Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Can point and shoot achieve this kind of result?

Point and shoot

  • Please log in to reply
19 replies to this topic

#1 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 25 June 2013 - 05:48 PM

I have a Panasonic LX-7, but didn't get to experiment video much because I was caught up with shooting photo. I'm wondering what kind of point and shoot, or special trick could achieve this kind of result:

 

 

The blue is very blue, while the whole area is very well colored. I used Magic Filter with custom white balance in my old Sanyo video camera, and still couldn't archive this kind of "Navy blue" kind of water. The video above is shot with Canon 5D Mark II by the way.

 

I have the Canon 7D, from my experience, doing custom white balance is such a pain in the dSLR, does people really even do custom white balance under water with the dSLR since it's so not practical?

 

By the way, that nice blue color is not just during under water, even on land (at the beach), the sky has very nice blue, so is white balance set to certain Kelvin or it's just the nature of the dSLR?


Edited by kc_moses, 25 June 2013 - 05:50 PM.


#2 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 25 June 2013 - 11:38 PM

I have been in the locations where this video has been shot and except app island the water is not so blue
Looks like a bit of effort has gone into the grading process

Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#3 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 26 June 2013 - 04:15 AM

It's not a location trick, if you look at his other videos, his Taiwan dive video has the same shade of blue. I will ask in the dSLR area and see if I should consider dSLR my next upgrade, he he.



#4 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 26 June 2013 - 12:41 PM

As I said there is something going on in grading as the water in Taiwan is not the same of the Philippines
I have been in those locations the water is not as blue so this is a trick

Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#5 Oceanshutter

Oceanshutter

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Salt Lake City, Utah

Posted 26 June 2013 - 02:44 PM

I am also a fan of dark rich blues.  In my opinion, he hasn't done much post in that video, if at all on some clips.  IT seems that the macro might have some bump in color.  But the blue water, I would say is pretty typical given the right conditions and WB.    I also have a canon 5d mark ii and I get similar results with just manually white balancing.  All of the blue water shots are most likely at Apo island or Siquior island.  Which have very nice blue water.  Dumaguete is more of the Muck variety.  which is where the macro shots come from.  MAgic Filters can also help with blues, although I don't use them much.  Not sure a point and shoot can do that or not.  HAven't ever used one.

 

I manually white balance for all of my wide angle shots.  below is a link a video of mine that was done a couple of years ago.  Keep in mind, that I was just starting to film and this was my second trip with the camera.  So it isn't great.  But this is all straight out of the camera. No post whatsoever on any of the clips.    In my video, the blues are variable, and it was cloudy alot of the time, and there were rain storms...so the water wasn't in great condition.  

 

Now that I am a little more experienced, I do better with my WB, and in post, I tend to increase the blacks a bit, and this helps the water get a little more blue.  Nothing major, but it helps it look better.  I haven't posted from my Komodo trip which has been the only other wide angle trip I have taken....all others have been macro.  But that has beautiful blues, as the sun was shining all day, with great viz.

 

The 7d should be capable of that film that you linked to.  In fact, the 7d is great with Macro too.

 

Hope that helps

Dustin

 


Edited by Oceanshutter, 26 June 2013 - 02:50 PM.

Website - www.OceanShutter.com

My Video's on Vimeo

My Video's on Youtube

 


#6 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 27 June 2013 - 07:58 AM

Thanks Dustin, sadly I haven't seen any 7D scuba footage that demonstrate the kind of blue. So based on what you explained, the post processing help to get that darker blue, but some times it could be done with WB especially with the right environment? I just want to make sure it's not a full frame vs crop frame kind of situation, because I told myself, the 7D is the last dSLR I would buy, unless they release a dSLR that can do 4K TV, he he.

 

Any suggestion on how to test it out on land? Should I try to take only sky video, then post process and see if it can achieve that kind of blue, then use the same concept when go into water? Also, if I set my point and shoot to "Vivid" instead of "Standard" or "Natural" color setting, would that help?



#7 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 27 June 2013 - 09:23 AM

I am not sure what is exactly the issue
If the problem is I want the water to look as it really was any point and shoot camera with a good white balance does that look at my YouTube channel
If you want to have deep dark blue even when they are not you need to manipulate the footage or the white balance
You can increase blacks and reduce greens and it will look darker blue but not anymore what you has when you took the footage
When I take shots in want them to look different and an accurate description of what the conditions were on the day personally I don't saturate a great deal as it does not reproduce what the dive was
Of course this is a matter of personal preference

Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#8 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 27 June 2013 - 10:55 AM

My goal is to creat that deep dark blue with minimal post manipulation. Because if too much is done with the post processing, I think the detail of coral would get lost as well since it would be too much shadow/shading. I like that deep blue because it create a moody feel to it, and of course in more shallow area, it shows the sun ray better.



#9 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 27 June 2013 - 02:42 PM

You like a blue that wasn't there when you were diving? Ok

Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#10 Oceanshutter

Oceanshutter

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Salt Lake City, Utah

Posted 27 June 2013 - 03:21 PM

Thanks Dustin, sadly I haven't seen any 7D scuba footage that demonstrate the kind of blue. So based on what you explained, the post processing help to get that darker blue, but some times it could be done with WB especially with the right environment? I just want to make sure it's not a full frame vs crop frame kind of situation, because I told myself, the 7D is the last dSLR I would buy, unless they release a dSLR that can do 4K TV, he he.

 

Any suggestion on how to test it out on land? Should I try to take only sky video, then post process and see if it can achieve that kind of blue, then use the same concept when go into water? Also, if I set my point and shoot to "Vivid" instead of "Standard" or "Natural" color setting, would that help?

 

 

You are the artist....You do what you want to do.  IF you want dark blues....do it!  if you want pink water go for it.  It's your footage and you have every right to do what you want with it.  IF you are dishonest about it, thats when people seem to get mad about it...My point is...its your stuff, don't let anyone influence you on how it has to be done.  

 

I don't think the outside test is going to get you anywhere.  Underwater the light is so different and there are so many variables.  Viz...time of day...depth...shooting down or up....shooting with the sun in front of you, or in back of you.  Tons of different scenarios.  I don't think the blue has anything to do with large sensor or cropped sensor.  But those with more technical knowledge would know more than me.  You can get those blues with the 7d...I guarantee it..

 

As for post work....It isn't hard.  I am not a post expert, but I found just a couple tweaks really help.  I use Adobe Premiere Pro CS6. And just use the fast color corrector.  Very quick and easy.  To increase blacks just use the slider.  Saturation you can bump a tiny bit too, this depends on the profile you shoot with how much though.  With Landscape profile, you don't need to do it much if at all. 

 

Eunjae Im has done fantastic work with the 7d.  Below is a video with some wide angle on it.  I know he uses magic filters on the 7d,  however, and does a little bit of post work.

 

Simon Spear has also had very good results with the 7d.

 

 

By the way they do make dslr that does 4k.  The Canon 1DC!!!  Would love to have it!

 

Hope that helps.

 

Dustin


Website - www.OceanShutter.com

My Video's on Vimeo

My Video's on Youtube

 


#11 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 28 June 2013 - 11:48 AM

Thanks Dustin! Simon Spear's video is the kind of result I want to accomplish! The 0:28 onward footage reminded me of my dive at the Red Sea, the water is really that blue! I have been checking out housing for 7D, seems like the price of housing won't go down regardless of how old the camera is, $3K for a Nauticam 7D housing, ouch! May be I will keep an eye on the classified area. At the mean time, I will try to get the best out of my Panasonic LX-7 and go from there.

 

I mean to say 4K capable prosumer dSLR, he he.



#12 Oceanshutter

Oceanshutter

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Salt Lake City, Utah

Posted 29 June 2013 - 04:05 PM

Thanks Dustin! Simon Spear's video is the kind of result I want to accomplish! The 0:28 onward footage reminded me of my dive at the Red Sea, the water is really that blue! I have been checking out housing for 7D, seems like the price of housing won't go down regardless of how old the camera is, $3K for a Nauticam 7D housing, ouch! May be I will keep an eye on the classified area. At the mean time, I will try to get the best out of my Panasonic LX-7 and go from there.
 
I mean to say 4K capable prosumer dSLR, he he.


I would check the classified on the wetpixel forums. The 7d is getting old,I'm sure people are getting rid of some..I know I have seen some at great prices. I would spend that on a camera that old.

Dustin

Website - www.OceanShutter.com

My Video's on Vimeo

My Video's on Youtube

 


#13 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 29 June 2013 - 04:20 PM

Yup, saw some activities of 7D housing on sales in Canada, but for Ikelite though. Will keep on looking and research on lens as well. I have the Tokina 11-16mm, but the popular lens is 10-17mm, which seem a bit too fish eye taste for me.

 

Anyway, I did an experiment this morning since it's nice and sunny out there. When I take the video using my point on shoot with proper exposure, the sky do get a bit wash out and the sun ray is not that great. When I under expose, I got the blue I was looking for! The LX-7 is too bright, with ISO 80, F8 (the smallest it would go), I had to bump the shutter speed to 1/250, which I'm not sure what would that cause for a 60p video, ideally the shutter speed should be 1/120. Anyway, I post the clips when I have the chance and see what people think.



#14 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 30 June 2013 - 04:50 AM

The lx7 has a neutral density filter
Use it

Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#15 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 30 June 2013 - 05:33 AM

Yup, looks like I have to go back to the manual to figure out all the feature of the camera. The Magic Filter will cut out some light too, so it's just a matter of experimenting again.



#16 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 30 June 2013 - 09:55 AM

Ikelite housing does not give access to ND filter. Another reason to get a nauticam


Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#17 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 14 July 2013 - 11:12 PM

I have changes slightly my approach for my Bunaken trip aiming at deeper blue in the editing
Check how it turned out without filter and just grading in iMovie

Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#18 kc_moses

kc_moses

    Eagle Ray

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 338 posts

Posted 15 July 2013 - 06:50 AM

Yes, like the deep blue better. In the beginning where the guide was at the front of the boat, did you turn on ND filter? The blue is nice as if you have a circular polarizer filter. The cloud and the back edge of the guide's shirt do get too bright, and the church on the island is too bright. I suspect it might be benefit to under expose when taking the video instead of doing it during grading since the detail could lose once it's over expose during shooting.

 

The turtle part is just as good as the 7D vs 5DM2 video here:

http://www.backscatt...ticle.php?ID=66

 

 

So it's good to know the LX-7 has good potential, and the trick is to under expose when shooting. As far as getting a Nauticam housing for it, I'm still not sure if I would use the ND filter underwater, as I'm not sure what to do with my Ikelite housing now. I'm in the process of research strobe, so it really get down to Ikelite vs Sea&Sea, which you know Ikelite housing+strobe is a good combo. Hmm....... I won't have another dive trip until next summer, so I still have time!



#19 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 15 July 2013 - 07:30 AM

The first guide has ND filter on, the church has both on (when it is dark) and then off (it bounces at one point)

 

I do use the ND filter underwater when shooting sunballs (see the jacks part)

 

In short the ND is useful on land and for sun balls or surface shots when you need to take those 3 f-stops down, if that is not sufficient you have also to increase the shutter

 

I edited that clip in a few hours so it is not completely polished it was just to give an idea of what the camera can do


Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog


#20 Interceptor121

Interceptor121

    Great Hammerhead

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 806 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Weybridge, UK

Posted 17 July 2013 - 11:19 AM

I have put a more tidy version on vimeo here

 


Check my video, pictures and blog

YouTube Channel

Flickr Sets

Blog