Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Video from the Canon 5DMkII


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
167 replies to this topic

#141 Ferg42

Ferg42

    Eagle Ray

  • Industry
  • PipPipPip
  • 369 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:East Sussex, UK

Posted 13 May 2009 - 05:51 AM

From what I've read from the topside video forums for this camera, one of the best methods of manipulating the output is to transcode it into an intermediate format using something like Cineform Neoscene http://cineform.com/neoscene/ which is available on a 7 day trial. That way your average hardware and software can actually do something with the high bitrate HD output. Apparently it also helps with the crushed blacks issue. It's a shame that Canon didn't provide this kind of software as free with the 5D2 package !


I'd second that. I've been using Neoscene to transcode before editing in Sony Vegas and it works a treat- the video plays much more smoothly and at a higher frame-rate within the NLE. The crushed black issue seems to have been solved by the latest Quicktime update.
EOS 7D, Nauticam housing, EOS 5D II, Ikelite, Inon z240, Inon D180, Tok 10-17, 15 FE, 17-40, 105 Macro
Sony HC7, Gates Housing
Visit My Website

#142 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 16 May 2009 - 08:59 AM

Here is a video from the 5D2 using some of the lockdown and focus techniques to great effect. It's not underwater but in the desert of Afghanistan by DanFung Dennis. Got an interesting story too:


Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#143 GoinDown

GoinDown

    Lionfish

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 59 posts

Posted 16 May 2009 - 10:57 AM

Here's a collection of underwater clips I've found on youtube so far:






http://www.youtube.c...feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyBtYv-WX9Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9YKkZLFOxA
Now: Canon 5D Mk2, 15mm FE, 16-35 Mk2 (+2 Diopter), 100mm IS, Subal, FE2 Dome, 75 ext, 100mm Flat Port. DS-125's, DS-160.

Previous: Canon 20D, Ikelite, DS-125's

Gallery: Coming soon
Website: Coming soon

#144 JimDeck

JimDeck

    Lionfish

  • Industry
  • PipPip
  • 71 posts
  • Location:Monterey, CA

Posted 16 May 2009 - 06:48 PM

Berkley
What lense were you testing that you had soft corners for? 16-35? 15 FE? 14?
Shooting with anything more than 21mm, corners don't seem to be an issue with the 1D series u/w. Since the 5D2 video mode changes ISO/Tv then Av last, it'd be wiser to shoot with a lens that is at least f4 and above to get DoF back.
With macro, to get back DoF, lights are going to be necessary and VERY powerful lights too. One method I managed to try was to have a white card to expose the subject but at -1.5 - 2 Ec. Then lock settings and use Ec to knock it back 1 or 2 stops depending on subject. As you say, when Av changes, the video gets funky. Another pain with the 5D2 that the AE locked settings reset once the 4GB limit is up, which means one has to be careful not to hit the limit but stop and hit set again.
Also users will also have to use CF IV-2 to switch AF-ON to AE-Lock for one of the C* custom settings so that when they shoot stills, they can switch back to AF-On functionality while u/w.


Hi Drew,

I shot the 5DMKII out in front of the shop (Backscatter West) in about 15 feet of water to try and do some testing in an attempt to have some scientific results. I shot it on a tripod with a 15FE and Light & Motion Sunray 2000 lights. Here's some of the tricks, tips, issues I had.

Focus in live view is difficult. I needs a lot of contrast, more than normal, to focus. I had to have my dive buddy (Russ) swim 2 feet out in front of the dome and put his bright blue dry glove in the center of the frame to get the thing to focus. After I did that, I moved the AF control over to *. I was shooting an Aquatica housing. I thought moving the control over to the * button was a really cool feature because I didn't want to accidentally hit the AF button again and ruin the locked in focus I had.

White balance was a challenge with a 15FE. I really needed a 3 sq ft white card! But I didn't have one and only had a small dive slate. Again, I had to have Russ swim out in front and hold the white card for me. The white card needs to be in the center of the frame when you take a shot to then assign the white balance from the shot as custom. The camera will take whatever for a WB, unlike video that will sometimes not take. What I though looked good underwater came out a little pink on my HDTV.

I had the Sunray 2000 lights at full power. Probably could have had even brighter lights. The concept is to nuke the foreground so that the camera will clamp down on the exposure, and darken the background. Most cameras in auto exposure mode tend to overexpose the background and underexpose the foreground. I found that the auto exposure on the 5DMKII was pretty close, but most times needed to go 1/3 to 2/3 underexposed on the exposure compensation. Going more that 1 stop up or down was way too much.

I tried to overexpose with a white slate to then pull it back with EC in order to get a higher aperture, but every time the exposure was more that 2 stops off and was too much of a pain in the butt to attempt to dial in to be practical.

I was getting apertures of 5.6 and 16. At 16, the ISO was getting a little high and I was getting banding in the water background. After I was done shooting and swimming in at the end of the dive I shot some kelp and got the lens to go to 2.8. Don't ask me how it got it to do that! The corners did look a little soft, especially at close focus. Still trying how to figure out how to get the planets to align and get a rhyme or reason for the F stop choices. I did notice (hope it wasn't a coincidence) that if I repeatedly hit the * button when the camera was pointed at the same lighting conditions that the camera cycled through different F stop and ISO choices for an equivalent exposure. Hopefully someone else can repeat this so I don't think I'm going crazy...

I'm going to shoot the crap out of this thing in video mode at the Digital Shootout in June. Hopefully I'll have more tips and tricks then.

Jim
Jim Decker
Backscatter
http://www.backscatter.com
831-645-1082

#145 JimDeck

JimDeck

    Lionfish

  • Industry
  • PipPip
  • 71 posts
  • Location:Monterey, CA

Posted 16 May 2009 - 06:57 PM

Hi Berkley

Thanks for that excellent guideline. Pretty much the way I have figured it out as well.

Just a question about the step of adjusting exposure compensation to dial in the background blue. Can you accurately see the right colour blue at depth like you can out of water? I mean if you have made the correction underwater to what looks good to your eye on the LCD, will that necessarily be correct?

Also wondering what you think of doing the white balance in live view in the K scale adjustment?

With respect to the battle of video exposure with 5D2, I think that starting with -2 Exposure compensation before pointing your camera at a bright source to try and force the smaller aperture will be a good thing. The reason for this is that most lenses seem to have a big f-stop jump, typically from 5.6 straight to 16 as the algorhytm tries to compensate for bright exposure ( I wrote about this in an earlier post ). So I think that f16 is going to be better than f5.6 ( at the expense of a higher ISO which seems quite forgiving) and therefore, once you have locked the exposure at f16 you will need to brighten the image considerably and having 4 stops of exposure compensation ( rather than just two ) may well be required.

Would really appreciate any further tips and advice as the experience grows.

Thanks


Hi Andre,

It was difficult to tell the exposure and white balance on the camera screen when I was shooting as the housing was on a tripod about 6 inches off the bottom with the lens pointed up (screen pointing down), with me in a drysuit unable to stand on my head without my feet rocketing to the surface! Even still the WB I did looked good on the camera screen only to get it on the computer and HDTV to see it was a little hot on the pink side. I think doing a WB with the K scale would have to be tested with different values to see which one works best for that particular shot.

Jim

Edited by JimDeck, 16 May 2009 - 06:59 PM.

Jim Decker
Backscatter
http://www.backscatter.com
831-645-1082

#146 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 20 May 2009 - 11:51 AM

Lowlight at f1.4 is awesome... too bad it's useless underwater for UWA.


Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#147 Autopsea

Autopsea

    Sting Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 269 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 May 2009 - 12:13 AM

It's gonna be hard for macro : )


I tryed a video with the MP-E 65mm. mot of the video is between 1,5 and 2 : 1.

Can watch in HQ :



Shaking shaking :) I'm afraid it will be kind of the same underwater, but of course less because it will be less than 1:1.


I'm intrested if anyone have an idea of a gunstock to make the housing less shaking by pressing it on our body (shoulder).

#148 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 23 May 2009 - 09:36 AM

You should always use a tripod or a rest for macro for video, esp closer to 1:1. That's the difference with a DSLR housing, the balance and inertia can be problematic for handling.

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#149 Jules (Helioxfilm)

Jules (Helioxfilm)

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 391 posts
  • Location:Hungary, Budapest
  • Interests:UW videography, tec diving<br />literature (novels)<br />diplomacy

Posted 23 May 2009 - 10:53 AM

Another topside short film with two 5DMKIIs. Featuring a very beautiful modell...


iNSight

Edited by Jules (Helioxfilm), 23 May 2009 - 10:55 AM.


#150 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 23 May 2009 - 11:47 AM

Ah magyar nok! :) That server is really slow for the 720p version though.

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#151 Jules (Helioxfilm)

Jules (Helioxfilm)

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 391 posts
  • Location:Hungary, Budapest
  • Interests:UW videography, tec diving<br />literature (novels)<br />diplomacy

Posted 24 May 2009 - 06:10 AM

Ah magyar nok! :) That server is really slow for the 720p version though.


Hm, your language skills are amazing - I cannot even just imagine your adventures in Hungary :)


Just to add some more Canon movies:

http://theeoscars.com/5dblog/

#152 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 24 May 2009 - 09:12 AM

Well I deny ever having been to Budapest during the F1. :)

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#153 jonny shaw

jonny shaw

    Orca

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1299 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sydney

Posted 24 May 2009 - 02:51 PM

That is awesome Jules... really liked the Afghan one too Drew

www.ginclearfilm.com
www.facebook.com/ginclearfilm
GATES DEEP EPIC Based in Sydney


#154 Jules (Helioxfilm)

Jules (Helioxfilm)

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 391 posts
  • Location:Hungary, Budapest
  • Interests:UW videography, tec diving<br />literature (novels)<br />diplomacy

Posted 26 May 2009 - 10:50 PM

Well I deny ever having been to Budapest during the F1. :)



Hm, I know everything, you don't need to say more :-)

Good news: the new Canon firmware bring us manual aperture, shutter and ISO during shooting video:

http://www.dpreview....kiifirmware.asp

Edited by Jules (Helioxfilm), 26 May 2009 - 10:50 PM.


#155 emaltorio

emaltorio

    Triggerfish

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 38 posts

Posted 27 May 2009 - 02:11 AM

Very stable footage using a head mount of sorts , in the shadow it can be seen . Is he using a modified gimble or gyro of some sorts?
Or just very good technique?
Uinta Spring skiing

Edited by emaltorio, 27 May 2009 - 02:13 AM.


#156 Dixter

Dixter

    Lionfish

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 73 posts

Posted 28 May 2009 - 02:41 PM

From what I've read from the topside video forums for this camera, one of the best methods of manipulating the output is to transcode it into an intermediate format using something like Cineform Neoscene http://cineform.com/neoscene/ which is available on a 7 day trial. That way your average hardware and software can actually do something with the high bitrate HD output. Apparently it also helps with the crushed blacks issue. It's a shame that Canon didn't provide this kind of software as free with the 5D2 package !



The Cineform solution works great and you can get a good deal on it from the Video Guys web site at $100

http://www.videoguys...3435F454E4.aspx

#157 bmyates

bmyates

    Great White

  • Team Wetpixel
  • 973 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Seattle, WA
  • Interests:UW Photography, motorcycles.

Posted 29 May 2009 - 07:06 AM

From what I've read from the topside video forums for this camera, one of the best methods of manipulating the output is to transcode it into an intermediate format using something like Cineform Neoscene http://cineform.com/neoscene/ which is available on a 7 day trial. That way your average hardware and software can actually do something with the high bitrate HD output. Apparently it also helps with the crushed blacks issue. It's a shame that Canon didn't provide this kind of software as free with the 5D2 package !


I shot some HD video in Rangiroa last week, downloaded and installed the trial of Neoscene, and had it convert to AVI, but Premiere Elements 7 didn't seem to be able to read it (and PE7 can't cope with the original 5D .MOV files - they're terribly "jumpy"). Should I try to have Neoscene convert to something other than AVI?

I guess the peripheral question is whether PE7 is even capable of handling HD video from the 5D. Is there a better "cheap" editing program for Windows (I'm basically a still photo guy, so don't have - or want to buy - any expensive video editing software)?

Edited by bmyates, 29 May 2009 - 08:17 AM.

Bruce Yates
www.UnderwaterReflections.com
Canon 5DMkII in Aquatica, 1DsMkII in Seacam, G15 in RecSea...Inon Z240's...too many lenses
"If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Then quit. No use being a damned fool about it." WC Fields


#158 Ferg42

Ferg42

    Eagle Ray

  • Industry
  • PipPipPip
  • 369 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:East Sussex, UK

Posted 01 June 2009 - 02:19 PM

I shot some HD video in Rangiroa last week, downloaded and installed the trial of Neoscene, and had it convert to AVI, but Premiere Elements 7 didn't seem to be able to read it (and PE7 can't cope with the original 5D .MOV files - they're terribly "jumpy"). Should I try to have Neoscene convert to something other than AVI?

I guess the peripheral question is whether PE7 is even capable of handling HD video from the 5D. Is there a better "cheap" editing program for Windows (I'm basically a still photo guy, so don't have - or want to buy - any expensive video editing software)?


I've been using Sony Vegas Movie Studio which is pretty cheap, and seems to do a good job with the 5D files. I've tried with both the .mov files (which it preview at a slow frame-rate) and the neoscene generated .avis which preview more smoothly.
EOS 7D, Nauticam housing, EOS 5D II, Ikelite, Inon z240, Inon D180, Tok 10-17, 15 FE, 17-40, 105 Macro
Sony HC7, Gates Housing
Visit My Website

#159 StephenFrink

StephenFrink

    Great Hammerhead

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 711 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Key Largo, Florida Keys

Posted 01 June 2009 - 07:10 PM

When the newest firmware upgrade to the 5DII was about to be announced Canon arranged a conference call for their Explorers of Light. They explained the concept and asked for input from EOL who had shot a lot of 5DII video so far. Truthfully, I've been using the camera for stills, but haven't really dived into the video capability too much, so for the most part I just listened. But, several of the shooters have experimented extensively, and one, Bruce Dorn, has a nice, eclectic series of clips shot with different Canon lenses.

See http://idcphotograph...blog/bruce-dorn, page down and click link for 5D2 video. Really, quite an impressive tool.

On the same page is some of his work with a 600mm, pulling manual focus: http://video.idcphot...7095_ff5sd-A-LB

Edited by StephenFrink, 01 June 2009 - 07:18 PM.

Stephen Frink - www.stephenfrinkphoto.com
Publisher - Alert Diver Magazine
Distributor/North America - Seacamusa.com
Travel - Waterhousetours.com

#160 AndreSmith

AndreSmith

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 323 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:British Columbia, Canada

Posted 01 June 2009 - 08:53 PM

When the newest firmware upgrade to the 5DII was about to be announced Canon arranged a conference call for their Explorers of Light. They explained the concept and asked for input from EOL who had shot a lot of 5DII video so far. Truthfully, I've been using the camera for stills, but haven't really dived into the video capability too much, so for the most part I just listened. But, several of the shooters have experimented extensively, and one, Bruce Dorn, has a nice, eclectic series of clips shot with different Canon lenses.

See http://idcphotograph...blog/bruce-dorn, page down and click link for 5D2 video. Really, quite an impressive tool.

On the same page is some of his work with a 600mm, pulling manual focus: http://video.idcphot...7095_ff5sd-A-LB


Thats really interesting stuff. The iDC LCD viewfinder ( http://idcphotograph...-lcd-viewfinder ) he used seems like a very handy gadget and will make shooting video a lot easier. Now we just need to modify it to fit onto the back of our housings for UW use!

Just waiting for the firmware upgrade before tackling video with renewed enthusiasm!