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kstokell

EM5 Mk2 and YS-D2 TTL support?

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Hi All,

I've just found out according to the "YS-D2 Slave function compatibility chart" that the EM5 mk2 does not support "DS-TTLⅡ" but does support "SlaveTTL", is this a big problem?
It seems the EM1 supports both, is this a good reason to switch from the EM5 mk2 to the EM1?

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If you are shooting macro with any TTL the strobe mimmicks the out put of the camera flash and that can take up to 3 seconds to recharge meaning missing shots. Set the camera flash to manual and 1/64 power and use the manual power setting on your strobes which even at a full power discharge, will charge in less than a second. I rarely use more than half power on my strobes when shooting macro which means getting more shots.

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Hi All,

 

I've just found out according to the "YS-D2 Slave function compatibility chart" that the EM5 mk2 does not support "DS-TTLⅡ" but does support "SlaveTTL", is this a big problem?

 

It seems the EM1 supports both, is this a good reason to switch from the EM5 mk2 to the EM1?

It's only a problem if you want EV compensation in TTL mode.

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It's only a problem if you want EV compensation in TTL mode.

 

Do you mean EV compensation in the camera or the the EV compensation dial on the strobe?

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Can anyone explain the technical reason why DTTL-II (digital TTL) mode does not work on the EM5 MK2, but does work on the EM1 and EM5, and why they all work in STTL (slave TTL) mode?

 

Is it something to do with the new FL-LM3, and if so how does this new flash differ from the one used with the other cameras, or is it in the camera itself?

 

I suppose what I'm asking is what is the technical difference, (pre-flash, metering method, sync time etc.) between DTTL-II and STTL as implemented by Olympus, and what are the main advantages of DTTL-II over STTL?

 

I've looked everywhere on the web for an explanation but have yet to find one.

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I know nothing about Olympus cameras...

 

DS-TTL II and STTL (Slave TTL) are Sea and Sea marketing terms for 2 closely related features of the YS D2 strobe.Nothing to do with Olympus.

 

In STTL the YS D2 acts as a simple slave strobe. I claim the YS D2 turns on and off with the onboard camera flash. Nothing special here. Twisting knobs on the YS D2 does nothing. The YS D2 simply mimics (to the best of its ability) all of the on/off transitions of the onboard flash.

 

In DS-TTL II mode the light level control on the YS D2 should allow EV compensation. In theory twisting the knob on the YS D2 should allow you to get more or less light from the strobe than the camera wants. Under exposed TTL? Then turn the strobe up a few notches. Over exposed? Then turn the strobe down a few notches.

 

My observations above are based upon the premise that the Sea and Sea strobes do not natively support any camera specific optical protocol other than ON OFF. I could be wrong.But since wired Sea and Sea TTL converters sell for over $500 I can not see them incorporating / giving away sophisticated optical control for free.

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I know nothing about Olympus cameras...

 

DS-TTL II and STTL (Slave TTL) are Sea and Sea marketing terms for 2 closely related features of the YS D2 strobe.Nothing to do with Olympus.

 

In STTL the YS D2 acts as a simple slave strobe. I claim the YS D2 turns on and off with the onboard camera flash. Nothing special here. Twisting knobs on the YS D2 does nothing. The YS D2 simply mimics (to the best of its ability) all of the on/off transitions of the onboard flash.

 

In DS-TTL II mode the light level control on the YS D2 should allow EV compensation. In theory twisting the knob on the YS D2 should allow you to get more or less light from the strobe than the camera wants. Under exposed TTL? Then turn the strobe up a few notches. Over exposed? Then turn the strobe down a few notches.

 

My observations above are based upon the premise that the Sea and Sea strobes do not natively support any camera specific optical protocol other than ON OFF. I could be wrong.But since wired Sea and Sea TTL converters sell for over $500 I can not see them incorporating / giving away sophisticated optical control for free.

 

Thanks "giffenk", that's pretty much how I thought it worked. As you say in STTL the strobe only mimics the "start and quench time" of the internal flash, and I think that in DTTL-II mode the camera actually communicates with the internal flash, which in turn passes this information to the strobe via the optical link, to set the power level and duration of the flash and hence the exposure. As DTTL-II can adjust the power level and duration of the flash/strobe it should be a more accurate method of controlling exposure, and in addition you are able to use EV compensation on the strobe to make fine adjustments.

 

I'm just confused why DTTL-II is supported by the Sea & Sea YS-D2 for the EM1 and EM5, but not for the EM5-MK2, I can only assume that Olympus has changed something it's end, either the camera no longer supports this type of internal flash communication or the FL-M3 internal flash does not support it.

 

Either way I'm thinking of switching my order to the EM1.

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I've switched my order from the EM5 MK2 to the EM1, below is the feedback I received from Sea & Sea on this issue.

 

"Anyway, you are correct in regards to the YS-D2 and the Oly EM5Mk2. It only works in the Slave TTL mode, (B mode) not the DS-TTL mode with that camera. It is still TTL, just not the more refined version DS-TTL. EV compensation will not work in Slave TTL mode.
To use the YS-D2 with an EM5-2 in TTL mode you will need to reset the strobe from default (DS-TTL) by holding down the target light button for 3 seconds. You will know that you are in Slave TTL (B mode) when the TTL confirmation lights blue instead of green. I hope that answers your questions."
I'm surprised this is not better explained on the various web sites of underwater camera suppliers!
I still don't know why it doesn't work, so if anyone knows the technical reason I would be interested to hear it?
Edited by kstokell

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Nothing more frustrating than using TTL flash, waiting up to 3 seconds for the internal camera flash to charge. It will also drain your camera battery quicker as the main disadvantage I found from switching from Canon DSLR (over 3 dives on one charge) to Olympus EM1 (2 to 2.5 dives) is the poor battery life and that is with the camera flash on 1/64 the power and YS-D1 strobes on manual. I missed a lot of good photo opportunities on several Bali trips where the battery has given up early in the third dive. You can open the housing, change to battery, clean all the seals, refit the camera and pump up the vacuum but not ideal on a boat or beach miles away from the hotel. Using manual flash on low power the strobes are ready to fire again by the time you refocus. Haven't used TTL for about 3.5 years now and it tends to over expose on the Canon rig. I don't trust auto for the exposure or the flash settings. I like to tell the camera how I want the image.

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Nothing more frustrating than using TTL flash, waiting up to 3 seconds for the internal camera flash to charge. It will also drain your camera battery quicker as the main disadvantage I found from switching from Canon DSLR (over 3 dives on one charge) to Olympus EM1 (2 to 2.5 dives) is the poor battery life and that is with the camera flash on 1/64 the power and YS-D1 strobes on manual. I missed a lot of good photo opportunities on several Bali trips where the battery has given up early in the third dive. You can open the housing, change to battery, clean all the seals, refit the camera and pump up the vacuum but not ideal on a boat or beach miles away from the hotel. Using manual flash on low power the strobes are ready to fire again by the time you refocus. Haven't used TTL for about 3.5 years now and it tends to over expose on the Canon rig. I don't trust auto for the exposure or the flash settings. I like to tell the camera how I want the image.

 

Hi Griff, I agree with a lot of what you say, and I always shoot with the camera in full manual mode (shutter, aperture, ISO etc.). However for close-up macro work I have found that DSTTL works rather well and definitely gives you one less thing to think about when composing the shot. As you can use the EV-compensation on the strobes in DSTTL, you have a very accurate control over the overall exposure, and as far as I understand the DSTTL protocol, as well as controlling the strobe duration (start and quench time) it also controls the strobe intensity. So in macro mode with the strobes close to the subject, I'm pretty sure the internal flash does not do a complete dump, therefor the recycle time should not be too long and consequently the battery drainage not too high. Standard STTL is of course a much cruder TTL implementation, which may as you say cause some of the issues you quote. Anyway at the end of the day if I think the situation requires it manual operation is always available, and may be the better alternative particularly when not shooting macro.

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