First DLSR Setup

[greedo5678 1]

Hey all,

 

Im trying to budget my first DLSR setup and then cost up what i can afford. Firstly i use a little ixus compact and strobe and wet lenses at the moment and Canon 450D on land. I am happy with the uw results i get but just want more options, controls and quality to get the images i want. I am moving to the Philippines and hope to be diving almost every day, as i will be running a dive operation.

 

Diving in my area is amazing, pristine reefs with some large schools, but mainly macro, nudis galore, 2 or 3 great muck dives, a couple of great wall dives and the bonus of whale sharks from nov-apr.

 

So what i have decided so far is the Canon 7d housed in Aquatica A7D. Im thinking twin Inon z-240s to light it all up using fibre optic. Thats basically what i have set in my head.

 

Lens wise i have a 18-55, 70-200 which work from my 450d, but i dont see much use for them, maybe the 18-55 for whale sharks, larger fish shots... but is it worth the effort of gearing?

 

I will prob go with Canon 100mm macro (standard version not the new one) and flat port. i love macro stuff but some of the gobies etc here are a little shy hence 100 over 60 and also the water is obviously quite clear.

 

Im also thinking Tokina 10-17? with a dome? But what size? 6 seems small and maybe a waste on the lens? 8 seems like the best bet but is it worth forking out for the 9"? And if i get these will the 18-55 work in the same port with maybe jsut a different gear? cos that would save a lot of hassle and give me more options. Correct me if im worng but this lens seems the lens of choice for wide reef shots, fish schools, possibly the sharks, diver shots etc.

 

So apart from strobe arms, and can anyone recommend any brand and why over any other, is there anything else i should think of.... teleconverters, dioptres of any size, aiming lights, anything. The camera kit here is limited so would love to get it all in one go either at home in the uk or shipped from probably backscatter.

 

Anything i have missed....

 

Any help welcome

 

Olly

[Mike L 0]

Olly,

 

You are on the right track. As for lenses, a perfect set up for the 7d would be the Tokina 10-17 (cant get any better than this for wide angle), 60mm macro and 100mm macro. That covers all your basis. The 18-55 is versatile, but just isnt a real quality lens overall.

 

You should take a close look at the new Nauticam 7D housings. They have many engineering firsts, very ergonomic, compact, versatile and all at a great price as well. It has fiber optics, and for $100 you can have Nikonos style sync cords. The Nauticam 180 Viewfinder is the first of its kind with a user adjustable diopter..and adapter rings to fit nearly all manufacturers housings!

 

For ports, Id suggest going with either the 8.5" dome, or the Zen 100mm dome. If you want to use the 18-55, then you definitely need the 8.5" port. The Zen 100mm only works with the 10-17.

 

Sea and Sea also has their 7d housing coming out in March. Its a very nice set up as well, a bit more pricey though at $3799.

[greedo5678 1]

Thanks Mike, have looked at the Nauticam housing and it does look nice. my choice was litterally down to price as i could not see any true benefits of one over the other. really hope to see them in the flesh at the London Dive Show. Sea and Sea is way more expensive. That $1000 will go along way in the philippines!

 

Viewfinder wise, i have never used one or seen one in use, are they really worth that much?

 

i forgot to ask, is the kit lens on the 7d, 18-135 useful at all? i guess land based, very useful... is it worth it , or shall i go body only?

 

Olly

[Alex_Tattersall 90]

Hi Olly,

 

I've just sent you a PM, I'm setting up as the official UK distributor of Nauticam housings and have a 7D prototype in the air as we speak if you want to see one in the flesh.

 

Alex

[Mike L 0]

Olly:

 

The Nauticam and Aquatica are the same price. The S&S is more thats for sure. Viewfinders are VERY nice and VERY useful. Makes the image larger and easier to see. Allows you to better see if your shot is in focus. Sits against your mask better so that the regulator is not bumping the housing.

 

As for the 18-135, I do not think of it as a very useful lens for underwater. Its OK for land...but not great. I have one and bought it only because the kit was all that was available at the time. Some like the versatility of the lens for topside use though as an all around lens.

[greedo5678 1]

Yeah it seems like the prices are the same now. i think maybe provisional prices showed the Nauticam to be about 2-300 more. Anyway, Backscatter now advertise them as a dollar different so, thats good.

 

Will def look at viewfinders. maybe i can stretch to it, or maybe have to budget for it at a later date. Having never looked thro a dlsr underwater i have no idea what to expect in regards, mask views and reg stuff. Random thought is it better to have black silica mask or clear?

[Mike L 0]

With regards to your mask, I personally like using a black mask with a black silicon skirt. Having all black reduces lighting coming in from other sources so I essentially have "tunnel vision" directly into my viewfinder.

[frisco 0]

Olly,

 

have a look at the Hugyfot housing that should have just been released; Hugyfot is one of the most compact and light housing on the market and its prince range should be similar to Aquatica or Nauticam. You will need a flat port for the 60mm, an extension ring for the 100mm and a fish-eye port + zoom ring for the Tokina 10-17; a 45° viewfinder is also available, and is way cheaper than the Nauticam one (the viewfinder is manufactured by Inon); to have a fair idea of the budget you can look here Unterwasserkamera .... This is a reputable source in Austria (price should be similar to the 5D housing). As far as strobes are concerned, you can't go wrong with the Inon's Z-240, but I suggest you check prices in Hong Kong, Singapore or Taiwan which should be way cheaper than UK (I bought my Inons Z-240 at Divervision together with Fantasea BJ arms in a package for US$ 699,00 each) .... If you are going to connect the Inons via fiber-optic just make sure you buy the original Inon cables, which perform much better compared to cheaper 10Bar clones .... If you like supermacro consider adding a Canon 250D diopter to achieve 2X magnification.

 

All the Best and good shopping ..... Francesco

[Viz'art 24]

Hi Greedo, I use the 6'' dome with the Tokina 10-17mm on my Aquatica with splendid result, why I choose this one, when I obliviously have choice working for the company (see signature) is for its size (and in your case, price), plus it will work fine with the 18-55mm, I would recommend the larger 8'' also as a more flexible solution if you want frequent use of larger rectilinear wide angle lenses and the even larger glass dome 9.25'' dome if A) you want to contribute to my retirement plan ;-) and more seriously B) if you plan on using wider rectilinear wide angle lenses such as the 10-22mm and plan on doing a whole lot of over/under shots.

 

The 100mm macro is the best choice you can make given the info you gave us no matter what housing you choose, I would consider adding a 1.4x tele converter from Kenko for using with both the Tokina 10-17mm for extreme close up wide angle and the 100mm for those little rascals, plus the extension required for the 100 macro can be used with the Tokina+1.4x converter and the one for the 10-17mm & 18-55 can be added to the 100mm one if you use the 1.4x and the 100mmm together, this will make for a package with maximum punch with minimal luggage footprint.

 

As for strobe connection: the housing can also set up with both type of connectors Optical and Nikonos type (or optionally with Ikelite, or S6 for that matter, if it flashes we can connect it!) and we also officially introduced the 20065-HYB version which has both optical and Nikonos type installed when shipping (we did quite a few 7D housing this way from the get go, but did not have an official item number for it. But stick to your choice its A+ and the one I am getting for my own kit.

 

Now for the Viewfinder, I wish the Nauticam pundits would get their facts straight. they are not the only one with user adjustable dioptric, we do and its a simple affair that you do only once with the mechanism safely inside the housing where it should be, that is unless you plan on sharing your housing with multiple visually challenged underwater photographers, in this case you could adapt their viewfinder to our housing, if you don't mind having part of your rear LCD blocked off by the overhang of their design. (sorry, but misinformed statement, innuendo and half truth irritate the hell out of me).

 

here is a list of the items you should get quoted on should you consider an Aquatica.

 

20065-OPT housing for 7D

 

FOR WIDE

18409 6'' dome port

18484 6'' dome shade FE

OR

18405 8'' dome port

18480 8: dome shade FE

and

18456 Extension for both the Tokina 10-17mm & Canon 18-55mm

18717 Zoom gear for Tokina 10-17mm

18703 Zoom gear for Canon 18-55mm

 

FOR MACRO (2 choices)

18453 Extension for Canon 100mm Macro (required for both choices)

and

18428 AF Flat Macro port

Or

18426 AF/MF flat Macro port

18700.1 Focus gear for Canon 100mm Macro (both new and old version)

 

There is also a kit including the Aqua View (20065-OPT-VF), but the supplied standard finder let you see the integrity of the camera viewfinder image quite well, the Aqua View (and other extended viewfinder alike) basically improve on that by enhancing what you where seeing, making it both larger and easier to see, as I tell people, its the kind of accessory that does nothing to actually improve the quality of the final images, its expensive and quite unnecessary until the day you try one, then I double dare you to want to remove it from your housing. its like a big screen television, it does not make the picture any better, the actors are as genial or lames, but it make looking at the movie that much nicer.

 

Lastly I suggest you go in a shop preferably one that carries both makes and more, (The Hugyphot is also a nice rig if they have Optical connectors available). then you are less likely to get biased information, admittedly as a member of the industry I am biased toward my own brand and very conscious of that fact, it is difficult sometime to remain informative and credible, I just keep reminding myself that I got in this business because I was an underwater photographer, and that is how I joined this forum, as a underwater photographer willing to learn and share and eventually improve my skills both as a maker of images and of the equipment used for making them.

[Scubysnaps 9]

I have the Aquatica viewfinder Olly and can vouch for what Jean says, as someone told me on here, if you're over 40, its a must. I tried my set up in the pool and Vobster before I bought the viewfinder, so I know and can show you the difference. If you're ever down Portsmouth way let me know and I can go through my set up with you, I have the Z240's too, half the UK retail from Yuzo.

 

Cheers

Paul

[greedo5678 1]

Jean, a full and informative reply as ever.

 

Id really like to buy a dome that might last a few years and be versatile as i maybe add lenses to my bag; and so i may go with the 8".

 

I really like the idea of having one gear that works on both lenses and the 1.4x tc sounds real cool. i love WA macro so that might be a definate option.

 

As for adjustable dioptre? why would i need that? surely if i adjust it on the camera, the viewfinder should be true and in focus anyway? But yeah, there is no way im sharing this housing with anyone, esp short sighted photographers!! (ok might let the wife hold it ... once...)

And i think viewfinders sound real helpful, and if and only if they dont block the LCD. Dont think there would be anything more annoying.

 

There are no shops in the UK that stock both brands or any more than 2. Cameras Underwater stock Aquatica and Ike and Sea and Sea. They did have a Aq. d90 housin to hold, which really felt good. Was gonna go with ike until i held one and saw the size! The Aq. just felt right in the hands but as i say it was the d90 not the 7d. Did look at OceanOptics and Subal, until i saw the price and almost fainted! Why are they that much?!!! Never had my hands on, or seen an Nauticam, but i really hope to at London Dive Show LIDS. Is there any store in the USA i can talk to for a non biased opinion? Backscatter?

 

Hugyfot, looks nice and smooth but not sure about their locking system, can someone shed some light on it?

 

As you say, all opinions are slightly biased as they are all from Industry people but i hope to get my hands on them soon. If the Aq a7d feels as good as the d90 i will be hard pressed to change my mind, but the import price of the nauticam is winning me over...

 

Olly

[aussie 0]

Hi Olly. I picked up my Aquatic A7D this week, have had a couple of days diving with it, and am very happy. I had a 40D before, and have played around with the D90 housing too, this new one is far superior!

 

You're going to love the 7D too mate.

[Undertow 31]

you're definitely on the right track. i can recommend aquatica, have the D200 and D700 housings. Their newer housings are a notch up and very well crafted. really impressed with the D700 housing.

 

the viewfinder's not necessary, it's bloody $$$, but using it is a real treat and hard to give up once you try it. depends on your sight, but the standard finder's not bad with a super low volume mask (i use aqualung micromask). but the mask and the big viewfinder together (& full frame sensor) is just magnificent, i tell ya. and yes get a black mask, cuts out extraneous light. all divers should do this, but photographers especially. it also helps to get a 2 window mask over a single, the cut off in the middle blocks light when you're looking through the viewfinder.

 

i'd also suggest you get the 60mm, its a great length for many things and you won't need any extra ports or hardware if you're setup for the 100mm. Cheers,

 

Chris

[greedo5678 1]

Undertow,

Unfortunately i have a big nose! and cant do 2 window masks, but love my single Atomic, which comes in black silicon too, so will get that.

 

Im thinkin if the 60mm will use the same port as the 100mm minus maybe a ext ring, maybe this is money well spent. If you guys had to budget this, would you go with a new lens or a viewfinder?

 

Olly

[Viz'art 24]

Undertow,

Unfortunately i have a big nose! and cant do 2 window masks, but love my single Atomic, which comes in black silicon too, so will get that.

 

Im thinkin if the 60mm will use the same port as the 100mm minus maybe a ext ring, maybe this is money well spent. If you guys had to budget this, would you go with a new lens or a viewfinder?

 

Olly

 

Depends on how big is your nose , if you can live whitout the extended viewfinder, then a lens is going to expend your visual boundaries a lot more, so yeah, definitely the lens first, finder second!

[Stewart L. Sy 12]

Hi Olly

 

Are you going to be working at Peter's? If so, I'll see you there in November!

 

After using Subal for 10 years, I sold my housing pretty soon after I fondled...er...played with the Aquatica 5dmk2 housing. I now have an Aquatica AQ7d housing on it's way to me from Backscatter. I would try the 8" dome since you won't be travelling a lot with your setup, I'm shooting the 6" dome but that's mainly due to travel considerations. I do have the Tokina 10-17 coming as well.

 

The 100 and 60 macros are a must in your kit, add a 1.4 TC and probably a Reefnet Subeye Magnifier. You can choose to get their port mount or make your own. A Woody's push on diopter might also be a good addition. 1 lens that I plan to adapt to my Aquatica will be the Canon EF 28-105 zoom. I've used this lens with great results and is well suited to the sizes of the critters usually found in Philippine waters. A slightly wider (and consequently shorter focal length) solution would be the Sigma 17-70, several folks on this site like it a lot. The 28-105 works behind a flat port while the 17-70 will be behind a dome.

 

The one question you'll need to answer is how to trigger your strobes, either optically or electric. I've gone the electric route as my older S&S YS120s don't do slaved too well, plus I've already got all the sync cords I need.

 

As to mask choice, I do like the Mares and Cressi low volume masks, black silicone of course. You can easily clear them even with the housing up to your face since the strap mounts are up high on the mask and the mask just pivots on them.

 

The viewfinder would be a nice option if you have the budget for it, but agree with Jean, get the lenses first then the finder later.

 

I'd strongly recommend getting a light that doesn't use proprietary batteries, easier to replace. I've used the Suprema 44 LED dive lights, you can buy a whole bunch of them for what some of the pricier lights are going for. The Suprema has a nice wide beam, didn't scare away the mandarin fish I shot in Puerto Galera, and the batteries last a long time.

 

Good Luck!

 

Stu

Edited February 5, 2010 by scubastu

[greedo5678 1]

Stu,

 

Nope, not working at Peters. Been at Sogod Scuba for a while now.

 

Think i will go with the 60 and 100 over a viewfinder at the start. i will look at TC's when im there. As for wet diopters, i have no idea really.

 

Not sure about any of these zoom, non specific lenses. Will prob get the kit lens 18-135 that comes with it, and if that fits simply in the port then see what that does.

 

Strobes will be optical. So much less hassle.

 

Mask, i will not change. My mask is amazing. Heres a thought, u shouldnt have to clear it. It should fit. All i will be doin is buying the black version.

 

Was thinking of an aimin light. Saw a guy have a specific ext ring on his macro port that attaches to a torch....

 

Olly