Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

3d filming


  • Please log in to reply
6 replies to this topic

#1 jorgeantoniomw

jorgeantoniomw

    Hermit Crab

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 4 posts

Posted 04 June 2011 - 06:41 PM

do you consider that a SI-2k with a hydroflex housing and a Panasonic 3d-a1 with a gates housing are good enough for filming something "world class"? Anyone interested in talking about this? Iím looking for feedback and potential film opportunities, would need divers to film. PM please
__________________
Jorge A. MAHAUAD

-------------------------------------------
Advanced Diving in the Galapagos Islands
Recreational & Technical Diver Training
Galapagos Rebreather Trips and Expeditions
Underwater Exploration and Diver Support
-------------------------------------------

www.galapagosrebreathers.com
www.advancedgalapagosdiving.com

#2 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10596 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 04 June 2011 - 09:48 PM

Jorge, the SI 2k is nice camera but when it comes to noise performance, I think the Red One/EpicX has better ISO performance, not to mention compactness. And those 2 things make for better underwater shooting.
I personally see the Panasonic A1 as limited. The codec is not broadcast approved, so you'd have to add something like a Nano 3D to capture broadcast quality images. Then there's the focus issue where you can't focus closer than 4.5 ft. Not to mention it's a single sensor camera.
A beam splitter, dual sensor unit with either Iconix or Thomson (etc) sensors and RAW output is going to beat it, albeit at a slightly higher cost, but the results are just higher resolution AND one can focus closer (especially with a beam splitter housing).
Yes the housing would have to be custom but something like the Patima 3Diver, which was modified to fit Thomson sensors work well. The 3DA1 is a dual lens single sensor camera, designed to be compact but the picture isn't all that great with AVCHD. Plus the FOV is narrow at 47mm.
If you want 3D, you may wish to check out the Sony HXR-NX3D1, which is the professional version of the HDR-TD10 3D camera. That's out in the next few months. Or the JVC GSTD1BUS's professional twin, the GY-HMZ1U, which is out in the fall.
Neither of these cameras have the bells and whistles of the 3DA1, but they have better codecs and resolution and in the end, it's the final image that counts. Housings can be made for cameras.

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#3 CheungyDiver

CheungyDiver

    Tiger Shark

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 599 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Singapore
  • Interests:Lots. I take things apart, modify things and make things.

Posted 05 June 2011 - 12:48 AM

do you consider that a SI-2k with a hydroflex housing and a Panasonic 3d-a1 with a gates housing are good enough for filming something "world class"? Anyone interested in talking about this? Iím looking for feedback and potential film opportunities, would need divers to film. PM please
__________________
Jorge A. MAHAUAD

-------------------------------------------
Advanced Diving in the Galapagos Islands
Recreational & Technical Diver Training
Galapagos Rebreather Trips and Expeditions
Underwater Exploration and Diver Support
-------------------------------------------

www.galapagosrebreathers.com
www.advancedgalapagosdiving.com


Hello Jorge

Are you interested in the Side by side or Beamsplitter configuration? SI-2K mini could be configured to do both. Its a nice system and my friends shoot films and commercials with these. The Panasonic and other integrated dual sensors 3D camcorders is side by side and is limited in terms of how close you could shoot. Most of these will have the two lenses set at 65mm apart which is the average distance between two eyeballs on a human face (there are variations of course). For UW most shot are close up even for wide angle. To shoot closer then the two sensor distance or the interaxial (or Interoccular by some)distance has to be closer - one of the reason why Gates has added a port for the Zunow lens for the Pany housing. If you really want to shoot close and medium to wide shots then the Beamsplitter (mirror) is a must but very demanding to setup and use.

Try looking up Element Technica rigs such as the Atom. There is a Hydroflex UW housing- called the "borg"(due the similarity to Star Trek's borg cube) made for that... You are talking about paying big wanda for these rigs. I think they could be rented. Element Technica and Hydro-flex are associate companies. I would love to try one.

World class? It all depend on what you want out of the equipment. SI-2K could record two times HD resolution and with Cinedeck you could record raw video and process in post. Slumdog Millionaire is partly shot with this setup although not for 3D but for handheld running street scenes. 3D filming is quite challenging for the big screen. I assumed that you are familiar with 3D stereoscopy. There really is no standard at the moment for what kind of 3D to set for UW footage. Eye popping negative parallax 3D or normal positive parallax 3D? What is good for the big screen may not be good for even a 60 inch TV screen. Screen size must be considered when shooting footage.

Shooting underwater is even more difficult as distances and angles will all change compare to equipment set up on land. The 3Diver rig mentioned by Drew is one of my customized 3D UW rigs. It is almost as small as the ETechnica/ Hydroflex Borg. It takes two Thomson 2/3 inch sensors and each will need a controller and recorder. I use the nano 3D recorder but now with Atomos Ninja and others you have more choice. Convergent Design is even coming out with a cheaper version for 3D. The mechanical parts like a beamsplitter will need fine tuning of the three axis ( XYZ). Anyone of these out of alignment will show up on the big screen. Post production could fix some but not all these problems. Other controls will be required to set the interaxial distance between the two sensors and also the convergence setting. It is constant job tweaking my system to work better. I am still working on a better control for the Iris and focus gear. Both camera must work in identical manner. I tried using two miniature stepper motors but found these to go slightly out of sync over time. So it is best with mechanical gears.

Perhaps the most important thing about 3D system is that they must sync together at every level. You will need Genlock feature through HD SDI connectors with the cameras. Two camera must be tuned and recording identically...I will stop soon. One videocam you could look at if you do not know already is Canon XF 105. It is only single chip 1/3 sensor but records at 422 with HD SDi and could Genlock with another XF 105. The two camera could also be paired and controlled using one IR remote control. The most impressive is 3D control feature such as the Optical Axis shift of the camera zoom lens. It basically allow two lenses to track at exactly the same point on the subject. Professional matched pairs of zoom lenses will cost a small house. I just bought two of the XF105 am looking into building a beamsplitter rig and UW housing for this camera. I'll stop now......

cheers

David

Edited by CheungyDiver, 05 June 2011 - 02:59 AM.

Proprietor of Scubacam, Singapore. Commercial videocameraman. Also shoot digital stills. I modify and built stuff. I love technology. Camera: Red Epic/ Scarlet and soon Dragon

Email: info@scubacam.com.sg

http://www.scubacam.com.sg/


#4 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10596 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 05 June 2011 - 09:38 AM

Thanks David. I keep thinking SI2k as the big one and forget they have the minis.

I thought the Neutron = Borg? I know people who have rented the Si2k Hawkeye 3D rig with underwater rig.

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#5 CheungyDiver

CheungyDiver

    Tiger Shark

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 599 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Singapore
  • Interests:Lots. I take things apart, modify things and make things.

Posted 05 June 2011 - 05:53 PM

Thanks David. I keep thinking SI2k as the big one and forget they have the minis.

I thought the Neutron = Borg? I know people who have rented the Si2k Hawkeye 3D rig with underwater rig.



Thanks for the correction Drew. It is indeed the Neutron. Getting forgetful I got mixed up with their atomic names. The Atom is for the Red Epic and Gates is building a housing for it. Should costs a kidney or two :)

Cheers

David

Proprietor of Scubacam, Singapore. Commercial videocameraman. Also shoot digital stills. I modify and built stuff. I love technology. Camera: Red Epic/ Scarlet and soon Dragon

Email: info@scubacam.com.sg

http://www.scubacam.com.sg/


#6 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10596 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 05 June 2011 - 06:17 PM

In China , a kidney is worth an iPad and an iPhone plus change:


http://www.bbc.co.uk...acific-13647438

If only it were that cheap! :)

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#7 wagsy

wagsy

    Blue Whale

  • Senior Moderator
  • 3845 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Cairns, Queensland.
  • Interests:Sewing and Knitting......no diving of course :-)

Posted 05 June 2011 - 06:24 PM

Drew thats pretty sad a kid did that.
Would of got better value for money if he got a Google Android and Smart Pad though....lol
Amphibico Phenom & EVO PRO & Navigator 900
Share Your Underwater Videos www.hdvunderwater.com | www.flykam.com.au | www.reeftorainforest.com.au