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magic lantern 5D 2K DNG RAW


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#81 Ferg42

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 01:22 AM

Here's a random sample of shots from a recent Red Sea trip (didn't do much video as was mainly shooting stills, but wanted to try it out). All with 5D Mark III with Magic Lantern Raw 1080p. Nauticam Housing, Magic Filter. Canon 17-40 and 8-15. 

 

 

 

Also, now I'm used to the workflow I'm loving the grading flexibility you get from raw.


Edited by Ferg42, 04 July 2013 - 07:19 AM.

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#82 CheungyDiver

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 07:15 AM

Stunning stuff Fergus. The level of detail from RAW is so much more than the Canon'd native HD. The low light capability of 5D and RAW really make this quite a nice system.


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#83 Drew

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 08:18 AM

Nice shots, Fergus.

 

For those who want a simpler solution to process the .raw files, try Ginger HDR.  It only works for CS6 AE and PP but  it's native.   Works well as a plug-in for native editing of .raw files.  Try it out.

 

Will automatically import all .raw 4GB segments as one file.  Nice if you shoot like for 10 minutes etc.


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#84 Drew

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 04:34 AM

I think someone is happy with the Magic Lantern firmware:

http://on.fb.me/143VHrF


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#85 CheungyDiver

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 04:20 PM

Some one is going to get even happier now- Dual ISO by ML for 5DMIII and 7D (digital stills only)

 

14 f stop of dynamic range is now possible by sampling the 5D MIII sensor in 100 ISO and 1600 ISO before combining the two. This according to aLex the author of this amazing hack in ML. He also warned that this changes fundamentally how the MIII sensor works and may potentially brick your camera. Has not happened to one yet. Here is a link to source : http://www.magiclant...hp?topic=7139.0

 

According to aLex you loose some resolution in RAW and also the expanded focus feature. It is recommended that this feature be use only when needed and now telling what will happen to the sensor in prolong use. I am pretty sure Canon warranty will not cover bricking your camera using a hacked firm ware so do so at your own risk. Or wait until a more stable and proven firm ware becomes available. Could wait a while but one thing is for sure this ML group is wringing out stuff from Canon DSLRs. This is nothing short of amazing.

 

What this means to UW footage is pretty obvious and when the firmware matures and usable it is going to affect the likes of Black Magic Design and other camera manufacturers. Well I have not fried my 5D MIII yet. 

 

Cheers

David


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#86 CheungyDiver

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 12:33 AM

Here is a demo by Michael Antony Visuals.......

 

 

 

Pretty impressive I say...


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#87 CheungyDiver

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 07:13 AM

Still intrigued?   Well for those of you with a better aptitude for technical matter read this link: - http://acoutts.com/a1ex/dual_iso.pdf   Sorta half understand what  a1ex, the author is saying the other 50% straight over my head. Especially the maths part. So its not exactly HDR but similar as the process is done when the chip scans in one go 24 times or higher frame rates per second. Unlike HDR method of using two different exposed frames which cause jutting of image and motion artifacts when shooting quick movements and the glowing radioactive look. Unnatural looks. This method scans half frame in ISO 100 and the other half in ISO 1600 and interlace together. Then walla you have DR increase unheard of for any DSLR camera. No motion artifacts but decrease in resolution due to interlacing. To even out the difference ISO 1600 is darken to match ISO 100. This is still raw so mixing the two half frames and recover some of the resolution in the process instead of binning them. i get the feeling that the author is just making it up (not really) as I was kinda lost on the ADC part. Some lost of vertical lines which does not help with aliasing.  Well I can't complaint about the increase of dynamic range and no motion artifacts.  The paper went on to say with better post-processing methods more goodies could be extracted from the  high DR footage. This ML hack is slowly turning the 5DMIII into a mini- Arri Alexa!   Cheers David


Edited by CheungyDiver, 17 July 2013 - 07:13 AM.

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#88 Ferg42

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 09:23 AM

Another cool development. I'm looking forward to seeing a few more real-world examples. Sounds like you don't really lose resolution in the mid-tones, only shadows and highlights where you probably wouldn't have had any resolution without this extended DR. Looks like I might be taking the 5D III underwater again within the next few weeks so might give it a go, provided people don't start bricking their cameras in the meantime!


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#89 Drew

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 11:53 AM

I'd wait if it's a crucial shoot.  Looking at the smoothing curves, I suspect there'll be some midtone banding in the water column.


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#90 CheungyDiver

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 04:07 PM

Yeah I was wondering about possible banding issues especially due to lost of vertical resolution. Especially with flat background colors in ambient light. From the samples noticeable increase of aliasing could be seen. Time will tell if that poses a huge problem for UW. Thinking of taking my camera to maxmax and squeeze every last drop of resolution out of the 5D MIII. I might do that after my dive trip. Finally found time to get away next month. Palau here I come!

 

The reduction in noise is very intriguing if you imagine not having to use video lights and dive down to 30m. With 14 stops there would be less or no dancing noise in the shadows nor overblown highlights near bright sunlight. I wonder how the camera would behave when the warmer colors disappear due to water absorption and will it turn the footage into nice crisp blue tones. Might be interesting to go monochrome and see just how much definition and tone could be gained. 

 

This development is still in early stages and I am thankful to ML for doing all this. I think UW shooters could help and not least do some test and feedback to that community. I think after some more tweaking the firmware will only improve. At the very least iron out all the bugs. 


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#91 Drew

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Posted 18 July 2013 - 12:59 PM

The resolution gain from removing the AA filter is noticeable but not significantly so.  You will notice more moiré and stair stepping/aliasing.  I'd wait until you aren't happy with the HD RAW  output.  Not really worth the money now.

The Canon sensors are just noisier in the shadows.  It's still better than the other RAW cameras.

For those wanting 60fps, setting the camera to 720/60p, you can then change the resolution 1480x515 @ 65fps, then stretch out horizontal axis by 1.61x, and you'll have better resolution than the ALL-I 720/60p in RAW output for slow motion.  It's a bit of work and best done in .RAW.

 

Another update for those looking to process the .DNG files.  Da Vinci has released a new version of Resolve that works very well with the .DNG files.  It renders faster than CS6 by 10x!  This is a great 2nd step to render out .DNG with LUT Log gamma curves processed output to ProRes.  It beats ACR by a mile for broadcast!

 

http://software.blac...e_9.1.5_Mac.zip

 


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#92 Ferg42

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 11:18 AM

Well I've been playing around with the Dual ISO thingy at home & not too sure it's going to be that great. It certainly has less shadow noise, but the aliasing & moire were so horrible- more distracting than the noise in the normal raw image & anyway there are pretty good noise reduction filters. 

I know aliasing and moire shouldn't be as much of a problem underwater, but I'm still not convinced. Loving the normal raw files, though. So hats off to the ML guys.


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#93 CheungyDiver

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 05:56 PM

I agreed. I would go for normal Canon raw  for now.. not that...this  ML raw is yet mainstream :) Far from "normal" as it is still evolving and hopefully getting better. I am surprised how many of my friends are still horrified when I mention the word "hack".

 

I was not entirely convinced with the Dual ISO and from the test footage the plus do not outweigh the minus. 

 

I am hoping that bigger, better, faster and more stable CF cards will come along. Canon RAW is here to stay thanks to ML team.

 

Cheers

David


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#94 Drew

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 07:55 AM

Well the fast CF cards are here... they just aren't dirt cheap.  :)

I think the 5D3 is limited to about 90MB/s with its onboard CF.   My Lexars can hit 95+MB/s when using the USB3 reader.  So raw for the 5D3 is at the moment not going to get better.  I do hope they get V1.21 firmware going.  I want f8 focus.


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#95 CheungyDiver

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 08:03 AM

One way to find out just pop your Lexars in the 5DMiii with ML firmware and do a speed run. Average of 90 MB/s is pretty good. 


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#96 Drew

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 08:05 AM

I did... it hit 87MB/s on the 128 and 89 on the 64GB.

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#97 CheungyDiver

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 01:18 PM

Finally got to test my 5D MIII/ML  in a dive trip. One thing is for sure you need tons of back up HDDS.  Well here is my quick and dirty edit of UW footage taken at Blue Corner and German Channel, Palau:

 

 

 

 

 

5D MIII with latest ML firmware, 16-35mm 2.8L II and custom pro-one dome and Nauticam housing.

 

Cheers


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#98 thani

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 10:52 PM

David,

Did you find RAW for underwater video having an advantage over the normal 5d MIII video? In what way?
BTW, I like the footage and especially the credit to the crew ;)
Best Regards,
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#99 CheungyDiver

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 11:15 PM

Crew consist of me, myself and I. LOL... iMovie is fun to use sometimes.

 

Oh yeah RAW video is the bee's knee. I process it using 8 bit bandwidth to reduce size hence the slight banding in the blue. I will do a proper edit when I have more time.

One disadvantage is the workflow with the 5DMIII and ML. Cinema DNG is a very large file format. I might try editing RAW in Adobe PP with Ginger HDR add on. Or the Cineform compressed raw. Too many things to try and learn. Not enough time.

 

Well to answer your question. If I just want H264 and really quick clip for the internet then the Canon 5DMIII video is pretty good. When I saw the different in colour and resolution after using the ML firmware I thought why waste a good diving opportunity. Recording in RAW is an inconvenience but I get to have much much more detail footage and could export to lower resolution if I wanted to. More flexibility. If quick and easy baked-in H264 is what needed then I shoot with that on the same camera!  It is a personal preference. Yeah no turning back from ML RAW. I could pull a few mega-pixel digital still from a frame. Saves me having to lug my Red Epic and housing around unless it is for a paid job :)

 

cheers
David


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#100 MJvC

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Posted 16 August 2013 - 06:37 AM

I totally agree David. Just need to get a bigger CF card 12 mins on a 64GB just doesn't cut it for a really great dive. I shot the ML RAW exclusively for the sardine run and I was amazed by the resolution and color. Still trying to streamline my work flow. I think RAWinizer and then strait into Resolve is going to work best for me although I do like the convenience of Ginger with premier.