13 replies to this topic

[curlywurly321]

Hi,

I'm after some advice on a potential set-up.

I'm going to be away travelling around Borneo and Indonesia for 3 months, leaving in approx a month, I'll be diving and snorkelling and I'd like to try out surf photograpghy as well, although surf is definately a like to rather than a must, diving's my main underwater photo interest.

I'm primarily interested in wa, but I realise that some of the locations I'm going to are good macro sites so I'd like to keep my options open. I already have an Oly E-PL2 and am looking at housing options for it, I've settled on the Oly housing as others are a lot more expensive. I'm thinking the best option for what I'm after is the following

E-PL2 with 14-42 lens (already have these)
Sea and Sea YS110 (already have this from a previous uw set-up)
Oly housing
Oly Macro adapater and lens
Zen dome port and 9-18mm lens

What do people think about this set-up? I imagine most of the time I'll have it set up as wa with the zen port but when I know there are a lot of macro opportunities I can swap back to the oly port and lens (I know there is a zen macro port but I can't afford both). Do people think it's worth bothering with the macro lens, should I just make do without as this would save me quite a bit of money!

Also a silly question but do I need the zoom ring as well? Oly do one for their port but I can't find one for the Zen port, does this mean that I can't zoom when it's in the housing with the Zen port?

I'll also be using it on land as well, are there any other lenses I should get ie a pancake lens, or will the two zoom lenses be sufficient?

Sorry for the long post and lots of questions but this is once in a lifetime trip and I want to make sure I have the best set-up I can manage as I can't imagine I'll get the option to get anything else to add to it while I'm travelling!

Thanks,

[guyharrisonphoto]

I shoot with the standard zoom and the macro adapter and Oly close-up diopter. This allows you to screw in the diopter lens to the adapter and leave that on with a cap in place on the diopter. It becomes very versatile. You leave it on as a "lens cap" underwater. You remove it to shoot wide angle photos with the standard zoom. You put it back on on and remove the cover from the diopter and you have a pretty decent macro set-up. It is really ideal for what it sounds like you are going to do.

I would think about other options than getting the zen port for the 9-18 mm. I know you say your primary interest is WA, but you have only one flash, and a small one at that (not criticising, I have the same one), and that will limit your ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) angle shooting. Also, having been there, I would suggest that you will, pretty rapidly, become far more fascinated by the macro world and will want to spend considerable effort there. Indonesia is a true macro lover's paradise and THE world-class destination for fascinating macro critters. So, here is what I would suggest.

Stick with the 9-18mm in the standard port. Oly designed the standard port to work with that lens and it does very well, although with maybe not as good results at 9-10mm as with the zen port. However, using the standard port also allows you to use the macro adapter and diopter with the 9-18mm zoom in place. This gives you more versatility by a long shot as you can go very wide (12mm) with excellent quality, and super wide with acceptable quality, but still can do close-ups, all on a single dive. Can't do that with the Zen dome.

Instead of the zen port for the wide angle, you can look for a used Panasonic/Leica 45mm dedicated macro. This works in the standard port (Autofocus only, no big deal) and is a fantastic solution for macro/ultramacro with the highest quality. That lens is simply amazing for macro work.

So: at least consider this option:

Oly Housing and standard port
The ys-01 Flash
Macro adapter and lens
9-18mm lens
Pany/Leica 45mm macro lens
No extra ports.

Now, if this the trip of a lifetime, you might want to add the zen dome port for the 9-18mm. This would also be really good for surf/wave shooting form inside the wave.

Please understand that the set-up I suggest will sacrifice a little quality on the ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) end, but maximize quality on the wide-normal-macro end, all the while allowing very versatile shooting from wide to macro with either the 9-18 or the 14-42 on a single dive. For that, you trade off the ultimate ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) angle quality of using the Zen dome port. That port, however, will not allow you to use the macro diopter lens with the 9-18mm (reducing versatility), and the cost will be almost equal to the Pany/leica macro lens. So, I would go for the extra lens (lenses are what make our images after all).

I can also tell you that with only 1 YS-01 flash you are not going to be doing much serious ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) angle work as you really need two flashes for that. That is another reason to weight your purchases towards wide-normal-macro as opposed to ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel).

As for an on-land lens, you can add the excellent Oly 40-150 at a very modest cost. That covers 35mm equivalent range from 18-300 with a dedicated macro/portrait 90mm lens. Be sure to get polarizing filters for all your lenses for above-water use.

I think you would be very well served with this. It would give you the range from ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) (with some sacrifice in quality) through wide (12mm) to normal (42mm) with excellent quality, the ability to do general macro and wide shots on the same dive, and, finally, a dedicated ultra-macro of superior quality.

I am envious!!

[Phil Rudin]

I disagree with guyharris, first the macro adapter is a 67 mm close-up lens even the 14 to 42 lens vignettes past about 35 mm or so. To think that the close-up lens would work well on the 9 to18 with the macro adapter is just wrong. The 9-18 vignettes to at least 12 mm with the standard flat port and results in very poor image quality over the ZEN 9-18 port. Check the attached link for additional info and sample photos.

I am also not a big fan of the standard port for the Panasonic 45 macro because the lens sits to far inside the housing from the port glass and tends to hut much more the closer you get to the subject. By this I mean that it tends to try to focus on the port glass and not on the subject at very close range.

Last I would consider the Inon or ReefNet close-up lenses over the less powerful Olympus close-up lenses.

http://www.zenunderw...ts.php?prodID=5

Phil Rudin

[guyharrisonphoto]

I disagree with guyharris, first the macro adapter is a 67 mm close-up lens even the 14 to 42 lens vignettes past about 35 mm or so. To think that the close-up lens would work well on the 9 to18 with the macro adapter is just wrong. The 9-18 vignettes to at least 12 mm with the standard flat port and results in very poor image quality over the ZEN 9-18 port. Check the attached link for additional info and sample photos.

I am also not a big fan of the standard port for the Panasonic 45 macro because the lens sits to far inside the housing from the port glass and tends to hut much more the closer you get to the subject. By this I mean that it tends to try to focus on the port glass and not on the subject at very close range.

Last I would consider the Inon or ReefNet close-up lenses over the less powerful Olympus close-up lenses.

http://www.zenunderw...ts.php?prodID=5

Phil Rudin

Phil,

I could not tell from the photos on the Zen site, but do they have a zoom gear for the 9-18 port? What about the 45mm port? I am thinking about both of these but want to know if there is any way to zoom or manual focus.

My comments to the original post were just my thoughts on a compromise system for his budget. All three lenses will work in the standard port, but, like you said, not perfectly for everything and (like I said) he will lose some on the wide end, but gain on the macro end. Like you, my preference would be all three lenses and all three dedicated ports (I will get there myself, one day).

[chris_l]

Phil,

I could not tell from the photos on the Zen site, but do they have a zoom gear for the 9-18 port? What about the 45mm port? I am thinking about both of these but want to know if there is any way to zoom or manual focus.

My comments to the original post were just my thoughts on a compromise system for his budget. All three lenses will work in the standard port, but, like you said, not perfectly for everything and (like I said) he will lose some on the wide end, but gain on the macro end. Like you, my preference would be all three lenses and all three dedicated ports (I will get there myself, one day).

Not Phil, but I can answer that.
The 14-42II and the 9-18 use the same oly zoom gear and both work in the zen WA 100 port.
I just used this combo for the first time last week. Mostly shot with the 9-18, but shot some with 14-42 all in zen port. Just move the zoom gear from one lense to the other. Works well.
My best shots came from the 14-42 but that had more to do with me screwing up the WA shots than the lenses.
I didn't have a lot of time to learn camera and system before trip.

[Phil Rudin]

The Olympus gear 14-42/9-18 works fine with the ZEN Underwater 9-18 dome port (which also works very well with the 14-42 and provides better image quality without a close-up lens). I am sure an Olympus style gear can be made for the Panasonic 45 macro but I have not yet seen one yet.

Phil

[guyharrisonphoto]

The Olympus gear 14-42/9-18 works fine with the ZEN Underwater 9-18 dome port (which also works very well with the 14-42 and provides better image quality without a close-up lens). I am sure an Olympus style gear can be made for the Panasonic 45 macro but I have not yet seen one yet.

Phil

Thanks Chris and Phil. The reason I asked is that the 45mm and the 14-42 seem almost identically long. If the 14-42 would work in the port for the 45mm, with the front of the lens so close to the glass (maybe right on it), that would make a close up lens screwed into the 67mm threads even more effective, and also make the housing much more compact. Also, maybe the OLY wide angle lens could also work, for a "one dive" ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) to macro set-up, with the 45mm to be used for ultra-macro. This would be much more economical and versatile than having to choose between a dedicated ultra-wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) solution, and a dedicated macro solution.

What do you think? Can anyone test the 14-24 inside the Zen 45mm port to see if it works (it is at its maximum length at the wide and tele ends, and seems to be the same length at each end). If it does fit, could the Oly zoom gear be cut or modified to fit the 14-42 inside the port?

[bullshark]

I am sure an Olympus style gear can be made for the Panasonic 45 macro but I have not yet seen one yet.
Phil

Why would there be a zoom gear for the 45 macro? It doesn't zoom, so why would you need a gear?

[Deep6]

Why would there be a zoom gear for the 45 macro? It doesn't zoom, so why would you need a gear?

Focus!

[JackConnick]

There isn't a focus gear available for it for the Zen Macro port.

I would agree that the Zen dome is pretty essential to get the most out of the 9-18 and works wonders with the 14-42II as well. I think you can get away without the Zen macro port unless you are getting the Pany lens for it as well - which would be very nice to have where you are going. But good results can be had with the 14-42 set to 42mm and a strong diopter.

You may be wishing for another strobe if you are going to shoot w/a with the 9mm lens though.

I would put the pancake lens on the "nice to have" list, well behind getting a second strobe.

Jack

Edited by JackConnick, 20 July 2011 - 08:02 AM.

[nudibranco]

There isn't a focus gear available for it for the Zen Macro port.

I would agree that the Zen dome is pretty essential to get the most out of the 9-18 and works wonders with the 14-42II as well. I think you can get away without the Zen macro port unless you are getting the Pany lens for it as well - which would be very nice to have where you are going. But good results can be had with the 14-42 set to 42mm and a strong diopter.

You may be wishing for another strobe if you are going to shoot w/a with the 9mm lens though.

I would put the pancake lens on the "nice to have" list, well behind getting a second strobe.

Jack

The ZEN port is perfect for for both the 9-18mm and 14-42mm lenses. The macro setup works only with 14-42 lenses and both kit port and zen port. With the zen port you can use the standard PMLA adapter with a bit of velcro or stickers to provide the mm of delta necessary to fit tight. I also have a couple of rubber bands to make sure the macro adapter stays snug on the port. The ZEN port is always better with respect to the original port and I never change it. For the macro lenses the INONs can be stacked for maximum magnification or REEFNET or EPOQUE have strong magnification. This has been my experience... I am tempted to get the 45mm macro lens from PAnasonic and try it as well behind the dome port. I wished there was an Olympus macro lens coming with a bit more of "throw" like a 55mm or 60 mm macro lens. It would be perfect for some of the fish I can get close to but not close enough....

Edited by nudibranco, 20 July 2011 - 10:33 AM.

[guyharrisonphoto]

I tested my theory that the 14-42mm standard lens might work in the Zen macro port for the 45mm lens. The zoom does NOT work in this port. The port is just a hair too short and the zoom "bumps" at each end of the range (where the lens is physically the longest), giving a pretty useless small useable zoom range in the middle.

That is a shame. If the Zen port were just 1/8 inch longer, both lenses would work, and it would give a much more compact solution than the standard port. It would allow "standard" range scenic shooting, with macro available by using a diopter, plus a "pure" ultra-macro solution with the 45mm. That would be a $400 no-brainer for me, but with the port limited to just one specialty lens, not so much.

Zen, are you listening? How about revising this port to be just a hair longer and work with both lenses? Then, you would have two killer solutions: a standard/macro solution with the flat port, or an ultrawide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel)-standard solution with the dome port. Two ports would cover it all, and we could trash the standard bulky compromise OLY port entirely and just the use the two optinum solutions.

[nudibranco]

I tested my theory that the 14-42mm standard lens might work in the Zen macro port for the 45mm lens. The zoom does NOT work in this port. The port is just a hair too short and the zoom "bumps" at each end of the range (where the lens is physically the longest), giving a pretty useless small useable zoom range in the middle.

That is a shame. If the Zen port were just 1/8 inch longer, both lenses would work, and it would give a much more compact solution than the standard port. It would allow "standard" range scenic shooting, with macro available by using a diopter, plus a "pure" ultra-macro solution with the 45mm. That would be a $400 no-brainer for me, but with the port limited to just one specialty lens, not so much.

Zen, are you listening? How about revising this port to be just a hair longer and work with both lenses? Then, you would have two killer solutions: a standard/macro solution with the flat port, or an ultrawide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel)-standard solution with the dome port. Two ports would cover it all, and we could trash the standard bulky compromise OLY port entirely and just the use the two optinum solutions.

Actually the standard port can accomodate both so I do not understand why ZEN should make an equal port to the one Olympus makes. The macro port is designed so the 45mm macro lens will work best and that is what was needed. If the port is too big for a macro lens than there are 2 problems: automatic focusing and too close the shortest focusing distance to the port lens.

[guyharrisonphoto]

Actually the standard port can accomodate both so I do not understand why ZEN should make an equal port to the one Olympus makes. The macro port is designed so the 45mm macro lens will work best and that is what was needed. If the port is too big for a macro lens than there are 2 problems: automatic focusing and too close the shortest focusing distance to the port lens.

The Zen port would not be equal, but much better. It would not have the huge bulbous front element that makes flash positioning so difficult for macro shooting. It would make the overall rig way more compact. It still would be optimized for the macro, but have much more practicality and versatility. Since we are only taking about extending the port by 1/8" it would not adversely affect the 45m working distance at all.

It would also make the port tremendously cost-effective. For the $500 dome port, you get the versatility of two lenses (ultra wide (weitwinkel) (weitwinkel) and standard zoom) without changing the port. Why not with the macro port as well?

Like I said, if it worked it would be a no-brainer instant purchase for me. Now, as a costly specialty item useable with only on lens, I not be purchasing anytime soon.