Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Tripvideo Sharks & Dolphins


  • Please log in to reply
33 replies to this topic

#21 Nick Hope

Nick Hope

    Sperm Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1925 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Thailand

Posted 26 April 2012 - 07:51 AM

The whole riding sharks issue is a difficult one. I've told people they shouldn't do it and they ask me why and I pluck out osome of my standard arsenal of replies such as:

1. It modifies their behaviour and thereby endangers them.
2. It could be dangerous for the diver/snorkeller.
3. It breaks the mucous coating on their skin, leaving them open to infection.
4. We should respect them. How would you like it if someone was jumping on your back?
5. They'll stop visiting here and go somewhere else.

Somehow none of these ever sound truly convincing.

Dean's reason of the sharks potentially getting killed as overreaction/revenge for an attack is one I'll add to the list.

I'm curious to know which of these reasons are the most important to those who are passionately against it.

Personally I wouldn't attempt to ride sharks myself but I have been guilty of stroking leopard (zebra) sharks, years ago.

Dean, are you against shark baiting/feeding? I'm not trying to bait you. Just genuinely interested.

Edited by Nick Hope, 26 April 2012 - 07:53 AM.


#22 DeanB

DeanB

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:U.K

Posted 26 April 2012 - 08:40 AM

Thousands of sharks are killed every day, if this kind of video helps people change their mind about sharks, so I say well done.


'Millions' are killed every year we all know that, this film will not change the commercial finning industries opinion ... If, by watching this film, it makes the average person think sharks can be chased and grabbed without thought then it's going to end in tears ... And I fear more tears for the shark population... Leave them alone, as you touched on the subject who the fook would go and grab a wild lion!?

Nick, to me a totally different subject feeding and molesting... I haven't really thought or researched about it to be honest... I did go on a shark feed when I was in Yap many moons ago and that seemed okay I suppose time will tell ... However the promotion of grabbing any wild animal to get a 'wow' factor is, to me, rather narrow minded

Dean
Facebook me ;)
NOW ON SKYPE !!! ... deanb69
www.waterwolf-productions.co.uk

#23 Steve Douglas

Steve Douglas

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2837 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Diego
  • Interests:filming/editing/exotic travel. l write reviews of editing software, books, tutorials and Mac based NLE related products for the www.kenstone.net and www.lafcpug.org sites as well as articles for Asian Diver Magazine and wetpixel. I am one of the founding members of the San Diego UnderSea Film Festival

Posted 01 May 2012 - 02:58 PM

The problem new shooters/editors make is that they fall in love with their own footage. If they only cut it down they'd find they've produced a much better film. They also need to learn that it is ok to allow a shark or fish to swim through the frame rather than the shooter turning circles following it. There is much that could have been cut out. I became bored. The dolphin shots were pretty decent as were some of the shark clips but the WA shots of divers grabbing were poor regardless of where you stand on the issue. I have mixed opinions on shark feeds and such but have taken part in several. I don't feel terribly strong one way or the other on the issue but I have never used shark feed footage in a film; I just don't like a shots with a bunch of divers all hurky jerky all over the place.
The film would never make it in any competition but there are enough decent shots that it could be cut down to. For me, I hated that techno music...it just doesn't fit any uw film I have ever seen. It might be good for some kind of industrial or commercial shoot but I would never use it unless the paying client insisted, and then it would have to be royalty free.
Steve-IMHO
www.kenstone.net
www.lafcpug.org

Steve Douglas
www.worldfilmsandtravel.com

I have worked as an unpaid reviewer for the editing websites since 2002. Most all hardware and software is sent to me free of charge, however, in no way am I obligated to provide either positive or negative evaluations. Any suggestions I make regarding products are a result of my own, completely, personal opinions and experiences with said products.

#24 Brumpy

Brumpy

    Wolf Eel

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 165 posts

Posted 03 May 2012 - 03:37 PM

Steve,

This video is not made for competions, just for fun for the people who have done this trip.
About the music, i know it is rear to use this kind of music but i tried it and i got some really nice compliments allready you are the first one so negative!
Maybe you are getting to old?

But i apriciate your honoust reply.

I hope to see some not boring footage from you somwhere :-)
GATES EX1 housing

Sony Z1
LMI Bluefin HD housing
Vanherck Underwater Imaging

#25 Steve Douglas

Steve Douglas

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2837 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Diego
  • Interests:filming/editing/exotic travel. l write reviews of editing software, books, tutorials and Mac based NLE related products for the www.kenstone.net and www.lafcpug.org sites as well as articles for Asian Diver Magazine and wetpixel. I am one of the founding members of the San Diego UnderSea Film Festival

Posted 04 May 2012 - 07:54 AM

Hey Brumpy,
Sorry if I offended you. Just giving an honest appraisal. And yep, getting old but still don't think the music fits. I love the Blues but wouldn't use Muddy Waters as a soundtrack for any film I produce.
Steve
www.kenstone.net
www.lafcpug.org

Steve Douglas
www.worldfilmsandtravel.com

I have worked as an unpaid reviewer for the editing websites since 2002. Most all hardware and software is sent to me free of charge, however, in no way am I obligated to provide either positive or negative evaluations. Any suggestions I make regarding products are a result of my own, completely, personal opinions and experiences with said products.

#26 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 05 May 2012 - 04:21 AM

The whole riding sharks issue is a difficult one. I've told people they shouldn't do it and they ask me why and I pluck out osome of my standard arsenal of replies such as:

1. It modifies their behaviour and thereby endangers them.
2. It could be dangerous for the diver/snorkeller.
3. It breaks the mucous coating on their skin, leaving them open to infection.
4. We should respect them. How would you like it if someone was jumping on your back?
5. They'll stop visiting here and go somewhere else.

Somehow none of these ever sound truly convincing.


Nick
A s you say, those arguments tend to lack cohesion. Behavior modification from various interaction is well known. Then again, there is some research and anecdotal evidence indicating that sharks have learnt things (eg. Bull Sharks hiding under boats in the river to snap at fishermen's catches etc.). However, your argument of behavior modification should also include feeds as well then, and taken a little further, even scuba itself is interaction, then WP would have to shut down! :)

The mucus argument is tougher to prove because a remora can do the same, not to mention other sharks and even self-infliction. How many times do white tip reef sharks scrap themselves against the reef in search of food? A shark's healing ability is tied to the mucus secretions and thus the mucus coating is replaced quickly.

While I personally dislike touching sealife, especially sharks, it seems there is very little "damage" per se done to sharks other than disturbing the sensitivities of some people.

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#27 Nick Hope

Nick Hope

    Sperm Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1925 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Thailand

Posted 05 May 2012 - 09:58 PM

Did you accidentally delete a line of text there between "very" and "ehaviour"?

#28 DeanB

DeanB

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:U.K

Posted 05 May 2012 - 11:35 PM

Looks like Brumpy needs to learn some manners and respect!... Everyone has opinions and if you don't want any critique then do not post videos... Making nasty remarks just shows the sort of person you are...

And I'm not being sensitive Drew just realistic .. If that shark had of turned and bit the person it would gave been a disaster for the shark population... There no fancy words or statistics etc etc just facts

Dean

"I woke up this morning... and the sharks were gone... All because of the stupidity of what man has done..." :P

Sharktown blues

Edited by DeanB, 06 May 2012 - 12:50 AM.

Facebook me ;)
NOW ON SKYPE !!! ... deanb69
www.waterwolf-productions.co.uk

#29 JanFish

JanFish

    Damselfish

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 15 posts

Posted 08 May 2012 - 03:08 AM

The feeding is much worse than the slight touching of a shark IMHO. I don't understand why one would appreciate these kinds of dives. It's just like a zoo with an adrenaline touch to it. The most important reason for me to dive with sharks is to watch them in their NATURAL habitat, and this doesnít have much resemblance to that. Itís also much more rewarding to discover true wild animals by chance IMO. Just my 2 cents.

#30 Brumpy

Brumpy

    Wolf Eel

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 165 posts

Posted 08 May 2012 - 02:41 PM

I completly agree that everyone have opinions and i really do not have a problem with critique depending where/who it comes from!

I rather have people telling me things about my video what can be done to make it better then only "wow" "great" ...... you learn nothing from that.

But like i have told, this is a quick tripvideo that i have completed on board for the clients not for competions or TV ......

The discussion about feeding sharks etc is not for me, i have been booked to lead this trip and i love to do it!
I personaly do not see eny harm in what we (and a gazilion other people) are doing, on the contrerary people are getting home with story's, pictures and video's and telling other people sharks are NICE!
GATES EX1 housing

Sony Z1
LMI Bluefin HD housing
Vanherck Underwater Imaging

#31 DeanB

DeanB

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:U.K

Posted 08 May 2012 - 10:43 PM

I completly agree that everyone have opinions and i really do not have a problem with critique depending where/who it comes from!

I rather have people telling me things about my video what can be done to make it better then only "wow" "great" ...... you learn nothing from that.

But like i have told, this is a quick tripvideo that i have completed on board for the clients not for competions or TV ......

The discussion about feeding sharks etc is not for me, i have been booked to lead this trip and i love to do it!
I personaly do not see eny harm in what we (and a gazilion other people) are doing, on the contrerary people are getting home with story's, pictures and video's and telling other people sharks are NICE!


Well as a 'guide' you should tell your clients not to risk their limbs by acting as idiots trying to grab Sharks! Although it would have been, to me, a more interesting view of shark behaviour :P

I't was Steve's personal constructive criticism about your choice of music suggesting something other than whatever you have used... And your response was some what childish!

Dean
Facebook me ;)
NOW ON SKYPE !!! ... deanb69
www.waterwolf-productions.co.uk

#32 Drew

Drew

    The Controller

  • Video Expert
  • 10595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:GPS is not reliable in South East Asian seas

Posted 09 May 2012 - 12:45 AM

Well compared to this ad, Bruno's trip video is rather innocuous:

http://www.youtube.c...p;v=-v7k6-eEBrk

Bruno, I actually liked the electronica music but I felt the cutting was flat to the beat during Misha's song. I think if you'd cut it a bit faster to match the pace of the musiic, it would work better. Was there a reason why you didn't color grade more? Other than basic white balancing correction, I thought your clips could easily handle a stronger contrast curve or at least a different look.

Drew
Moderator
"Journalism is what someone else does not want printed, everything else is public relations."

"I was born not knowing, and have only had a little time to change that here and there.


#33 DeanB

DeanB

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3073 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:U.K

Posted 09 May 2012 - 01:39 AM

Well compared to this ad, Bruno's trip video is rather innocuous:

[url="http://www.youtube.c...ye...p;v=-v7k6-


Well thats okay then!!! I change my mind, silly me... :P

Dean
Facebook me ;)
NOW ON SKYPE !!! ... deanb69
www.waterwolf-productions.co.uk

#34 Steve Douglas

Steve Douglas

    Humpback Whale

  • Industry
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2837 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Diego
  • Interests:filming/editing/exotic travel. l write reviews of editing software, books, tutorials and Mac based NLE related products for the www.kenstone.net and www.lafcpug.org sites as well as articles for Asian Diver Magazine and wetpixel. I am one of the founding members of the San Diego UnderSea Film Festival

Posted 09 May 2012 - 05:48 AM

All this made me go back to re-view Eric Cheng's excellent shark feed film, now on Mary Lynn's DiveFilm Podcast, where during the course Eric used a few Go Pros to film inside the sharks mouth. The film remains both interesting and exciting to see. And well edited.
Steve
www.kenstone.net
www.lafcpug.org

Steve Douglas
www.worldfilmsandtravel.com

I have worked as an unpaid reviewer for the editing websites since 2002. Most all hardware and software is sent to me free of charge, however, in no way am I obligated to provide either positive or negative evaluations. Any suggestions I make regarding products are a result of my own, completely, personal opinions and experiences with said products.