Removing water marks on port glass?

[TimG 62]

Hey Davide

I'm not sure there is/was a coating. Certainly I couldn't see anything on the exterior of the glass when angled against light - other than the "bloom" which has now gone after the Mother treatment.

[Davide DB 608]

I've always had polycarbonate lenses and always solved it with scratch remover fluid. Here in Rome we have very calcareous water and sometimes rinsing is even worse. I usually soak everything in a solution of Salt-X.
Now that I have a glass WWL-1, I am concerned.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Davide DB

[ChrisRoss 150]

On 8/9/2021 at 2:52 AM, Davide DB said:

I've always had polycarbonate lenses and always solved it with scratch remover fluid. Here in Rome we have very calcareous water and sometimes rinsing is even worse. I usually soak everything in a solution of Salt-X.
Now that I have a glass WWL-1, I am concerned.

I would suggest two steps, soak it in your tap water then seeing as how the WWL is relatively small soak it in demineralised water after the tap water in a smaller container.  The tap water you can use bigger volumes for rinsing and soaking to dilute the salt and then the demin water to get prevent deposits.   Or if you have a water softener that would also help. 

If the water is particularly alkaline then a few drops of white vinegar might also assist, glass is more likely to be etched by alkaline solutions.

[Davide DB 608]

Thank you Chris,

It remains a mystery to me why manufacturers don't provide an official answer on such a common problem. It is clear that in the long run a simple rinse is not enough.

[ChrisRoss 150]

17 hours ago, Davide DB said:

Thank you Chris,

It remains a mystery to me why manufacturers don't provide an official answer on such a common problem. It is clear that in the long run a simple rinse is not enough.

I would think that if you follow good practice and rinse/soak and importantly dry off the lens elements so the water does not evaporate from the surface you are unlikely to get problems for a long time.  I would speculate that many people don't take such good care of their gear based on observing how people handle gear when I've been on trips. 

I think not letting water even rinse water dry on your glass is quite important.  As the water evaporates the concentration of any salts/alkalis increases and becomes more reactive on the glass and repeatedly leaving water spots on the glass can build up over time.

As for the manufacturers their recommendations for care would be enough to avoid the majority of problems, but many people are not meticulous in their maintenance.

[TimG 62]

8 hours ago, ChrisRoss said:

think not letting water even rinse water dry on your glass is quite important.  As the water evaporates the concentration of any salts/alkalis increases and becomes more reactive on the glass and repeatedly leaving water spots on the glass can build up over time.

Chris you mentioned this on an earlier post and, honestly, the wipe-over is something I have never even thought about before. A great point, thanks. It's now part of my regular post dive care.

I've never actually seen spots which have dried on my ports but, most certainly, after a few months and many dives a "bloom" on the port begins to appear.

As you helpfully pointed out to in an earlier post, this doesn't seem to happen with domeports as most of us put a neoprene cover on the port (because of its cost!) and this keeps the port moist until rinsed thoroughly and, I guess, dried by the cover.

A small bottle of fresh water and a lint-free cloth are now permanently in my dive camera bag for a quick rinse n'wipe after the dives!

[ChrisRoss 150]

11 hours ago, TimG said:

Chris you mentioned this on an earlier post and, honestly, the wipe-over is something I have never even thought about before. A great point, thanks. It's now part of my regular post dive care.

I've never actually seen spots which have dried on my ports but, most certainly, after a few months and many dives a "bloom" on the port begins to appear.

As you helpfully pointed out to in an earlier post, this doesn't seem to happen with domeports as most of us put a neoprene cover on the port (because of its cost!) and this keeps the port moist until rinsed thoroughly and, I guess, dried by the cover.

A small bottle of fresh water and a lint-free cloth are now permanently in my dive camera bag for a quick rinse n'wipe after the dives!

I still dry my ports after soaking, first a blast with a blower bulb to move most of the water then a large microfibre cloth to dry it off.  The housing gets similar - blow water off the viewfinder, back window and also a quick blast to remove water from the optical port window.

[Julien DM 1]

Thanks Chris for the explanation about salt concentration. Always have been taking extreme care about my equipment and working in a very hot area, when I was seeing my neoprene cover getting quickly dry, I was afraid it could damage the glass. From now on I will be less stressed thanks to you !

The only lens I have had water marks on was my CMC 2, thought I lost it so decided to scrub it very hard with a wet microfiber cloth. I took a while and multiple attempts but each time it was getting better. It is fine now. But it could be different kind of marks that you guys were talking about

[Draq 135]

I don't have this issue at the moment, but I have a question or two....

Many dome ports are marketed as being coated on the exterior of the domes,  much like lenses, I suppose.   A lot of the recommendations above are for abrasives or somewhat harsh chemicals.  I never see anyone advocating using such products on camera  lenses.  Are we sure these products are really a good choice?  I guess maybe stripping the coating off of a dome is better than a dome with bad water spots, but has anyone ever asked a manufacturer for suggestions?

Just wondering, for when it is my turn.

Has anyone tried optic-specific products like R.O.R. or Zeiss lens cleaner or Eclipse?  I doubt they would work, but have not seen them mentioned.

[ChrisRoss 150]

2 hours ago, Draq said:

I don't have this issue at the moment, but I have a question or two....

Many dome ports are marketed as being coated on the exterior of the domes,  much like lenses, I suppose.   A lot of the recommendations above are for abrasives or somewhat harsh chemicals.  I never see anyone advocating using such products on camera  lenses.  Are we sure these products are really a good choice?  I guess maybe stripping the coating off of a dome is better than a dome with bad water spots, but has anyone ever asked a manufacturer for suggestions?

Just wondering, for when it is my turn.

Has anyone tried optic-specific products like R.O.R. or Zeiss lens cleaner or Eclipse?  I doubt they would work, but have not seen them mentioned.

It's hard to say - where do you draw the line on what is unacceptable?  The reason such things are required is that the surface is etched by concentrated salts when water evaporates on the glass.  It's not a film that can be removed  - etching means the surface texture has changed and the only way out is to polish the surface again.

It doesn't have to be your turn though - I always say prevention is better than cure for this problem.  Prevention consist of keeping the port glass wet until you can rinse off thoroughly and dry it .  First use a blower bulb to blow off all the droplets you can then a microfibre cloth to to wipe over the port so water does not evaporate and dry off on the surface.  IT is the water evaporating that causes the problem.

To keep the dome wet cover it it with the wet neoprene cover and throw a damp towel over it all.  For a macro port put a cap on it and throw the towel over it.  If you have a cooler bag for a personal rinse tank, leave it in there.  Do not let it dry out till you can rinse/soak it and then immediately dry it.  Doing this with your aluminium housing also preserves the appearance I've seen some very worn faded looking Nauticam housings around and this is from the same issue.

[Davide DB 608]

7 hours ago, ChrisRoss said:

I've seen some very worn faded looking Nauticam housings around and this is from the same issue

[Draq 135]

I do try to be careful and keep the housing and port wet until it can be properly soaked and dried, not just for water spots, but O ring protection from dried salt as well, but sometimes things can go wrong on a hot Caribbean day on a small boat.

Still curious about the use of abrasives, commercial window cleaning products and chemicals on coated ports, though. 

[TimG 62]

2 hours ago, Draq said:

sometimes things can go wrong on a hot Caribbean day on a small boat.

Sounds like the opening line to a song from Meatloaf (RIP)

[lasbaegas 3]

Nauticam recommends novus #2 with a clean microfiber cloth cloth (do NOT use the abrasive paper that sometimes comes with novus 2). Also I was told while glass used to have a coating, currently the coating/treatment is only in the inside of the glass that isn’t exposed. 

as a preventative, Marc at Bluewater photo recommends salt x as well after a soak. I think a rinse with some drinking water after that would probably be ideal, then a wipe down with a microfiber cloth.

I wish this was day one information. Places like south Fakarava pass and kri eco resort have brackish water coming out of the tap, not so nice for glass especially on long trips. 

Edited March 23 by lasbaegas

[bghazzal 89]

I've been reading up on this as I have some stains on a (coated, according to specs) Inon UCL-165 lens bought second-hand in Thailand afew years back.

Looking into Mothers California Gold Water Spot Remover for Glass (which is available in Indonesia, but way more expensive than the zillion other glass cleaners / spot removers offered to car-lovers on Tokopedia)
I found a safety data sheet which lists the following ingredients for Mothers:

Mothers_06712_MPUSSDS_USA.pdf

I guess Aluminum oxide would be the most active / abrasive?

Edited June 7 by bghazzal

[ChrisRoss 150]

44 minutes ago, bghazzal said:

I've been reading up on this as I have some stains on a (coated, according to specs) Inon UCL-165 lens bought second-hand in Thailand afew years back.

Looking into Mothers California Gold Water Spot Remover for Glass (which is available in Indonesia, but way more expensive than the zillion other glass cleaners / spot removers offered to car-lovers on Tokopedia)
I found a safety data sheet which lists the following ingredients for Mothers:

Mothers_06712_MPUSSDS_USA.pdf 56.52 kB · 0 downloads

I guess Aluminum oxide would be the most active / abrasive?

It's the only thing abrasive in the mix, the rest is just a carrier.