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#1 jeremypayne

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Posted 01 November 2008 - 08:31 PM

To date, if I've wanted to print something I've either used my 6-color HP inkjet printer or sent them out to Adorama. I've been pretty happy with the results. The cameras used have all been advanced "point and shoots" (or film).

I've now been shooting a D700 dSLR for a bit and need to make a bunch of very high quality prints - several of them quite large ... from 16 x 20 up to 30 x 40 ... and I'm wondering if there's a "better" way.

I shoot 14-bit RAW and import to Lightroom which I run on hardware-calibrated high-end laptops (with about 45% coverage of the AdobeRGB color space). In the past, I would process to my heart's content, ultimately export an 8-bit sRGB TIFF and send it to Adorama allowing them to do image/color correction.

Should I:

A) Export 8-bit sRGB TIFFs and send to Adorama and keep letting them do image correction

B) Export 8-bit sRGB TIFFs and send to Adorama and tell them not to touch them

C) Export 8-bit sRGB TIFFs and send them to someone else ... any suggestions?

D) Export 8-bit AdobeRGB or PhotoProRGB and send them to someone else who can handle wider gamut files

E) Something else entirely

If I were to do D) and the lab doesn't do image/color correction, I'm asking for trouble given my hardware limitations, right?

Any advice or lab recommendations would be most appreciated.

Thanks!
Jeremy Payne
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#2 MatthewAddison

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Posted 02 November 2008 - 10:22 AM

Do you know which printers Adorama uses for their output? If you need the highest quality prints, a lab with a lightjet printer will give you the best results, although the prints are $$$$. There have to be a bunch of them in NYC. I think outputting to sRGB would be a mistake as the most modern printers from Epson, HP, etc have a wider gamut than that and in some spectrums and papers exceeding Adobe 1998. Ask your lab for their printers' .icc profile for whichever paper you choose for best 1st round test output.
I have an older Epson 4800 here and adjust the file in 8 bit prophoto but check the gamut warnings in my papers' .icc profile before printing.
Right now our LCD monitors (even color corrected) are the weakest link in the chain with narrow gamuts and big gaping holes in its range.
BTW, I just got a colorMunkie profiler and love it. Can't recommend it enough.
Look forward to seeing some more of your shots.
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#3 jeremypayne

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Posted 02 November 2008 - 11:47 AM

>>> Do you know which printers Adorama uses for their output?

Noritsu 34PRO

>>> I think outputting to sRGB would be a mistake

I think so, too ... I didn't really understand that until recently ... but ignorance WAS bliss. :bottled:

>>> Look forward to seeing some more of your shots.

Thanks! Hopefully, I'll get underwater again soon ... although the current economic climate has me cutting "non-essentials" left and right. I've shooting a lot in the foothills of the Berkshires lately ...

Here's a few of the D700 images soon to be on the way to the lab ...

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image
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#4 MatthewAddison

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Posted 02 November 2008 - 12:46 PM

Pretty shots. I don't know much about the Noritsu but i'll look it up and get back to you on my thoughts for that printer. What is your favorite paper to use in that printer (for most of your shots)? I'll bet #2 would print out really cool on a hahnemule (sp?) pearl. #1, definitely hi-gloss.
O.K, just looked up the Noritsu 34. Looks like it is a digital Laser which can go to 300dpi.
Here is the link for downloading printer profiles for Adorama in case you have not done so yet:
http://www.drycreekp...rk_profiles.htm

My advice:

work the photo in Prophoto@ 300dpi, 8 bit (you might want to ask Adorama if their printer is 16 bit capable. Don't think so, it was introduced in 2005). As long as you are not doing crazy color shifting, you probably won't be getting into trouble with the "impossible" colors prophoto can make.
Download the printer profile for whichever paper you will want to print the image on and select that as your target destination. Check Gamut warnings and make any final corrections to the image with that particular .icc profiler visible.
It probably won't be perfect but as close as you can get, unless you have a $30,000 pro monitor laying about. (if you do, can I borrow it?)

And since I just re-read your original post....
Print on your HP for images you like. It's a good printer.
Most pro labs will let you look over their shoulder at what they are seeing on their monitor. With that said, the Noritsu looks like it comes with a run-of-the-mill monitor so you may not see much difference than what you are seeing on your color corrected monitor, although the Noritsu looks like it is a CRT and you have an LCD (can be a big difference in blacks & the darkest mid-tones).
Then ask yourself if you know and trust the person doing the printing to make color adjustments for you. Top-side stuff may be no problem but if the operator is not a diver, your underwater shots might be best served left to your eye.

Edited by MatthewAddison, 02 November 2008 - 01:00 PM.

Nikon D3, S&S MDX-D3, S&S YS250 (2), Inon 45 viewfinder, ZEN underwater dome, 14mm, 17-35mm, 60mm, 110mm.
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#5 jeremypayne

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Posted 02 November 2008 - 02:09 PM

>>> What is your favorite paper to use in that printer (for most of your shots)?

Adorama uses Kodak paper exclusively. I usually print on Kodak Professional Glossy, but I did get a few printed on "Metallic" paper recently and they look pretty striking.

>>> #1, definitely hi-gloss

Agreed ... #1 is gonna get blown up real big (30 x40) ... I was thinking of using the metallic for this one.

>>> hahnemule (sp?) pearl

I've heard of that ... but never seen it ... there's so much to learn ... the education never ends!

>>> you might want to ask Adorama if their printer is 16 bit capable. Don't think so, it was introduced in 2005).

No 16-bit ... and they will only accept sRGB - which is what prompted me to start looking for another lab once my blissful ignorance was shattered.

>>> Print on your HP for images you like. It's a good printer.

It really is ... when I use the HP Premium Plus paper, I rarely end up with a lot of "out of gamut" colors even from PhotoPro files and the output is very, very good. I use it for anything 8x10 or smaller.

>>> Most pro labs will let you look over their shoulder at what they are seeing on their monitor.

Good reason to find another Manhattan lab ... I've been looking at websites for labs all over the country today.
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#6 HelenOster

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Posted 02 November 2008 - 10:38 PM

To date, if I've wanted to print something I've either used my 6-color HP inkjet printer or sent them out to Adorama. I've been pretty happy with the results. The cameras used have all been advanced "point and shoots" (or film).

I've now been shooting a D700 dSLR for a bit and need to make a bunch of very high quality prints - several of them quite large ... from 16 x 20 up to 30 x 40 ... and I'm wondering if there's a "better" way.

I shoot 14-bit RAW and import to Lightroom which I run on hardware-calibrated high-end laptops (with about 45% coverage of the AdobeRGB color space). In the past, I would process to my heart's content, ultimately export an 8-bit sRGB TIFF and send it to Adorama allowing them to do image/color correction.

Should I:

A) Export 8-bit sRGB TIFFs and send to Adorama and keep letting them do image correction

B) Export 8-bit sRGB TIFFs and send to Adorama and tell them not to touch them

C) Export 8-bit sRGB TIFFs and send them to someone else ... any suggestions?

D) Export 8-bit AdobeRGB or PhotoProRGB and send them to someone else who can handle wider gamut files

E) Something else entirely

If I were to do D) and the lab doesn't do image/color correction, I'm asking for trouble given my hardware limitations, right?

Any advice or lab recommendations would be most appreciated.

Thanks!



Dear Jeremy

I mentioned your posting to our Director at Adoramapix; if you'd like to contact me directly, we would like to see what we can do to help.

Sincerely

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador
helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
Sincerely

Helen Oster

Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador

helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
www.adorama.com

#7 jeremypayne

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Posted 03 November 2008 - 04:09 AM

Dear Jeremy

I mentioned your posting to our Director at Adoramapix; if you'd like to contact me directly, we would like to see what we can do to help.

Sincerely

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador
helen.oster@adoramacamera.com

Pretty cool ... I'll be in touch today.

Thanks!
Jeremy Payne
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#8 fgaston

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 02:03 PM

Pretty cool ... I'll be in touch today.

Thanks!


Jeremy:
What was the upshot of your discussion with Adorama? I'm about to upload pictures and would like to know your recommendations on Photoshop settings.
Thanks, Fred

#9 jeremypayne

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 09:52 PM

Jeremy:
What was the upshot of your discussion with Adorama? I'm about to upload pictures and would like to know your recommendations on Photoshop settings.
Thanks, Fred

In the end, I got a bunch of stuff printed there as I couldn't resist $4.95 per 16x20.

Here's exactly what I did ... I had the selects in a smart collection in Lightroom. I would open each as a smart object in CS, change the image/canvas to 16 x 20, proof for color in the appropriate printer/paper output profile using a calibrated and sorta wide gamut display (97% of NTSC) - when happy, I would convert to an 8-bit JPEG with their printer profile as the embedded color space.

20 prints, no surprises - very happy with the results. The big metallic prints look REALLY cool and the Pro Lustre look terrific as well. The color is exactly what I expected.

Their printers/papers do not like the blues we find underwater, but otherwise almost everything converted into their profiles without needing much love.

I think stuff with a lot of blue water would be better served by a nice EPSON inkjet ... seems to me their inkset covers the blues of the underwater world better.
Jeremy Payne
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#10 fgaston

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 05:20 PM

In the end, I got a bunch of stuff printed there as I couldn't resist $4.95 per 16x20.

Here's exactly what I did ... I had the selects in a smart collection in Lightroom. I would open each as a smart object in CS, change the image/canvas to 16 x 20, proof for color in the appropriate printer/paper output profile using a calibrated and sorta wide gamut display (97% of NTSC) - when happy, I would convert to an 8-bit JPEG with their printer profile as the embedded color space.

Many thanks Jeremy for the info. Just a couple more questions:
1. When you opened as Smart Object in CS, did you convert profile at that point from ProPhoto RGB to sRGB first or directly to the printer profile?
2. I'm not too familiar with upsizing. Seems like if you use Image Size function and choose Constrain Proportions, you get no choice about what portion of the picture to keep. Do you uncheck Constrain Proportions or does that distort the pciture. I tired cropping to new size and that allows me to select what to keep, but I'm assuming the quality wouldn't be as good?
3. Would you recommend Metallic for certain things vs. Pro Lustre (would Landscapes be cool in Metallic?)
4. Would you then return to LR or save as jpeg right from CS?
Many thanks, Fred

#11 Stewart L. Sy

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Posted 21 November 2008 - 01:59 PM

Highest quality large format photographic prints right now are achieved using the new Pigmented large format printers from Epson, Canon and HP. the Epsons and HPs have a colour gamut that is larger than Adobe RGB let alone sRGB.

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#12 raylisa25

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Posted 07 February 2011 - 09:43 PM

Highest quality large format photographic prints right now are achieved using the new Pigmented large format printers from Epson, Canon and HP.Please can anyone have any idea about best quality photographic prints.

photographic prints

#13 henrykipson

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 11:30 PM

Hello...i am here looking for fine art printing.Please suggest me high quality paper and printer to get high and fine art printing.

fine art printing

#14 okuma

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Posted 06 April 2011 - 06:35 PM

Don't over look Costco for dollar quality prints.

You can down load their profiles and they print on Fuji Crystal.
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#15 TomR1

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Posted 07 April 2011 - 07:35 PM

I print on an Epson Stylus Photo R2400 right out of Photoshop (.psd). Reportedly EPSON prints best at 360dpi. I use epson glossy 5* paper. You can print 13" width any length. I think that the R2400 is a bit long in the tooth these days and a newer model might be advisable. The big advantage is I can print, adjust and reprint to get what I want.

#16 philsokol

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Posted 08 April 2011 - 08:35 AM

I'm no expert when it comes to printing, but I have to agree with okuma - really look at Costco in terms of bang for the buck. The quality is pretty darn good for most applications. 8x10 or 12 for $1.49? 12x18 for $2.99? C'mon!

Now, if I'm printing for a contest or for some snazzy display (gallery, etc.), I'll still use my professional local printers who let me look over their shoulders for any fine-tuning and color tweaking. They do all the mounting too.

Phil

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