16 x 20 Size prints

[ornate_wrasse 0]

I've never had a 16x20 print done and wondered if you could give me some tips so it gets done right the first time. I will be using Adorama as I've heard good things about their prints from fellow uw photographers.

Right now the 16x20 prints are only $4.95 so I'd like to take advantage of the good price.

 

I am reading Martin Edge's book The Underwater Photographer, Third Edition. On page 44 it says "... if you want to enlarge a JPEG print to the size of a large poster, then it may not provide the quality unless you are using cameras of eight megapixels and above"

 

My D70S does not have 8 megapixels! I do shoot in RAW, however, make corrections in Capture NX and convert to JPG.

 

What should I do when I send the image to Adorama to print to get the best results?

 

Thanks.

 

Ellen

[james 0]

Hi Ellen,

 

Here are my suggestions. I'm sure others will have different suggestions, but this is what works for me.

 

Calibrate your monitor.

 

Download the printer profile from Adorama for the printer and paper you'll be using.

 

Open the image.

 

Use unsharp mask: 120, .5, 0 as capture sharpening.

 

Resize it to 16x20 @ 220dpi or thereabouts. I think you should use Bicubic Smoother when resizing like this but can't remember.

 

<<<<Alternatively, don't resize it at all. Adorama may use their own upscaling algorithm which will work better than above. You should ask them. When I print w/ Mpix or Pictopia, I let them upsize my photos>>>>

 

Use unsharp mask with setting: 20, 30, 2 You may have to move the 30 setting up or down until you just start to see halos around edges in the image.

 

Go to "Proof Colors" (I think it's under Edit) and select the printer profile from Adorama. This will show you what the print will look like when it comes out.

 

Adjust saturation and curves/levels until it looks good again.

 

Go to Edit -> Convert to Profile and select the Adorama profile.

 

Save it as an 8 bit JPEG with highest quality.

 

You're done.

 

HTH

James

[scubarobot 0]

I would do this. Do what James said about the profiling part. If your shooting RAW then you should scale and sharpen the image in the processing phase of the image. You will have a much smoother histogram. As a general rule you want you print dimentions to be 16x20 at 300 dpi...But you can double check to see what dpi adorama prints at. Don't save as a jpeg or you might get compression noise in the final print (faint squares). Save as a Tiff and embed the profile that they are using.

[imasleeper 0]

Wow, great question! Digital printing really is an artform. For me it's the print and not the picture on my monitor that I get the most excited about. I'm sure you will receive a lot of wonderful advice that will seem varied, contrary, and for the most part confusing. I think James' advice is very good, especially about monitor calibration and profiling. If your monitor is not calibrated then there is no point in proceeding to print as you are truely blind with regards to color management.

 

I tend to use lightroom to do the local contrast enhancement part of sharpening(now called clarity) and either photokit sharpener or lightroom's sharpening with masking for capture sharpening of a raw image. If you don't have lightroom, photokit or a later version of ACR or simply prefer to use photoshop, then James' unsharp mask settings are pretty close and work really well with Ids Mark II files. (I also use a 1DsMK II) With D70 files you may wish to experiment with the radius settings. Alternatively you can use a photoshop mask sharpening technique described by Mark Johnson of Radiantvista. It depends on the picture.

 

If I am doing the printing I use photokit's output sharpening or Mark's technique with good results....If I am sending out a print (just sent out 10 24"x30" photos for printing) then I don't apply any output sharpening as the pictures come back oversharpened from the online service I use which is elco..your results may and most likely will vary.

 

Michael Reichmann and Jeff Schwere have produced an almost 7 hour downloadable tutorial on digital printing....One of the topics they discuss specifically addresses your question regarding resolution (ie what DPI do I need to get an optimal print?) I think the cost of the download is around $30. It might be money well spent.

 

Again expect the opinions you receive to vary as this is an area that is still progressing in its development and continues to evolve.

 

all the best,

 

imasleeper

[ornate_wrasse 0]

Hi Ellen,

 

Here are my suggestions. I'm sure others will have different suggestions, but this is what works for me.

 

Calibrate your monitor.

 

Download the printer profile from Adorama for the printer and paper you'll be using.

 

Open the image.

 

Use unsharp mask: 120, .5, 0 as capture sharpening.

 

Resize it to 16x20 @ 220dpi or thereabouts. I think you should use Bicubic Smoother when resizing like this but can't remember.

 

<<<<Alternatively, don't resize it at all. Adorama may use their own upscaling algorithm which will work better than above. You should ask them. When I print w/ Mpix or Pictopia, I let them upsize my photos>>>>

 

Use unsharp mask with setting: 20, 30, 2 You may have to move the 30 setting up or down until you just start to see halos around edges in the image.

 

Go to "Proof Colors" (I think it's under Edit) and select the printer profile from Adorama. This will show you what the print will look like when it comes out.

 

Adjust saturation and curves/levels until it looks good again.

 

Go to Edit -> Convert to Profile and select the Adorama profile.

 

Save it as an 8 bit JPEG with highest quality.

 

You're done.

 

HTH

James

 

Thanks everyone for the replies. I've done some research and am in a bit of a quandry as to the best way to proceed.

 

First, I just got this MacBook Pro and not sure if I should go to the trouble of calibrating it. I've heard that laptop screens are notoriously bad at getting the color right. So, should I even bother? I was thinking of getting a desktop machine and would definitely calibrate the monitor for that. If I do calibrate my MB Pro, do you have any suggestions for the right calibration to use? BTW,it's a 15 inch screen with the newer LED technology.

 

I think, but am not sure, that the directions you gave me are for Photoshop. I currently don't own Photoshop, but I can see I need to purchase it soon

 

I called Adorama and they suggested that I resize it myself. And they suggest 300 dpi. I did download the profile, but I was told that the printer profile only works using Photoshop. Another reason to buy Photoshop!

 

FWIW, they suggested the Metallic paper for excellent vibrant color, so I think I'll go with that.

 

Fortunately, I have a daughter in high school, so I can get Photoshop CS3 with the educational discount

 

Again, thanks everyone, for the help.

 

Ellen

[hoovermd 0]

... If I do calibrate my MB Pro, do you have any suggestions for the right calibration to use? BTW,it's a 15 inch screen with the newer LED technology...

While we are on the subject of calibration... does anyone have any opinions as to whether the Colorvision Spyder 3 Elite is worth the $$ ??

http://www.colorvision.com/product-mc-s3elite.php

[james 0]

Hi Ellen,

 

Yes, definitely calibrate your Macbook - they LCD screens and video drivers now-adays calibrate pretty well.

 

You'll love Photoshop - have fun but don't be overwhelmed the first time you run it :-)

 

I HIGHLY recommend you try metallic paper. It makes incredible "glowing" prints that look very similar to what you expect them to come out looking like. Even better in fact.

 

Cheers

James

[ornate_wrasse 0]

Yes, definitely calibrate your Macbook -

 

You'll love Photoshop - have fun but don't be overwhelmed the first time you run it :-)

 

I HIGHLY recommend you try metallic paper.

 

Hi James,

 

http://www.calibration-direct.com/products.html

 

At the above link, they have a sale on several Spyder2 products until November 17th.

 

Their prices seem to be inexpensive.

 

In your opinion, will these products calibrate my MacBook Pro satisfactorily?

 

Thanks for the recommendation on the metallic paper. I was kind of wavering due to the higher price, but after reading your post, it sounds well worth the extra expense.

 

Kind regards,

 

Ellen

[Scuba_SI 39]

ooh! Good find, maybe i need one too!

 

I had the old spider Mk1. it gave my old computer a really red cast, i guess it was my error in the setup, but it looked so bad i took the profile off and never used it again!

 

Maybe we need a monitor calibration thread before this one gets hijacked! (Sorry Ellen!)

[ornate_wrasse 0]

Maybe we need a monitor calibration thread before this one gets hijacked! (Sorry Ellen!)

 

No problem!

 

I doubt if the thread will be hijacked for at least a few more days. He-who-must-not-be-named (but whose initials are D.S.!) is still banished from wetpixel

 

If you decide to purchase the Spyder calibration tool, be sure to post which one you've selected.

 

All the best,

 

Ellen

[Paul Kay 65]

My experience is a little different! If I get prints made I tend to get photographic prints - ie on light sensitive paper, usually Fuji Archiva. I follow the steps roughly as James has set out (with minor differences) BUT before writing the image to disk to send off (or email) I discard the profile (ie supply an untagged image file)!!!

 

I invariably get more consistent prints by doing so, and whilst the theory is wrong, I suspect that the RIP used by the Fuji printer actually does a very good job and profiling assumes that the labs moitors are profiled and operate in the same colour space, which I doubt they do - they certainly don't behave like it. This is an entirely empirically derived route for printing and its worth trying both ways (fully callibrated/tagged and untagged) with your own printing lab if you use an external one. If you print yourself its another story.......

[ornate_wrasse 0]

BUT before writing the image to disk to send off (or email) I discard the profile (ie supply an untagged image file)!!!

 

I invariably get more consistent prints by doing so.

 

Actually, what you are saying apparently makes sense to a lot of people having prints made at Adorama .

I asked Adorama when I called them "what do most people do when they send in their images for printing?"

I was told that most people do NOT use the printer profile that Adorama provides and that most leave it up to the Adorama technician to get the job done correctly.

 

Kind regards,

 

Ellen

[james 0]

Yeah, I'm sure the technicians at Adorama know what an underwater photo should look like - just let them adjust it! How different can it be from a wedding photo, right? ;-)

 

<the above is sarcastic>

 

You should adjust the photo yourself, and then when uploading it, check "DO NOT COLOR CORRECT"

 

That's just my opinion of course.

 

Cheers

James

[PRC 2]

My experience is a little different! If I get prints made I tend to get photographic prints - ie on light sensitive paper, usually Fuji Archiva. I follow the steps roughly as James has set out (with minor differences) BUT before writing the image to disk to send off (or email) I discard the profile (ie supply an untagged image file)!!!

 

I invariably get more consistent prints by doing so, and whilst the theory is wrong, I suspect that the RIP used by the Fuji printer actually does a very good job and profiling assumes that the labs moitors are profiled and operate in the same colour space, which I doubt they do - they certainly don't behave like it. This is an entirely empirically derived route for printing and its worth trying both ways (fully callibrated/tagged and untagged) with your own printing lab if you use an external one. If you print yourself its another story.......

 

 

Hi Paul,

 

Who are you using in the UK ?

 

I have been using Photobox (who don't accept profiles anyhow) - for up to A2 size but have not tried any other print shop.

 

Paul C

Edited November 14, 2007 by PRC

[tdpriest 115]

I use Photobox and just send AdobeRGB files that are brighter than the ones I use on displays (ie gamma shifted about 20%).

 

I use NoiseNinja to sharpen at the beginning of processing, during noise reduction (which I disable in camera).

 

I let Photobox enlarge from a full-size image (10 Mp). When I used a D70, I used the full-size image in the same way. Photobox laser scan onto Fuji paper.

 

These are as good as some images blown up professionally by the illustration department in my hospital, where some of my fish adorn the main corridor as 48" diagonal prints.

 

I'm calibrating my Mac with a Huey PRO, which seems pretty good.

 

Tim

 

B)

[Paul Kay 65]

Hi Paul,

 

Who are you using in the UK ?

 

I have been using Photobox (who don't accept profiles anyhow) - for up to A2 size but have not tried any other print shop.

 

Paul C

 

Hi Paul

 

My local dealer can print up to 15" x 10" on glossy Fuji Archiva Paper (which I personally like) so I get them to print at this size and then use Peak for bigger prints (on the same paper). So far they prints haven't been substantially different and I've no cause for complaint, but if I had, this way I have the smaller 'proof' print to send off to Peak. Since the smaller prints are produced on a £100,000+ printer, I figure that it beats anything I could be bothered with (I'm not into the mechanics of printing, just the final print!). But I have tried profiled and profile remove files and the ones with the profile removed, invariably work better - and yes I know this is wrong in theory, but I've established it empirically and since I don't want to mess up prints proving a point, I remove the profiles........

[PRC 2]

But I have tried profiled and profile remove files and the ones with the profile removed, invariably work better - and yes I know this is wrong in theory, but I've established it empirically and since I don't want to mess up prints proving a point, I remove the profiles........

 

Thanks Paul - hey I am not fussed over the theory - the practical takes the award every time.

 

Paul C