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Tokina 10-17 on FX


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#1 Michael T.

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:47 AM

Hey there,

does anybody use the tokina 10-17 on a nikon fx and maybe with a sea&sea housing? I just bought new kit and have a 170mm GlasPort left plus the Tokina which i want to use on FX as well. Does that work or do i need an extension? I know it's a DX-lens but removing the sunshade will do it for me... I just want to now if i need a new Port or just add an extension ring to it to make the thing work.

Cheers,

Michael

#2 browng

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 03:31 AM

Michael

I used the Tokina 10-17 with reasonable success on my D800 using a 10mm extension and the Subal 8" dome while in Sardinia in September.

I think the recommended extension from Subal is 12mm, but what's 2mm between friends! The D800 was in DX mode.

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All the best

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#3 jonny shaw

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 04:06 PM

Make sure you have the new version without the shade way less vignetting

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#4 John Bantin

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 08:52 AM

Gordon, if it's in DX mode, it's not FX !!!

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#5 browng

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 10:08 AM

John

You are absolutely correct. I didn't read Michael's comment correctly.

However I have tried the Tokina in FX mode with the same set up (10mm extension on Subal 8" dome) and was not happy with it. I didn't shave the shade off of the lens or remove the shade from the dome port so it was showing on the edges of the photo but I think the inside edge of the dome was showing as well which suggests a shorter extension, however the Nikon port selector suggests a 13mm extension!

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#6 Michael T.

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 02:27 AM

Thanks,

shaving the Tokina is planned, not done yet. Will try it without Extension and Shade on the Dome, see what happens. Even in DX-Mode there are enough pixels left on the D800. Unfortunetely there is only 20mm Extension with Sea&Sea. Will try...

Thanks all

Michael

#7 tdpriest

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 09:01 AM

Why use inferior glass? The 10-17mm doesn't support the resolution of the D800, works fine in DX, but doesn't cover the sensor of an FX camera...

... I think that you just have to accept the Sigma 15mm prime lens for FX, and regret the loss of flexibility.


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#8 JackConnick

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 11:32 AM

I agree with Tim (nice shot btw), the tokina just isn't suited for FX. Yes, everyone would like to see an FX zoom wide FE lens, but it's not available (yet). The Sigma is $600 and is very sharp. For more flexibility, it can be used with the Kenko 1.4 TC.

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#9 Ryan

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 11:12 AM

I've wondered about the utility of this lens on FX a lot, set at 14-17mm. I've seen imatest results that suggest that the resolution of 10-17 is just above the D800, so while it is nearly resolution limiting, it isn't yet. Worth a test, though...

Tokina 10-17 at 14mm
Posted Image

Sigma 15mm at 15mm
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10-17 at 14mm Center Crop
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Sig 15 Center Crop
Posted Image

10-17 at 14mm Lower Left
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Sigma 15 Lower Left
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Draw your own conclusions, but I wouldn't run out and buy a new lens.

Edited by Ryan, 14 December 2012 - 11:13 AM.

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#10 Timmoranuk

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:24 PM

Why use inferior glass? The 10-17mm doesn't support the resolution of the D800, works fine in DX, but doesn't cover the sensor of an FX camera...

... I think that you just have to accept the Sigma 15mm prime lens for FX, and regret the loss of flexibility.


I can't remember shooting with my 10-17 on anything other than 10mm, other than with a TC. For the vast majority of my shots on this glass, its a prime. Same with the 8-16,10-22, 12-24, 16-35, 17-70... Keep 'em wide.

Edited by Timmoranuk, 14 December 2012 - 12:25 PM.

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#11 gecko1

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 05:02 PM

I have tried the 10-17 with a D800 at 17mm. I have a Subal D800 housing and discovered to my chagrin that the only way to use my old type 3 dome port was with a port extension. Without one the port doesn't fit on the housing. So I can't use a prime fisheye unless I buy a new port. Very preliminary results with the 10-17 in FX mode at 17 were acceptable but not great. Vis was bad enough that it's hard to make resolution conclusions but it wasn't horrible. There was some noticeable shading (but not hard clipping) in the corners. Believe this was with a 20mm extension.

I'm weighing my options now. I'm not sure the upgrade in quality for the Sigma 15 is worth the $1200 plus $600 for the lens, especially having looked at Ryan's results.

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Adding - old style 10-17 and I haven't shaved off the petals yet.

Edited by gecko1, 14 December 2012 - 05:03 PM.

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#12 John Bantin

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 03:18 AM

Most of us produce files of a quality that are more than we would ever need. I shoot now with a D800/Sigma15 but does this mean I should throw away all the files shot with a D700, D200, Fuji S2 Pro or on 35mm film? I think not! So the test is simply if it works for you, that's adequate.

Here's a picture cropped from a small part of a horizontal frame on film on an F90 Nikon. Rubbish quality but...

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Edited by John Bantin, 15 December 2012 - 03:23 AM.

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#13 Michael T.

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 06:05 AM

Thank you for the test, Ryan! Looks good for me :-)

I got a 20mm Extension now and will test it next time in the local pool (next time will be in January...). My dome fits only with the Extension on the housing or i have to remove the Domeshade (what will be done for the tests). I hope the 170mm dome works with the Tokina and S&S...

#14 Ryan

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 06:53 AM

I can't remember shooting with my 10-17 on anything other than 10mm, other than with a TC. For the vast majority of my shots on this glass, its a prime. Same with the 8-16,10-22, 12-24, 16-35, 17-70... Keep 'em wide.



Tim, the purpose of zooming here is to eliminate the vignette. 10-17 covers the full frame sensor at about 14mm with a shaved hood, or 15mm with a standard hood. Some might have to zoom a bit further depending upon their port config and its vignette threshold.

I'm actually pretty surprised that Sigma 15 didn't fare better, so much so that I am going to buy a couple more to test and see if this is consistent.

I got a 20mm Extension now and will test it next time in the local pool (next time will be in January...). My dome fits only with the Extension on the housing or i have to remove the Domeshade (what will be done for the tests). I hope the 170mm dome works with the Tokina and S&S..



The Sea & Sea Optical Dome Port (same glass as Athena OPD-170) should be fine with 10-17, even though the dome is shallower than would theoretically be perfect for a fisheye.

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#15 John Bantin

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 07:57 AM

The Sea & Sea Optical Dome Port (same glass as Athena OPD-170) should be fine with 10-17, even though the dome is shallower than would theoretically be perfect for a fisheye.


I got amazing stuff with the Sea & Sea glass port with a D200/Tokina 10-17. Some of it has been used as giant posters at British Dive shows. That's why I got Hugy to supply me with an adapter so that I could use my D700/15 and D800/15 Sigma behind it too.

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Edited by John Bantin, 15 December 2012 - 08:06 AM.

I buy my own photographic kit. Diving equipment manufacturers and diving services suppliers get even-handed treatment from me whether they choose to advertise in the publications I write for or not. All the equipment I get on loan is returned as soon as it is finished with. Did you know you can now get Diver Mag as an iPad/Android app?

 

#16 Michael T.

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 11:25 AM

i removed the domeshade earlier today to make the dome fit to the MDX-D800. Now, with the the cam and the Tokina mounted, the lens is jut about 2-3cm from the dome - hope it works underwater. With attached 20mm Extension the front is about 5cm from the dome glass. Full on FX at about 14mm as you said Ryan. Can't wait to get wet with it...

#17 Michael T.

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 05:59 AM

back after a couple of dives...

 

it seems, that i can't get sharp edges with the lens and the "small" 170mm-Port on the D800.

 

I tried:

Tokina +20mm Extension + Athena

Tokina +40mm Extension+ Athena

Tokina +Kenko 1.4 +20mm Extension+Athena

Tokina + Kenko 1.4 + 40mm Extension+ Athena

 

all settings corners too soft... worst at 10mm, slightly better at 17mm. Can't fix it, stepping down to f11/13 doesn't make much difference.

 

I think i need a new Port...

 

Any suggestions? It's a Sea&Sea MDX-D800 housing. I'm looking at a S&S FE 240mm Port and the Nauticam 8.5" Dome at the present. Will the Nauticam be adaptable for the S&S-housing? Which one would you buy? (and no: ZEN is out of range...)

 

Thx,

Michael


Edited by Michael T., 01 April 2014 - 06:01 AM.


#18 nortoda1

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 10:00 AM

I recently went from MDX-D300 to MDX-D800.  Had the tokina and the Sigma 15mm, sold the tokina as I have always been very happy with the Sigma.  I also have the sea and sea optical dome port and I didn't find any issues with corner sharpness.  I have just last month invested in the S&S FE 240mm port (purchased for <400 euro from Japan + P&P and a little vat - uwdigitalcameras.com).  The main reason I have invested is that the optical dome is only rated to 60m, whilst the FE 240 is rated to 80m (funny S&S now have housings rated to 100m but none of the ports).

Anyway planning on using the setup this Saturday and Sunday.  Not expecting any issues as it is the setup S&S recommend for this lens.


Edited by nortoda1, 01 April 2014 - 11:12 PM.


#19 Aquapaul

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 10:40 AM

I bought a D7100 which isn't FX but does have similar pixel density as the D800. I found that though my 10-17 was sharp enough on my D7000 it no longer was on my D7100. I then went to to the Nikon 10.5 and found out what really sharp can be. I think you can experiment and find results that might be almost good enough but in the end will end up being disappointing. I plan on using only my new 10.5 and if needed, since I have all these pixels, crop if I needed to be zoomed in.


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#20 Rui_Guerra

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 04:42 AM

I have tried the 10-17 with a D800 at 17mm. I have a Subal D800 housing and discovered to my chagrin that the only way to use my old type 3 dome port was with a port extension. Without one the port doesn't fit on the housing. So I can't use a prime fisheye unless I buy a new port. ...

 

gecko1 :

Just send an e-mail to Subal because it's possible to change the back of the dome or buy a Subal adapter type3-type4. Everithyng have a solution :-)

 

Cheers,


Edited by Rui_Guerra, 04 April 2014 - 04:43 AM.

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