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DX90 slaving off DS125 - any exp?


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#1 cmdasia

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Posted 05 July 2002 - 03:19 AM

After reading all the good things about the DS125 with the Ikelite TTL sensor I have decided to buy one. I currently own a DX 90 - can I slave it off the DS125 whilst the DS125 is acting in "TTL" mode with the slave sensor and thereby use my DX90 as a second strobe firing as a slave, or will this cause me problems?

Any help is appreciated.

#2 davephdv

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Posted 05 July 2002 - 06:35 PM

You can get TTL with a 90 (not the new digital one) if the 90 is hard wired to a film camera and the 125 uses the slave strobe. I have done this.

Are you talking about a cameras in camera strobe setting off both strobes in TTL slave mode? If so it would probably depend upon the circutry of your camera and how it is set up for automated light exposure.

Related question. If you set up 2 125s, each to it's own slave sensor will you get digital TTL with the cameras strobe setting them off?
Dave Burroughs, Nikon D300, D2X, Subal housing, DS160 strobes

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#3 cmdasia

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Posted 06 July 2002 - 07:59 PM

I am using a 4040 in an Olympus housing with my YS90DX currently and want to buy a second strobe because of "green" shadows appearing where the strobe light cannot get to.

As I like to shoot "off the cuff" (I am still after fish shots and usually only get one chance) I thought that the DS125 with the external ttl sensor would be better suited. Saying this I wanted to achieve a 2 strobe setup whilst not breaking the bank. So the plan was DS125 with "ttl" as a primary and the DX90 as the second fill in strobe.

Trouble is, I am now unsure if my plan will actually work.

Cheers

#4 davephdv

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Posted 06 July 2002 - 08:11 PM

The questions are 2. 1, does the 4040 use preflash for its strobe exposure? and 2. can the digital 90 handle preflash in it's TTL slave mode or will it fire or quench prematurally in response to the preflash? The digital Ikes are designed not to do this.
Dave Burroughs, Nikon D300, D2X, Subal housing, DS160 strobes

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#5 cmdasia

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Posted 07 July 2002 - 06:47 PM

The 4040 does use preflash but the DX90 is not TTL (it has a TTL setting but this is for a hardwired synch cord) - so I guess that means that unless the DX90 is set to a minimal light setting, the proposed rig would probably end up in over-exposed pictures.

Is there anybody out there who is using a 2 strobe set-up with the Ikelite as a primary strobe- if so what do you use as a secondary strobe?

Guess this is going to come full circle on Dan's query of two DS125 (or 50's) operating off 2 ttl sensors (or one ttl sensor and two ikelite strobes on a tee coupling).

Anybody got any suggestions?

#6 SharpDiver

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Posted 07 July 2002 - 08:19 PM

YS-90DX has the same TTL slave function as the original YS-90. See page 13 of the owner's manual.

I haven't actually used this set-up, but it meets all the requirements set forth in the YS-90DX owner's manual for slaved TTL operation. Namely, that the master strobe must operate in TTL and be equal to or more powerful than the YS-90DX. The only remaining question is if the YS-90DX will fire off the camera's internal strobe instead of the DS-125. A deflector shield could probably be fashioned to control this. In my experience with the YS-90DX, the large slave sensor (as opposed to the smaller one designed for the fiber optic cable) is quite accurate and doesn't trigger off of sun beams or other strobes very often. It seems that a simple deflector to block the YS-90DX side and direct the internal flash to the Ikelite slave sensor should work as you are hoping.

Though I see where you are trying to go with your rig (automated operation for a reasonable chance of getting correct exposures when things are moving quickly), I would add that I have had quite a bit of success with two YS-90DX strobes.

#7 underwaterdigital

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Posted 08 July 2002 - 04:17 AM

Have you tried using a fiber optic cable?

If you want to use the YS90DX as a fill in light then I think the fiber optic cable should work. You could mount one end of the fiber cable to the YS90DX sensor adn the other end could go right in front of the Ikelite DS125. I don't think there's a mount in front of the Ikelite strobe so you're going to have to improvise a way to mount the fiber. By doing this, you can achieve proper timing and syncronization for both strobes. Everytime your DS125 fires, the fiber will pick up the flash and sync it with the YS90DX.

hope this helps...:)
Allan

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#8 SharpDiver

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Posted 08 July 2002 - 04:48 AM

I am not positive, Allan, but I think the fiber optic slave is strictly a fire trigger, not a fire and quench. Your suggestion will fire the YS-90DX, but it will not quench when the DS-125 quenches.

#9 cmdasia

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Posted 08 July 2002 - 05:37 PM

That had occured to me earlier when I was guessing at overexposed shots - what I am really hazy about (think on I am still a beginner) is that if the strobe could fire and quench then would it not be fully TTL compatible and consequently the YS90DX would in effect have the same capabilities as the DS125? (or am I bordering on extreme confusion).

I suppose the answer is to set the YS90DX to min light output (-7) when using it as the secondary fill in flash.

As a total aside to this issue I thought you may be interested in disparity of costs between buying equipment in the states and outside - my quotes for the DS125 in the Olympus 3973.65 package have been:


States (Berger) $750
UK $1507
Thailand (dealer #1) - $1320
Thailand (dealer #2) - $1050
Thailand (local dive shop #1) - $1420
Thailand (local dive shop # 2) - $955
Singapore - cannot supply

Quite a spread.

#10 james

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Posted 08 July 2002 - 06:02 PM

I'll buy the setup for you and ship it to you for oh...say...$500...:)

So I guess paying taxes in the US is good for something afterall!

Cheers
James
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#11 SharpDiver

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Posted 08 July 2002 - 06:13 PM

Your logic is sound, but the missing stepping stone in your path is the camera's pre-flash. If not for the pre-flash, the YS-90DX could fire and quench reading the camera's internal strobe. But the pre-flash starts the process too early. Ike's TTL slave sensor ignores the pre-flash, then fires and quenches in sync with the camera's strobe. That's why careful blocking of the internal strobe away from the YS-90DX will be necessary for your system to work.

Berger and B&H both have international shipping, don't they? Couldn't possibly cost as much as the prices you've been quoted (but, watch out for customs charges that could be astronomical).

#12 cmdasia

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Posted 09 July 2002 - 10:58 PM

Thanks a lot guys - I think I have it now (phew it would have been easier to take up nuclear physics as a hobby!) and have ordered the strobe and a macro add-on lens.

Ordered the strobe from my local dive shop because of taxes (customs just make it up here dependent on what they feel like) but more importantly to make sure it actually works when it comes out the box.

Now all I need to make in the next year is one shot equivalent to Jeff's "spotted cleaner shrimp on an anemone" and I am going to be a very happy snapper.

Am off for 3 days in the Similans tomorrow night (weather quite dodgy at the moment though) with my current rig.

Many Thanks!

#13 MikeO

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Posted 10 July 2002 - 04:54 AM

One clarification:

Actually, Ike's TTL slave sensor (the digital model) replicates both the preflash and main flash of the digital camera (I've heard that Ike will be offering a version later this year that will allow the strobe to ignore the preflash to allow manual operation, though a version of the sensor to do both digicam pref-flash TTL *and* digicam pre-flash manual is a bit farther off . . .). So, the YS-90DX should be able to synch on it as if it were synching on the camera -- the DS-125 should give it a preflash to ignore just like the digicam would . . .

Mike Oelrich

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#14 underwaterdigital

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Posted 10 July 2002 - 09:50 AM

Mike,

So, if you hook up the S&S fiber optic cable in front of the YS90DX and attach the other end of the fiber right in front of the Ikelite's diffuser panel. It should work, right?
Allan

Sea and Sea DX100 with Inon X1 port, Inon Z22 quad ring flash, YS90DX and a bunch of lens, arms and ports.