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Problems Blufin with Fathom for Xr520

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Hi togheter,

 

I just come back from a Galapagos Trip and realizing that a lot of my Footage has following Problems.

 

1. Very often Black Corners on the Edge

 

2. Very often light reflection on right or left corner.

 

I was using a Blufin Housing Pro for the Xr520 togheter with Fathom Optics.

 

I heard that the active Steadyshot is the Reason for the black Corners when using a Wide Angel, but is there somebody who use same Equipment and has tested already?

 

Thanks for any comment

 

Michael

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Here are two Pics with who showing my Problem. Dolphin Picture with Reflection and Fish School with black Edge on the right side.

 

Sorry for bad Quality I just copyed teh first Image what I found.

 

dolphin.jpg

 

salema.jpg

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I think your AF seeking has a lot to do with it. Do you see the glare in the corner all the time or does it come in and out of the frame? My guess is that it floats in and out and that it's related to focus seeking. I had a similar problem, when the shot was in focus the edges were fine but when the camera tried to focus in the blue and racked in and out i saw it. Not sure why.

 

The dolphin shot for example is out of focus. Was the whole scene out of focus or just this part? Was there a problem with the in focus parts? Look at your footage and see if you see a relationship between the focus and corner. If you lock the focus when you are shooting wide angle then you'll solve this. Not only should it solve the corner issue but it's just better WA technique and will help you get less out of focus shots.

 

DanB

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Here are two Pics with who showing my Problem. Dolphin Picture with Reflection and Fish School with black Edge on the right side.

 

Sorry for bad Quality I just copyed teh first Image what I found.

 

dolphin.jpg

 

salema.jpg

 

I agree with Dan that the Dolphin shot looks out of focus, but the second screen grab definitely has vignetting occurring. If you look at the video posted in another thread http://wetpixel.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=31111 shot with the same camera and housing you'll also see a couple of the shots where it is happening as well. If it was me I'd contact Light & Motion to inform them that the housing has a vignetting problem, but also to ask what they plan to do about it.

 

Cheers, Simon

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Dear Simon and Dan,

 

with the Focus I have to check my Footage tommorow., but I never had this Problem with my HC7 before.

 

About the Vignetting, yes the other Video has this too.

 

My Dealer told me that is a Problem of the Active Steady Shot. When the Active Mode is on then it looks when you move the Camera that the Lense follow slower as the Main Movement. I do not know how I can explain it right, but I was hopping somebody has tested or can say its defnetly not the Problem of the Active Steadyshot.

 

regards

 

Michael

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Hi Micheal

 

The only way to test it would be to film without the steadyshot on as you shouldn't really need it underwater anyway (some people say to absolutely turn it off underwater). Perhaps you can ask your dealer and L&M to confirm this does not happen when steadyshot is turned off?

 

Another option on what could be causing the glare/reflection on the first image is when the front of the camcorder is a shiny chrome colour you can sometimes get light reflecting back onto the port from this which can cause problems. The way to get over that is to use black tape to cover the shiny areas on the front of your camcorder. There have also been issues in the past with record lights on the camera causing similar problems.

 

Probably the quickest and perhaps the only way to sort these problems out for the footage you have already shot would be to zoom the image in slightly in your editing software. Maybe 5% zoom would be all that is required.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Cheers, Simon

 

edit - Just looked at the first image again. It could be a case of a flip filter not being all the way over the lens. That's the last thing I can think that it could be.

Edited by SimonSpear

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I agree with Dan that the Dolphin shot looks out of focus, but the second screen grab definitely has vignetting occurring. If you look at the video posted in another thread http://wetpixel.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=31111 shot with the same camera and housing you'll also see a couple of the shots where it is happening as well. If it was me I'd contact Light & Motion to inform them that the housing has a vignetting problem, but also to ask what they plan to do about it.

 

Cheers, Simon

 

yes, simon, i noticed the very same problem in this video as well. the vignetting problem seems to pop up when the camera moves. it almost looks like the camera is loose inside the housing and that the jerking of the housing causes the camera to wiggle slightly inside the housing causing vignetting. not sure if this is the reason but looks like a problem.

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Being that is is in the bottom right, I would definitely make sure the flip filter was all the way in the down position (if you were not using it). Ive seen plenty of footage where users did not flip the filter all the way and just the edge showed (as it looks like here).

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Hi Mike,

 

I undersatnd what you mean and sure it can be happen. But look at this Picture it has the Same but on the left side.

 

regards

 

Michaeladlerrochen.jpg

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Ok so my new question is, are you using the filter or no? Reason I ask, if the filter is ON in this shot, but is not fully flipped, then it can show in the bottom left corner (as it is). Its amazing how sensitive flip filters can be at times.

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Ok so my new question is, are you using the filter or no? Reason I ask, if the filter is ON in this shot, but is not fully flipped, then it can show in the bottom left corner (as it is). Its amazing how sensitive flip filters can be at times.

 

I was not using the Filter the Whole Trip. So it can not be. I contacted LIGHT & Motion today and hope thhey will response on that. I will post it hear then..

 

regards

 

Michael

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Hi togheter,

 

I just come back from a Galapagos Trip and realizing that a lot of my Footage has following Problems.

 

1. Very often Black Corners on the Edge

 

2. Very often light reflection on right or left corner.

 

I was using a Blufin Housing Pro for the Xr520 togheter with Fathom Optics.

 

I heard that the active Steadyshot is the Reason for the black Corners when using a Wide Angel, but is there somebody who use same Equipment and has tested already?

 

Thanks for any comment

 

Michael

 

irregardless of the vignetting issue, i would love to see some of your galapagos footage. have you posted any? =)

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irregardless of the vignetting issue, i would love to see some of your galapagos footage. have you posted any? =)

 

not yet lemon, only point what I di was uploading on my Computer and sort out. May next 2 Weeks. My Job are to busy right now. regards Michael

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Ok well it will be interesting to hear what L&M says. Im sure Paul there will get back to you very soon

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Hi togheter,

 

below the Answear from Light & Motion. So let us test out is it working or not. Only about the Reflection Ihave to double check on the next Trip and when I finaly looked at my complete Footage..

 

Cheers for now

 

Michael

 

 

Hello Michael,

 

The Vignetting is caused when the camcorder is set to 'Active' stabilization

mode. The resolution is to set the camcorder to Standard stabilization or to

turn it off.

 

The systems have been tested with the stabilization set to Standard and Off

and there is no vignetting.

 

Feel free to contact me if you need more information.

 

Best Regards,

Paul Barnett

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Very nice, easy solution, and as I figured, prompt reply by Mr. Barnett

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Mr Barnett,

 

I find your solution UNACCEPTABLE!

 

This is a small camera/housing, therefore much more susceptable to camera shake than a larger system, and the active image stabilizer is crucial to producing an acceptable image in this housing.

 

With the stabilizer set to "standard" or "off", there is considerably more shake in the shot, to the point where image becomes unwatchable, especially when viewing in Hi-Def on a large screen. This makes the fancy macro diopter and full zoom-through options worthless.

 

You are then forced to crop in post, and now you do not have a true HD shot.

 

I suggest you reevaluate your optics with this system, and you will be hearing from me in person!

 

 

 

Very nice, easy solution, and as I figured, prompt reply by Mr. Barnett

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Well daveerdoc, I pretty much shoot with OIS/Steadyshot off.The little gyro sensors can be tricked underwater into thinking there's motion (say in a swell) when the operator is still with the subject.

I'll agree little housings are more difficult to shoot stably. However, housings can be balanced. I've not shot with the LMI BF for the XR500 series so I can't say it's easily adjusted for balance. I do think that except for macro, IS isn't as beneficial as it is topside.

The issue of vignetting comes from the fact that the Sony sensor is bigger (1/2.88" if I'm not wrong) and as such, the optics for a general lens like the LMI WA, which Fathoms designed to work with 1/2.9" cameras and smaller, will be a little too small when used with Steady Shot at full.

I wonder if the 1/2.6" Canon HFS10 has issues with the lens. Canon's OIS isn't as aggressive as the Sony but it is a bigger sensor.

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Well daveerdoc, I pretty much shoot with OIS/Steadyshot off.The little gyro sensors can be tricked underwater into thinking there's motion (say in a swell) when the operator is still with the subject.

I'll agree little housings are more difficult to shoot stably. However, housings can be balanced. I've not shot with the LMI BF for the XR500 series so I can't say it's easily adjusted for balance. I do think that except for macro, IS isn't as beneficial as it is topside.

The issue of vignetting comes from the fact that the Sony sensor is bigger (1/2.88" if I'm not wrong) and as such, the optics for a general lens like the LMI WA, which Fathoms designed to work with 1/2.9" cameras and smaller, will be a little too small when used with Steady Shot at full.

I wonder if the 1/2.6" Canon HFS10 has issues with the lens. Canon's OIS isn't as aggressive as the Sony but it is a bigger sensor.

 

Well Drew, we'll soon find out as I will be getting one of the first here in the UK. Await my report. See also my troubles with the L & M housing and S10 on the S10 specific thread.

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You mean you cannot get a definitive answer from your dealer regarding the lens' compatibility with the housing and camera?

I find it rather interesting that LMI did not put the vignetting issue on their website or notify their dealers.

I do want to clarify which lens all the complaints of vignetting are coming from? Is this the 80 or 100?

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As the vignetting is only at the bottom, maybe you could put a shim under the front of the camera. Something like a thin rectangle of plastic stuck to the tray.

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Just a clarification, but the Fathom lenses used by Light & Motion on the Sony cameras will not work with HF S10. Optically they don't work, and the bayonet mount on the HF S10 is larger to accommodate wider diameter optics.

 

New lenses for HF S10 are in development.

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Thanks Ryan. I was surprised by Johnny's remark about not knowing and having the first lens without knowing whether there'll be issues or not. If the dealer doesn't know, then I'd change dealers or ask here and hope someone in the know does answer. Saves a lot of anguish and frustration IF there are issues after the purchase.

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Thanks Ryan. I was surprised by Johnny's remark about not knowing and having the first lens without knowing whether there'll be issues or not. If the dealer doesn't know, then I'd change dealers or ask here and hope someone in the know does answer. Saves a lot of anguish and frustration IF there are issues after the purchase.

 

Drew. To clarify: I still await the S10 fathom lens [80 degree]. whether or not it vignettes, i will have to wait and see. My issues at the moment are with the housings manual gears and OLED backs. Everyone: Please see other thread on Canon HFS10.

 

Regards

 

John

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Well Drew, we'll soon find out as I will be getting one of the first here in the UK. Await my report. See also my troubles with the L & M housing and S10 on the S10 specific thread.

 

John

I read your post as I thought it sounded like you didn't know if it worked or not. That surprised me as I would hope LMI and their dealers would be able to give you a definitive answer with details. It seems details like the lens vignetting with steady shot in Active mode wasn't clear with daveerdoc or the OP. It's little things like that where details on the website etc would easily solve.

A line like: "Possible vignetting with SteadySHot on Active with this lens" would alleviate many problems for both customers and dealers.

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