19 replies to this topic

[echeng]

I just returned from NAB 2010, and it was absolutely crammed with new 3D products. Considering that no one knew whether 3D would make it even a year ago, it was an incredible leap in progress and popularity. 3D is here to stay, and we need to start doing it underwater at a consumer level.

Discuss!

[Mike L]

Great idea Eric for the new category. I guess unlike the dive shows, it was a bit more difficult to just bump into each other at NAB. 3d was definitely a big hit and very interesting to see the new products coming out. Panasonic has a nice 3d camera coming out ($20k price range) that is the same body size as an HVX200, only longer with the dual lens set up. Sure hope we can get that bad boy underwater by the end of this year!

[photovan]

I've been asked to shoot some samples with a fuji 3DW1,
just got the seatool housing delivered the other day.

Have had the camera for a week or so, and it's lotsa fun.

Looking forward to getting it UW asap.

[Scubamoose]

Sounds great Darren!
Hope to see some results soon

Cheers
Karel

[Mary Lynn]

Just now back from NAB and had such a fantastic time!

Spent some time questioning one of the GoPro guys at their booth (more like a pavilion) about editing 3D HD and distributing it. Also had a great conversation with a Sony guy about some of their 3D post solutions, including 3D editing and 3D Blu-Ray authoring that is well within reach of prosumer budgets. (Expect that Apple may be up to something in the 3D editing area as well, but just speculation at this point.)

Then went to the Red User gathering at the Tropicana where Red 3D was being shown and discussed. Wow!!

Interesting that *both* the GoPro 3D guy and the Red User 3D guy said that Cineform was used to prep their 3D footage for editing in Final Cut Pro. (Looking into understanding this whole process better....)

And the GoPro 3D guy referred me to YouTube's new experimental 3D effort, which I think is very interesting!

Here are some further links on the YouTube thing:

A YouTube intro video on their experimental 3D effort.

YouTube's "Now in 3D: Join the Experiment with Us!" blog entry.

If you do a "3D" search on YouTube you get all kinds of experimental 3D efforts...

Now, this is YouTube, I know, but definitely an indication of how far-reaching this 3D thing is likely to be.

And one of the best parts of this year's NAB (besides, of course, having lunch with Eric Cheng) was catching some of Ray Kurzweil's talk, "Acceleration of Technology in the 21st Century: The Impact on Media, Communications , and Society."

So much to learn, and so much tinkering to do!

- Mary Lynn

[jonny shaw]

I got to play with the panny 3D cam last Tues at an ACS meeting, it is very cool! And looks reasonably straight forward to house.... just needs a big flat port on the front.

I'm sure the guys at Apple, Adobe, Avid and Canopus are all working on an editing solution for 3D. I also heard from Sony that the next playstation will be 3D.

Just if you didn't have to wear the glasses.......

[Mary Lynn]

Some of the better YouTube 3D vids can be seen on inouek3D's Channel (including some tests with GoPro HD cam 3D.)

I'm viewing with Red/Cyan glasses, but would like to view the YouTube "Row interleave" version. Anyone know what kind of glasses I would need for that and where I might get them?

- ML

[Drew]

Hmmm I know with Avatar's success, 3D is clearly ascendant. However, with the 3DTV only allow 2-4 sets of glasses, which precludes a bigger viewing home audience, the inconvenience of wearing glasses to watch entertainment and of course the added expense, I wonder whether it is the future or just a feature subset of HDTV, which is clearly the now.
That said, quite a few productions are now shooting in 3D and 2D to cover the bases. I think theatrical releases with have a huge influx of 3D releases, I'm not sure home entertainment will catch on though.

[echeng]

I think 3D is going to be much more popular in the short run on handheld devices: phones, tablets, hand-held gaming machines. One person in front of a small display makes it easy for lenticular display, and since most content on those devices is generated by a computer, 3D content is unlimited and easy to produce.

I also think 3D will be popular in TV-based gaming, since console gaming typically only involves 2-4 people actively staring at a set (and not moving very much, unless you're a Nintendo person).

Casual TV watching is probably going to be the hardest market for widespread 3D adoption.

Mary Lynn -- thanks again for those YouTube links. I found them when they were first announced, but never bothered to give the service a try!

[Steve Douglas]

No question that 3D is the coming thing but like Beta vs VHS, HD vs BluRay the industry has to settle upon a 3D standard. Right now there are several different 3D technologies. For those who use any of the FX Factory Pro plug ins for Final Cut( which are really quite good), one of the plug ins is from a company called Dashwood Cinema Solutions Stereo 3D. It has been out for some time now. Never tried it myself however.

There is also increasing awareness of the apparently large percentage of people who have monocular vision for whom 3D will not work and lately it has been on the news that fear of epileptic seizures, caused by the 3D technology, is growing. Never the less, I personally look forward to learning more about the shooting and editing workflows. It is an exciting time in the industry.
Steve

[Mary Lynn]

What's interesting to me about the YouTube 3D experiment is that YouTube will do all the 3D processing in a variety of different 3D formats, and make those different formats available to viewers via a drop down menu.

To answer my own question above about how to view "Row interleaved" 3D, apparently this format of 3D stereoscopic processing can be viewed quite well on a Zalman stereoscopic 3D LCD monitor with related glasses.

Reading a very good primer right now on some of the basics of 3D called "3D Movie Making, Stereoscopic Digital Cinema from Script to Screen" by Bernard Mendiburu, published by Focal Press. Picked it up at the NAB store, and it has turned out to be quite intelligible and helpful in getting a handle on some of this stuff.

There have been some interesting developments in the processing of 3D with Jim Cameron's Avatar that are not reflected in this book, which was published while Avatar was still in production. A very brief writeup on Cameron's developments can found here in TV Technology magazine.

Studies continue...

- Mary Lynn

[Steve Douglas]

Hey ML....Will tell Focal Press to send the book to me, any other you recommend?
The Youtube videos were pretty impressive and I was just looking through the cheapo cardboard red/blue lens.
Steve

[echeng]

That book is $40 for the Kindle version! WHOAH.

[Mary Lynn]

Yes, but much cheaper than repairing my wall from banging my head against it trying to sort this stuff out!

And it's not a very big book at that. But have to say it's packed with great info!

I'll post about more good resources as I come across them, and hope others will do the same!

Still trying to grasp all the implications of the Cameron/Pace stereography discovery...

- ML

[UW3D]

"3D is here to stay, and we need to start doing it underwater at a consumer level."

Eric,

As you can imagine, I could not agree more. I have been waiting 25 years for some more company in this awsome niche...now the mainstream is finally catching up. Thanks for establishing the forum.

Someone mentioned shooting the Fuji W1 underwater. I tested it last September in the SeaTool housing and I think I posted a brief review. Other than the fact it's a consumer camera, and all that entails, the biggest limitation is that you are shooting lenses which are the equivalent of 35mm focal length (in full frame DSLR format) behind a flat port with a 77mm stereo base. Doing the math, you quickly see you can't get too close to your subject without introducing serious stretch! Nevertheless, for anyone wanting to try shoot UW 3D stills and video with a minimum investment (approximately $1,100) just to start learning, this is undoubtedly it. Add the Fuji HDP-L1 (http://www.crunchgear.com/2010/04/22/fujifilm-now-lets-you-view-3d-pics-taken-with-its-real-3d-w1-on-3d-tvs/) and it becomes really easy to play your 3d stills and video on the Panasonic 3D TV!

The folks on the DIY forum may be a help for people wanting to implement other than off the shelf 3D solutions, such as for macro. Personally, macro has always been my favorite because the close spaced lenes of the stereo macro camera allows you to see a macro 3D world in a way you never could with your own wide set eyes.

Best regards,
Mark
www.undersea3d.com

[fred_a99]

This is amazing stuff! I'm worried though, looking at the size of all that 3d equipment at NAB, its going to be quite a bit of work to take it down underwater. I already have a hard time traveling the globe with my minimal video setup, I wonder what it will be like traveling with almost twice that amount of equipment. Things do seem to be getting smaller fast, but until such time, maybe I can cheat with a software solution instead? Is there a Final Cut plugin that can generate 3d from 2d

[photovan]

...
Someone mentioned shooting the Fuji W1 underwater...
Best regards,
Mark
www.undersea3d.com

the Fuji camera is fun and i think a interesting and inexpensive intro into this new version of an old art. Its 35mm equiv lenses behind flat ports were always going to present challenges UW.

Twin Polarised Kodak Carousels and 3D 2-slide viewers were never that common....

[Kimmeineche]

Hey wetpixelmemebers!

Nice to see a 3D-section on wetpixel. I'm very excited to see what's showing up here in the next months/years and Yes... this is heavy stuff and really complicated to travel with. So far, it's the reason why I have only been using my homebuild rig (about 15kg. above water... Take a look in the DIY section to see/read more about!) in waters that I could reach by car/boat. I would definaitely like to go to the Red Sea by plane in the future, so hopefully I'll figure out how to pack it well! :-)

All the best from Kim Meineche! :-)

This is amazing stuff! I'm worried though, looking at the size of all that 3d equipment at NAB, its going to be quite a bit of work to take it down underwater. I already have a hard time traveling the globe with my minimal video setup, I wonder what it will be like traveling with almost twice that amount of equipment. Things do seem to be getting smaller fast, but until such time, maybe I can cheat with a software solution instead? Is there a Final Cut plugin that can generate 3d from 2d

Edited by Kimmeineche, 27 April 2010 - 12:36 AM.

[chris.evans]

Hi guys,

I can field some questions about s3d. In the past I have made some UW s3d rigs out of s95s, but I had to clang the bar to sync and they drift quite a bit (will look around and upload examples).

I just got the gopro s3d housing/sync cable, talking to the EyeOfMine guys about a flat lens housing for it.

Anyway, I have been into s3d photography for a while and even worked on the film mentioned above! Just joined here because I am going on a 1.5 month diving vacation and want to make sure I have the right gear that will last.

CE

[tdpriest]

Like Hollywood, a technology in search of an application? What can 3D contribute in an environment where the close-up is almost mandatory?

Tim