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#121 Paul Kay

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Posted 24 November 2011 - 01:25 AM

Sounds like the dome is as important if not more so then the lens itself. Perhaps more rightly, each is as important as the other.

As are aspects such as centering, accuracy of placement of the camera (I've seen some awful set-ups in the past) and all the other factors that affect alignment (some housings offer adjustment - I am thinking stills here as I obviously know Seacam housing which have small adjustable screws/shims which are normally preset in the factory but which can be adjusted - not recommended unless you really know what you are doing though) and these should all be checked if you know how to - the image from the Tokina shown above suggests that it isn't perfectly centered in the dome as it shows varying corners (could be due to lighting though, or even the lens itself). As for Dome sizes, well the larger the dome, the better for distance, but the more problematic close-ups might become - as ever its a trade-off and compromise. Domes similar to the Seacam Superdome probably represent a viable compromise, anything larger will become very unwieldy I would think.
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#122 Drew

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Posted 17 December 2011 - 12:13 PM

Scarlet X clips @ 1600ISO:

[vimeohd]33738228[/vimeohd]



[vimeohd]33766540[/vimeohd]

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#123 SimonSpear

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 04:01 AM

Six weeks after ordering I've finally had my price confirmed through RED Europe. In the UK a working set up (Scarlet Al Canon Mount, LCD, Redmote, DMSC Handle, Red Station, 2x64gb SSD, 4xRevolts, 2xchargers) including import duty, shipping and VAT is just a tad under 14,000 (US$23,000), and that set up still wouldn't even allow me shoot much more than 2 hours without considerable downtime to recharge batteries (2 hour recharge time for 30 min burn) and clear the SSD cards (about 35mins record time per 64gb SSD @ 4k). The downtime is a bad enough issue for underwater, but for topside shoots it is pretty much useless and with the price jumping up so much I've got to admit to having second thoughts. Not sure I can financially justify buying this now without it turning into a bit of a folly.... :)

Cheers, Simon
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#124 DeanB

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:11 AM

Six weeks after ordering I've finally had my price confirmed through RED Europe. In the UK a working set up (Scarlet Al Canon Mount, LCD, Redmote, DMSC Handle, Red Station, 2x64gb SSD, 4xRevolts, 2xchargers) including import duty, shipping and VAT is just a tad under 14,000 (US$23,000), and that set up still wouldn't even allow me shoot much more than 2 hours without considerable downtime to recharge batteries (2 hour recharge time for 30 min burn) and clear the SSD cards (about 35mins record time per 64gb SSD @ 4k). The downtime is a bad enough issue for underwater, but for topside shoots it is pretty much useless and with the price jumping up so much I've got to admit to having second thoughts. Not sure I can financially justify buying this now without it turning into a bit of a folly.... :)

Cheers, Simon
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Not from me bud ... Just have to work out if you REALLY need one to justify that expense ... They will come down in price and hire costs will probably not be too bad if you need one short term in the future... I'd cut my losses and wait a while.

14,000 !!! holy kin moly

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#125 Drew

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 08:01 AM

Simon, I'll bring you one in Mar for $20k! LOL

When you also add a Red Rocket card and/or a new computer to edit in R3D, dips into the $30k bracket pretty easily. Most people look at a one year pay off. Then again, the C300 is under 20k and shoots great. You may want to consider that.

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#126 TheRealDrew

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 10:43 AM

Simon, I'll bring you one in Mar for $20k! LOL

When you also add a Red Rocket card and/or a new computer to edit in R3D, dips into the $30k bracket pretty easily. Most people look at a one year pay off. Then again, the C300 is under 20k and shoots great. You may want to consider that.



I am still trying to figure out how they said Scarlet was going to be relatively inexpensive a couple of years back, and not much more than my Canon 5D Mark II. In fact people thought it was silly for me to buy the 5D since the Scarlet was going to be out "by the end of the year" like 3 years ago. Glad I did not wait :)

#127 DeanB

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 10:54 AM

I am still trying to figure out how they said Scarlet was going to be relatively inexpensive a couple of years back, and not much more than my Canon 5D Mark II. In fact people thought it was silly for me to buy the 5D since the Scarlet was going to be out "by the end of the year" like 3 years ago. Glad I did not wait :)


To be honest considering the spec it is, at 14k, still pretty affordable compared to other similar cams. As i keep bellowing it's down to needs and if they must then breakout the dosh ... Although I'd seriously wait until all the bad bits are ironed out.

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#128 TheRealDrew

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 11:27 AM

To be honest considering the spec it is, at 14k, still pretty affordable compared to other similar cams. As i keep bellowing it's down to needs and if they must then breakout the dosh ... Although I'd seriously wait until all the bad bits are ironed out.

Dean



No doubt the spec out is great. It was more the lead on/build up. Who knows, maybe one day I may grab one. I did hold off a bit on the 5D Mark II (not trying to compare specs/prices now, but at the time) in anticipation of the Scarlet based on the specs and prices of both at the time.

In fact someone gave me grief 2-1/2 years ago when I bought the 5D since Scarlet was coming :)

Drew your soon be selling 'AGAIN' to buy Scarlet... But then no one will be buying because they will want SCARLET as well...

Once again people... equipment will be upgraded every 6 months there will be a 5D MkIII soon with better video quality... For the money your paying look at Scarlet... Unless your loaded then buy everything...



#129 SimonSpear

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 12:44 PM

Haha yeah the Scarlet has changed quite a bit from the 3k for $3k hype from when is was first announced. Even 6 months ago they were stating that the 2/3 Scarlet would be around US$6k, but like they say everything is subject to change.

The Scarlet version that has has eventually been released is basically a little Epic. Even on the night of the 3rd Nov I still thought it would come in around $8k, well the brain announced at under $10k, but the basic shooting package took it up to $14k. To get it useable in the real world I still need to spend a few more thousand then add on top a 30% mark up for import tax and VAT and I'm starting to get panic attacks.

I would have been REALLY happy with the 2/3 sensor 3k Scarlet. REALLY happy. Oh well looks like the hype has faded, reality has kicked in and I've got a difficult choice to make.

#130 jonny shaw

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 01:26 PM

And that is without a housing...... yep it is a huge investment.

The 1600 ISO stuff looks good but that is on the web, I would like to see it on a big screen.

Can you not claim VAT back through your company Simon?

Regarding batteries I am actually probably going to go down the V mount route and grab globalmedia batteries and chargers, they are cheap an last ages. Plus on jobs nearly everyone has v mounts for back up.

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#131 Drew

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 01:27 PM

The offer stands Simon, but the price is up to $21k now... You missed out on the intro offer! :)

I think a lower priced 4k camera will be available in 4-5 years, probably sooner. Right now , 4k TVs cost around $10+k. I've seen them and they are gorgeous. The Epic/Scarlet cameras and Canon 4k solutions will be shooting home movies in a few years. Youtube has experimental 4k so if you can bet it's on the way. Unlike 3D, where only certain programming translates well, 4k will be more widely accepted.

The problem with Scarlet is @ 4k, it's shooting @ 25fps max. It's just a pity as I think 48fps will be the new standard for action features. But then by that time, the model between Epic X and Scarlet X should be announced by 2012. @ the Scarlet event, Jannard said Red is now moving towards being a tighter ship with on time deliveries of said models.

Now cameras like the C300 will probably have a shorter life because of the impending 4k revolution. But that's why it's cheaper than the Scarlet. It'll be very useful for 4 years and any professional who can't make back $20k in 4 years... well time to get another job.

I suppose it's ok to say this, as it's the 2nd worst kept secret, but even broadcasters are now looking for 4k shooters for their big series. If it'll be broadcast in 3-4 years time, shooting in 4k now would allow them to splash out in style and still be able to downrez to HD for HDTV.

The good thing is in 4 years time, computers should be fast enough to edit 4k like its HDV now.

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#132 SimonSpear

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 01:45 PM

Can you not claim VAT back through your company Simon?


Not VAT registered Jon and I don't have to register as the threshold is over 75k pa now (US$120). I could register, but then I'd have to charge 20% on top of everything and about half my customers would be pretty peed off with that!

#133 SimonSpear

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 01:50 PM

The offer stands Simon, but the price is up to $21k now... You missed out on the intro offer! :lol:


LOL thanks for the offer Drew! I've actually got US addresses that I can ship to, but it causes all kinds of issues with the tax man, so best avoid that! :)

Making the cash back on the investment over 4 years doesn't worry me at all, but lumping it all upfront does right now. The economy over here is worse than yours over there, Europe's in melt down, my assets have halved since 2008 and everything is doom and gloom. I've got to be very careful before I start shelling out that kind of cash and with the way things are right now I don't need another monthly overhead on lease or HP.

Thanks for your insights. Like I said got a lot of thinking to do!

Cheers, Simon

P.S. rumoured UK street price for the C300 is 9995.00, but as a stop gap something like a FS100 or AF101 could even be an option which are both half the price again....

Edited by SimonSpear, 18 December 2011 - 01:53 PM.


#134 Drew

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 02:44 PM

Err if I bring it in my suitcase in Aug, I think I'll bypass all your custom duties! :) $21500 now! :lol:

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#135 TheRealDrew

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 07:48 PM

Right now , 4k TVs cost around $10+k. I've seen them and they are gorgeous. The Epic/Scarlet cameras and Canon 4k solutions will be shooting home movies in a few years. Youtube has experimental 4k so if you can bet it's on the way. Unlike 3D, where only certain programming translates well, 4k will be more widely accepted.



I went to a couple of shows in NYC including the Canon Expo. While the 3D was kind of cool, the 4K Camera prototypes hooked up to the 4K Television was was indeed jaw dropping.

#136 John Doe

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Posted 25 December 2011 - 08:25 PM

The cost of the camera is nothing compared to the cost of the lens system!

Everything I've read says the Optimo 15-40mm is the one if you want a zoom. The housing cost from Gates is really quite reasonable if you compare it to the cost of a good high end fluid head and sticks.

All up .......about 120K! ...oh forgot about the taxes to import all this. Yikes! I'm far happier investing in the lens then the camera. Cameras come and go....a lens is forever.

Now after all the noise i'm considering dropping out of this as well. Not because i've had a change of heart blah blah blah. Where i dive there is a beautiful lodge in the most ideal location that has come on the market. I've had my eye on it for close to 15 years. The owners said they would NEVER sell.......now its come on the market for the first time since it was built 20 years ago. Its a lot of cash for sure but what a place to live!

So cant afford an over the top camera setup AND a lodge. Besides Dragon is on its way :-)

Decisions decisions.........

J.D

#137 Nick Hope

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 03:23 AM

Dragon?

#138 SimonSpear

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 12:02 PM

Dragon is the new RED sensor. It's due for release/upgrade some time in the next millennium! :)

#139 jonny shaw

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Posted 26 December 2011 - 03:56 PM

Dragon is the new RED sensor. It's due for release/upgrade some time in the next millennium! :)


LOL,

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#140 DeanB

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Posted 27 December 2011 - 04:27 AM

Dragon is the new RED sensor. It's due for release/upgrade some time in the next millennium! :)


So Scarlet will be obsolete then ... Then :)

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