I'd have one.

Don't get me wrong, Ikelite makes fine products. I own a couple of their strobes but I don't think they're listening to the consumer. At least not this consumer. All I'm asking for is a reliable TTL strobe with the accuracy of my SB-800. Nikon iTTL has been around for quite a while now.
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#14 ATJ

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 08:46 PM

I see a number of problems with interchangeable TTL modules. The first one would be allowing an interchangeable module while still maintaining a sealed unit and keeping the size of the strobe down. I think those to things are mutually exclusive. The second drawback is you'd need to buy the interchangeable module for each strobe you use. I use 2 x DS-125 so I'd need to buy two modules. Third, you'd may have to have dedicated sync cables depending on which interchangeable module you are using.

With the current system where it is built into the housing, everything from bulkhead on the housing is exactly the same regardless of what type of camera you have. The same sync cables are used for Nikon, Canon or whatever. The strobes are the same. Everything is simple and self contained. The logic for converting from the camera circuitry is in the housing which is made specifically for that camera which is the most logical place for it. If the D700 was to introduce some new iTTL feature, that could be built into the D700 housing and nothing else would need to change.

Now, if the external TTL adapter is not reliable (in your opinion), why would an interchangeable module be any more reliable?

How often have you told Ikelite what you want in a strobe? How many other people have told them the same thing?

#15 Ryan

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 04:59 AM

The problem with external TTL adapters is they're not real reliable


I seldom feel compelled to defend a manufacturer, but this statement is completely contradictory to my experience.

I can say with confidence that the Ikelite TTL converter is a reliable product. It provides the most accurate flash exposures of all of the converters I've tested, requires no batteries/charging, and we haven't fielded a single customer email from someone having trouble that wasn't related to a wiring issue in the housing. We have also had no returns of this product from dissatisfied customers.

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#16 Lionfish43

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 05:20 AM

I see a number of problems with interchangeable TTL modules. The first one would be allowing an interchangeable module while still maintaining a sealed unit and keeping the size of the strobe down. I think those to things are mutually exclusive. The second drawback is you'd need to buy the interchangeable module for each strobe you use. I use 2 x DS-125 so I'd need to buy two modules. Third, you'd may have to have dedicated sync cables depending on which interchangeable module you are using.

With the current system where it is built into the housing, everything from bulkhead on the housing is exactly the same regardless of what type of camera you have. The same sync cables are used for Nikon, Canon or whatever. The strobes are the same. Everything is simple and self contained. The logic for converting from the camera circuitry is in the housing which is made specifically for that camera which is the most logical place for it. If the D700 was to introduce some new iTTL feature, that could be built into the D700 housing and nothing else would need to change.

Now, if the external TTL adapter is not reliable (in your opinion), why would an interchangeable module be any more reliable?

How often have you told Ikelite what you want in a strobe? How many other people have told them the same thing?

I don't know why you assume it would be an extra charge for a TTL module but lets say it is. I'd be willing to pay a little premium for a strobe with up to date electonics. And while we're at it lets come up with a new universal cord design. Fiber optic would be nice.

It's not just my opinion that external adapters are unreliable. Even if they worked perfectly, they add additional unwanted points of failure.

I have expressed my opinion to Ikelite reps and dealers more times than they'd like. If they read this forum, which I know they do, they're aware that a number of people have written about the general poor state of affairs with UW flash photography.

You are obviously an Ikelite system user, that's fine, you're perfectly happy with the staus quo. Don't tell me I shouldn't want something better.

Edited by Lionfish43, 03 July 2008 - 09:24 AM.

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#17 james

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 05:25 AM

Interesting.

I also don't think that putting the TTL converter in the strobe is the best solution. Just look at how many versions of the Sea and Sea converter have been released? Nikon/Canon change the TTL protocols so often - would you want to have to send your strobes in for conversion (which would cost money) each time?

Cheers
James
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#18 Lionfish43

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 05:46 AM

Interesting.

I also don't think that putting the TTL converter in the strobe is the best solution. Just look at how many versions of the Sea and Sea converter have been released? Nikon/Canon change the TTL protocols so often - would you want to have to send your strobes in for conversion (which would cost money) each time?

Cheers
James

my nikon SB800 works great with every recent nikon model so I don't get the statement that the protocol keeps changing. The SB800 has been around for a long time.
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#19 james

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 05:51 AM

Hi Larry,

Well if Nikon would make the converter to go into the strobe then that would be another story :-) But they do not - Heinrich+Sea and Sea or Ikelite do - and they had to make a I, II, and III to keep up w/ Nikon - whereas Nikon just made the SB800.

Cheers
James
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#20 Lionfish43

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Posted 03 July 2008 - 06:28 AM

Hi Larry,

Well if Nikon would make the converter to go into the strobe then that would be another story :-) But they do not - Heinrich+Sea and Sea or Ikelite do - and they had to make a I, II, and III to keep up w/ Nikon - whereas Nikon just made the SB800.

Cheers
James

That's what I would really like to see, a new fully compatible UW Nikon flash unit. I guess no one has fully figured out the Nikon protocol.
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