Underwater Monitor for Panasonic GH5

[bubffm 178]

The problem is that Nauticam uses a micro HDMI plug to connect to the bulkhead, which is a flimsy connection by definition... DiveandSee uses a mini HDMI, being quite a bit more solid in my view.

[Pajjpen 63]

So what's the conclusion? The dive and see 5 inch or the small HD 5 inch? Is the colors really not reliable as I read with the dive and see?

And how much problems does the small HD mini hdmi cable give u underwater?

I actually like the features of the small HD more but having usable cables is priority nr1

 

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[adamtaylor 28]

So what's the conclusion? The dive and see 5 inch or the small HD 5 inch? Is the colors really not reliable as I read with the dive and see?

And how much problems does the small HD mini hdmi cable give u underwater?

I actually like the features of the small HD more but having usable cables is priority nr1

 

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As I will occasionally use the monitor topside I have opted for SmallHD 502 (so I can send up a surface feed in the future).

 

Ordered the housing and just waiting to see if there are any Black Friday / Cyber Monday deals for the monitor.

 

Will comment after I have tried it out.

 

Regards

 

 

Adam

 

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[Pyroracer 6]

 

 

 

 

Regards - Richard

How are you liking those Keldan lights? Do you use ambient and spectrum filters?

 

Thanks for all these input and sample pics. As i'm considering getting a monitor too and this thread has helped me weigh towards the Small Hd 502

[thetrickster 328]

How are you liking those Keldan lights? Do you use ambient and spectrum filters?

 

I do like my Keldan's (They are the CRI variant), a love soft beam of light, although I'm waiting to upgrade the bulbs to 10,000lm once Keldan release newer ones (they are currently 8,000lm on the market and mine are 5,000lm) That is the amazing thing about the Luna 8 / M8 series - you can upgrade etc

 

I've got the cyan leds also (so act the same as the filters you mention) for shallow water stuff, but find they aren't powerful enough (even thou they are more powerful than normal lights with filters fitted) I prefer at the moment, to dive when it isn't so sunny and outshine the sunlight with lights, and just stick with powerful lights and a preset white balance.

 

I've tried a range of 'red' filters with my GH4 and I always found it a fudge, as once you fit it, you are locked in to ambient filming.

 

Keldan are currently demoing a external filter to fit the Nauticam WWL-1, which you sandwich between the wet lens and the flat port - that could be a good compromise.

[Lionfi2s 74]

Keldan are currently demoing a external filter to fit the Nauticam WWL-1, which you sandwich between the wet lens and the flat port - that could be a good compromise.

I have tried the same on my RX100 setup. I just cut gel filters (one for blue water one for green) and fit them between the WWL1 lens and the port. Not the easiest solution but it works and the filters are so cheap that you dont care if you loose it when you remove them. I carry couple of them in my wetnotes and just replace it if needed.

Any links for the Keldan ones?

[dreifish 364]

 

I do like my Keldan's (They are the CRI variant), a love soft beam of light, although I'm waiting to upgrade the bulbs to 10,000lm once Keldan release newer ones (they are currently 8,000lm on the market and mine are 5,000lm) That is the amazing thing about the Luna 8 / M8 series - you can upgrade etc

 

I've got the cyan leds also (so act the same as the filters you mention) for shallow water stuff, but find they aren't powerful enough (even thou they are more powerful than normal lights with filters fitted) I prefer at the moment, to dive when it isn't so sunny and outshine the sunlight with lights, and just stick with powerful lights and a preset white balance.

 

I've tried a range of 'red' filters with my GH4 and I always found it a fudge, as once you fit it, you are locked in to ambient filming.

 

Keldan are currently demoing a external filter to fit the Nauticam WWL-1, which you sandwich between the wet lens and the flat port - that could be a good compromise.

This basically mirrors my own experience. Cyan lights, or cyan filters on lights, just don't have sufficient light output to make a difference. And honestly, I haven't seen any footage below 10-15 meters that's been white balanced to the ambient light that looks all that great -- you just lose too much saturation and color contrast/vibrance. Better to do what the still photographers do and light up the foreground with warm artificial light while keeping the water column it's natural blue or green color rather than grey.

 

(I actually would love to be corrected though -- anyone have samples of ambient light video below 10-15m that looks great?)

[Pyroracer 6]

 

I do like my Keldan's (They are the CRI variant), a love soft beam of light, although I'm waiting to upgrade the bulbs to 10,000lm once Keldan release newer ones (they are currently 8,000lm on the market and mine are 5,000lm) That is the amazing thing about the Luna 8 / M8 series - you can upgrade etc

 

I've got the cyan leds also (so act the same as the filters you mention) for shallow water stuff, but find they aren't powerful enough (even thou they are more powerful than normal lights with filters fitted) I prefer at the moment, to dive when it isn't so sunny and outshine the sunlight with lights, and just stick with powerful lights and a preset white balance.

 

I've tried a range of 'red' filters with my GH4 and I always found it a fudge, as once you fit it, you are locked in to ambient filming.

 

Keldan are currently demoing a external filter to fit the Nauticam WWL-1, which you sandwich between the wet lens and the flat port - that could be a good compromise.

Thanks for the feedback. I now plan on getting the new 2018 Keldan 8x. I'll try them with the filters in my Palau trip this Jan if I can get them on time and see how they go.

[bubffm 178]

Thanks for the feedback. I now plan on getting the new 2018 Keldan 8x. I'll try them with the filters in my Palau trip this Jan if I can get them on time and see how they go.

 

 

I have two Keldan Cyan filters laying around in my "unused toys" box which I am thinking of selling. Let me know if you're interested.

[Pyroracer 6]

 

 

I have two Keldan Cyan filters laying around in my "unused toys" box which I am thinking of selling. Let me know if you're interested.

Thanks Bub, I was planning on getting the new 2018 filters which are supposedly less scratch prone. Did you find any good use for them or try them with the red spectrum filters from Keldan?

[bubffm 178]

Thanks Bub, I was planning on getting the new 2018 filters which are supposedly less scratch prone. Did you find any good use for them or try them with the red spectrum filters from Keldan?

See my post from July here:

http://wetpixel.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=58939&p=386266

 

I did not find them all that useful. They absorb way too much light.

[adamtaylor 28]

As I will occasionally use the monitor topside I have opted for SmallHD 502 (so I can send up a surface feed in the future).

 

Ordered the housing and just waiting to see if there are any Black Friday / Cyber Monday deals for the monitor.

 

Will comment after I have tried it out.

 

Regards

 

 

Adam

 

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Finally getting my new addition in the water once the Marina closes tonight.

 

 

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[Pyroracer 6]

Finally getting my new addition in the water once the Marina closes tonight.

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Nice! Just ordered my 501 as well. Did you find any deals? Any plans to flip it upside down? That feels like it would smack me in the face being that high hehe. What applications do you have in mind for a surface feed?

[adamtaylor 28]

Nice! Just ordered my 501 as well. Did you find any deals? Any plans to flip it upside down? That feels like it would smack me in the face being that high hehe. What applications do you have in mind for a surface feed?

The extra long Nauticam clamp did make it sit fairly high, but I could flip it down, and also flat so I could look straight down while shooting macro.

 

Will have to figure out how to turn off the auto rotate on the screen as certain angles flipped the image on me...

 

Battery died about 70 minutes into the dive. It was relatively cold water at +/- 42F and I had played with it out of housing and let sit for a few days. I did expect better battery life with 2 connected, but as I didnt start with full charges will reserve judgement.

 

Ended up being a night dive which isn't ideal for learning new camera stuff, but saw some cool critters. Had to be selective in what I focused on as the moment we descended there was a seal using our lights to hunt fish.

 

Have not purchased the surface feed kit yet, but will in future which is why I chose the 502 over the 501 model. Will use at for live-feed at conservation / education events where we have interpreters on shore with some hardy diver-collected species, and likely some salmon stuff in streams and rivers.

 

Would love to do live-feed from a glass sponge reef, but given the depths it may not be feasible.

 

But speaking of sponge reefs I look forward to swimming the edge of reef with camera held below pointing diagonally back over the reef. Should be easier to frame the shot with a monitor pointing up

 

As I am in Canada there were not many options for purchase. I watched prices and purchased online from B&H on Cyber Monday. Got the kit for the same price as monitor alone from a Canadian site...

 

Regards

 

 

Adam

 

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[Pajjpen 63]

Nice! Just ordered my 501 as well. Did you find any deals? Any plans to flip it upside down? That feels like it would smack me in the face being that high hehe. What applications do you have in mind for a surface feed?

Curious why u would flip it upside down..

[adamtaylor 28]

Curious why u would flip it upside down..

I have tried a few different orientations.

 

For macro, flipping the monitor down towards you leaves your sightline to the lens open which helps in finding smaller subjects.

 

It also helps the balance of the rig as I found when pulling light arms far forward with stix floatation added it unbalances the tripod somewhat.

 

For certain wide-angle shots it is nice to look down on the monitor. For example if you want to shoot up at the surface you don't have to get under your camera to frame the shot.

 

Same with swimming through / above a reef. You can hold camera below you to get a better angle, without worrying about disturbing the bottom or sensitive life.

 

Regards,

 

 

Adam

 

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[Pajjpen 63]

Oh that I understand. I genuinely thought ud switch the position of the ball mount and literally turn the monitor upside down haha

 

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[adamtaylor 28]

Oh that I understand. I genuinely thought ud switch the position of the ball mount and literally turn the monitor upside down haha

 

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Ha, not even worth considering.

 

One thing I discovered and am very happy about is the monitor senses when it is inverted and flips both the image AND the button functions. Sometimes you need to jiggle or move it so it is right side up, but the button function change is great as you don't have to remember which button to press when zooming or changing settings.

 

Overall I am very happy with the new set up

 

Regards,

 

 

Adam

 

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[dreifish 364]

With the Atomos housing, is there any way to position the monitor so it's above the camera housing at a 45 degree angle (e.g. standard position for monitoring from above) instead of tucked in behind the housing and pointing backwards like the built in camera screen? Or how about just having the monitor pointing straight upwards so you can look down at it if shooting macro straight on the sea bed?

[thetrickster 328]

With the Atomos housing, is there any way to position the monitor so it's above the camera housing at a 45 degree angle (e.g. standard position for monitoring from above) instead of tucked in behind the housing and pointing backwards like the built in camera screen? Or how about just having the monitor pointing straight upwards so you can look down at it if shooting macro straight on the sea bed?

Like this: ?

 

 

Using the NA-GH5, and the straight shogun bracket from the NA-GH4 (not the angled one from the NA-A7) I’ve put it on the wrong way around so the attachment point for the Atomos is further forward, it’s then angled due to the newer style Nauticam handles being angled forward. This allows the Atomos housing to have a more natural viewing angle.

 

Only issue I have is with reflections on the screen (not the internal Atomos one). Currently seeing where to get 7” matte anti-reflective screen stickers from that are waterproof

 

 

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[dreifish 364]

Yeah, like that. Looks like a pretty good angle ergonomically, though it is a bulky piece of kit indeed.

 

Do you mean the reflections off the window of the nauticam Shogun housing? That's what's causing problems?

 

So at the end of the day, have you done any sort of testing comparing the highest quality recording you can get from the Shogun (is that 4k60p in Prores 422 HQ?) vs the 400mbs internal 10bit4:2:2 recording? Any noticable differences in terms of macroblocking, etc?

 

Seem like the setup runs just under $5k with the housing and the monitor, vs $2500 for the DiveandSea 5A monitor or about $3000 for the SmallHD 502 bright + nauticam housing (Is this even possible with the original nauticam SmallHD 502 housing? Backscatter seems to be listing a seperate Nauticam housing from the SmallHD 502 bright, but not available yet). Trying to justify the extra price. I mean, the Shogun is definitely the brightest and largest of the bunch, so as a monitor, I'm sure it's awesome. But it's also the bulkiest..

 

Is it negatively bouyant in the housing?

[gearbow_36218 9]

Yeah, like that. Looks like a pretty good angle ergonomically, though it is a bulky piece of kit indeed.

 

Do you mean the reflections off the window of the nauticam Shogun housing? That's what's causing problems?

 

So at the end of the day, have you done any sort of testing comparing the highest quality recording you can get from the Shogun (is that 4k60p in Prores 422 HQ?) vs the 400mbs internal 10bit4:2:2 recording? Any noticable differences in terms of macroblocking, etc?

 

Seem like the setup runs just under $5k with the housing and the monitor, vs $2500 for the DiveandSea 5A monitor or about $3000 for the SmallHD 502 bright + nauticam housing (Is this even possible with the original nauticam SmallHD 502 housing? Backscatter seems to be listing a seperate Nauticam housing from the SmallHD 502 bright, but not available yet). Trying to justify the extra price. I mean, the Shogun is definitely the brightest and largest of the bunch, so as a monitor, I'm sure it's awesome. But it's also the bulkiest..

 

Is it negatively bouyant in the housing?

I got a quote the other day of 2900 for 502 monitor with Nauticam set up with cables. How much you say the inferno kit is?

 

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[thetrickster 328]

Yeah, like that. Looks like a pretty good angle ergonomically, though it is a bulky piece of kit indeed.

 

Yeah. Its not small (due to float arms) and finding a bag that it fits on the boat hasnt been successful..

 

Do you mean the reflections off the window of the nauticam Shogun housing? That's what's causing problems?

 

Yeah the window. The angle of the screen seems to give me really strong reflections of myself. Im sure some matte protector will fix it

 

So at the end of the day, have you done any sort of testing comparing the highest quality recording you can get from the Shogun (is that 4k60p in Prores 422 HQ?) vs the 400mbs internal 10bit4:2:2 recording? Any noticable differences in terms of macroblocking, etc?

 

No. I havent. As I havent purchased any V60 or V90 SD cards that work at 400Mbps. Dont see the point as I do it straight to the SSD.

 

But the Inferno at 4K@60p is 1660Mbps vs the 400Mbps internally and 10Bit too. Which I do find a big difference (you would get that benefit with the internal 10Bit vs 8bit also)

 

Trying to justify the extra price. I mean, the Shogun is definitely the brightest and largest of the bunch, so as a monitor, I'm sure it's awesome. But it's also the bulkiest..

 

If I didnt have it from my GH4 setup, I personally think recording internally to a V90 card and running a cheaper / smaller monitor would be easier. But I got it so Ill use it and I dont regret, as it is a joy to use underwater :-)

 

Is it negatively bouyant in the housing?

I dont know the weight of the shogun part. But for reference:

 

1x NA-GH5

1x NA-Flame

1x Macro35 Port

1x WWL-1 (including its buoyancy collar)

 

Requires 2x 70x220mm Float arms and that isnt even enough to make it neutral.

Edited March 28, 2018 by thetrickster

[dreifish 364]

Yeah. Its not small (due to float arms) and finding a bag that it fits on the boat hasnt been successful..

 

 

Yeah the window. The angle of the screen seems to give me really strong reflections of myself. Im sure some matte protector will fix it

 

 

No. I havent. As I havent purchased any V60 or V90 SD cards that work at 400Mbps. Dont see the point as I do it straight to the SSD.

 

But the Inferno at 4K@60p is 1660Mbps vs the 400Mbps internally and 10Bit too. Which I do find a big difference (you would get that benefit with the internal 10Bit vs 8bit also)

 

 

If I didnt have it from my GH4 setup, I personally think recording internally to a V90 card and running a cheaper / smaller monitor would be easier. But I got it so Ill use it and I dont regret, as it is a joy to use underwater :-)

 

 

I dont know the weight of the shogun part. But for reference:

 

1x NA-GH5

1x NA-Flame

1x Macro35 Port

1x WWL-1 (including its buoyancy collar)

 

Requires 2x 70x220mm Float arms and that isnt even enough to make it neutral.

 

You should be able to film 10 seconds or so at 400mb/s on fast UHS-1 like the Extreme Pro cards if you have one of those. Give it a try -- should be enough for comparison purposes

 

The size of the files is indeed a big difference, though in all fairness the internal codec maxes out at 400mb/s at 30fps -- which should be 880mb/s in Prores HQ, so only about 2.2x the size. The prores will definitely be easier to edit -- I usually end up having to transcode the 400mb/s all-i from the GH5 to edit smoothly in FCPX. But if there's no real quality gain, then I'd much rather stick to the smaller internal files and use proxies for editing where necessary.

 

Boyancy wise, I have a similar setup -

 

1x NA-GH5

1x NA-Flame

1x Macro 29 Port

1x WWL-1 (including its buoyancy collar)

1x 70x220mm float arm

 

This is slightly negative still, though probably only a few hundred grams. Sounds like the Atomos housing, if negative, isn't massively so.

 

What kind of battery life are you getting out of the Atomos?

[WillFalcon 2]

But the Inferno at 4K@60p is 1660Mbps vs the 400Mbps internally and 10Bit too. Which I do find a big difference (you would get that benefit with the internal 10Bit vs 8bit also)

Is there a solution that support 4K60 10-bit?

Nauticam housing (SKU # 17909) for my Atomos Ninja Inferno DOES NOT support 4K60 10-bit, 4K60 8-bit and 4K30-10bit ONLY!!!

Not 4K-60-10bit.

 

I did ask Nauticam management before I was planning to buy and they confirm that.

It is because of HDMI cable, their version supports HDMI 1.4, but for 4K-60-10bit it requires 2.0 at least

 

 

So, looking forward and still trying to find a solution.

Edited February 28, 2019 by WillFalcon