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Sony CX700 VE white balance problems


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#1 Roydive

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 07:56 AM

I have a Sony CX700 VE in an Aquatica HDWave housing the Auto white balance is wonderful down to 15 meters BUT the one Push white balance at depths below this which used to work fine on my HDR HC3 produces a Red hue on everything. I am running it on a Low Lux setting, and the one push WB works fine on the Surface Both in and Out of the housing and in various light conditions.

Has anyone else had/solved similar problems ??

#2 r4e

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 10:23 AM

Some other Sony cameras (my MC50 included) have the same problem. In deeper water they try to overamplify the minuscule amounts of red light there is. A simple solution is to use something pinkish for white balancing, for example your own hand or a whiteboard partially covered by pink or even red. Another solution is to set the whitebalance at a slightly shallower depth whilst still descending to final depth. Consequently the camera will not attempt to overamplify the red.

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#3 Drew

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 10:38 AM

Can you post a capture jpg so we know what you are talking about? Makes it easier to diagnose.

MWB tends to fade after 15-18m depending on camera, especially without a filter. What are you pointing at for WB?

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#4 Roydive

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 11:26 AM

Can you post a capture jpg so we know what you are talking about? Makes it easier to diagnose.

MWB tends to fade after 15-18m depending on camera, especially without a filter. What are you pointing at for WB?

Ok I am using the same slate I used on my Sony HDR HC3 to Balance and it worked perfectly well to 35 - 40 m to some degree or another.
I have uploaded 2 photo's both of the same subject but 1 with the WB on auto and one on 1 push the One Push will be obvious from my description.
I have fitted the blue water filter which flips up and down on my housing so I will try balancing withe the red filter in place and then flipping it down .....what do you think ??

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  • Grabbed_Frame_2.jpg


#5 Roydive

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 11:32 AM

Oh by the way both were taken under light .....same light same setting same position

#6 Drew

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 12:36 PM

if you are using lights then you should pull the slate so it fills 1/2 the frame with lights on. usually auto will wb to the light source, so leave it in auto unless you have no illuminated subject that's close to the camera.

if you don't want to use lights, mwb every meters after 10. if it still doesn't work start shallower.

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#7 Roydive

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 01:41 PM

if you are using lights then you should pull the slate so it fills 1/2 the frame with lights on. usually auto will wb to the light source, so leave it in auto unless you have no illuminated subject that's close to the camera.

if you don't want to use lights, mwb every meters after 10. if it still doesn't work start shallower.


auto is usually fine with the light........ but without I need to balance and if I am shooting into the blue and balancing every 10m is what I have been doing! I will try the red filter as above :)

#8 Drew

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 02:06 PM

Once pass 12m, use the filter.

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#9 Roydive

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 09:00 AM

if you are using lights then you should pull the slate so it fills 1/2 the frame with lights on. usually auto will wb to the light source, so leave it in auto unless you have no illuminated subject that's close to the camera.

if you don't want to use lights, mwb every meters after 10. if it still doesn't work start shallower.

Nope no luck guys ....dive to 34m white balance on slate with red filter all is green, white balance on hand all is red, white balance on Buddys Orange BC still Red !! am now thinking maybe as the Auto is pretty good maybe I can leave it in Auto and use the offset ??? try again tomorrow I guess unless anyone else has suggestions, I guess the WB isn't broken cos it works ok on the surface :)

#10 Drew

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 09:10 AM

Try pointing at the sun with filter on.

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#11 peterbkk

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 01:02 AM

Nope no luck guys ....dive to 34m white balance on slate with red filter all is green, white balance on hand all is red, white balance on Buddys Orange BC still Red !! am now thinking maybe as the Auto is pretty good maybe I can leave it in Auto and use the offset ??? try again tomorrow I guess unless anyone else has suggestions, I guess the WB isn't broken cos it works ok on the surface :)


This has been a problem since the CX 550. One of reasons I moved to Canon.

The Sony MWB algorithm is boosting the red too much in the UW environment.

You may need to find some way to get some red in or on the subject that you are using for the white balance. Brown coral used to work for the CX 550. I learned to use a bit of artificial light on something brown for the deeper depths. But it was always a bit hit and miss.

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#12 peterbkk

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 01:05 AM

Once pass 12m, use the filter.


But the red filter just reduces blue and green, right?. The Sony algorithm still tries to boost red by pushing up the gain on the red channel.

Regards
Peter

#13 Drew

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 01:56 AM

Yes it does, but that's because it's registering too much GB so it over compensates R. The filter sorta tempers it if the right WB neutral reflective surface is used.
Roy,
I helped out a guy on this issue on his CX earlier this year. The best way is probably still to use a 18% gray card. You can use the sun by zooming in a bit, but make sure it fills the screen over 50%. Most important, these little camcorders have only 10000k which is why I recommend MWB every 2 meters of depth change and not every 10m, once you go past 10m. The WB sensor is overwhelmed by the huge lack of R.
I would use the offset sparingly but try setting it to -2 or 3. However don't go nuts on the WB Shift.
If that doesn't work, try MWB every meter. The guy did that and it worked well, albeit a big PITA!
Looking at your pic again, you have lights on with your filter? Is that right?

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#14 Roydive

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 12:14 PM

I am not using the filter with the lights no, in fact I am trying not to use the filter at all if I can help it as it seems to cut down the brightness a lot. The light is a light and Motion 1200 and to be honest for closish work the Auto WB works fine with this. The problem is mainly for more distant stuff maybe there is no solution to this. I am happy with the camera apart from this, but it does seem a shame that it doesn't perform as well on the white balance as the HDR HC3. Maybe I should just buy a second light :-)

Sorry Drew I will try the 18% grey card and see how it goes :-)

#15 Drew

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 03:01 PM

Sorry I mistyped. I meant to ask did you MWB with your lights on or off? It looks like your lights were on in the pic. If you MWB with lights off then turn on the lights... it will be very RED! Just checking.

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#16 Roydive

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Posted 28 April 2012 - 05:45 AM

Sorry I mistyped. I meant to ask did you MWB with your lights on or off? It looks like your lights were on in the pic. If you MWB with lights off then turn on the lights... it will be very RED! Just checking.


nope Manual WB was done with lights on, I made the mistake of doing it with the lights off once before and Yes it is very RED when you do that :)

#17 Drew

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Posted 28 April 2012 - 11:23 AM

Usually one of those grey gloves is good enough. just make sure it fills the frame.

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