Sony's Three-CCD HDV 1080i Camcorder

[dudeunderwater 0]

Looks like the new hdv camera is going to hit the market just in time for christmas.

 

 

http://www.emedialive.com/Newsletters/EMed...sletterID=192#1

 

 

Todd Richard

www.synenrgy-productions.com

[echeng 0]

I'm sure it's going to be amazing! I can't wait to see it in action. Craig? Maybe it's time to get back into video.

[sjspeck 3]

http://www.dvformat.com/articles/viewartic...le.jsp?id=27872

[Drew 0]

Just a few specs for those interested. I handled the camera in NYC yesterday. The camera has a 3 lux minimum, like the DVX100 but not close to the 1 lux of the PD170. Only does 1080i, no progressive scan mode. From what I was told, the proprietry Sony HDV codec is not supported by FCP at the moment. WIll be a pro version coming out next year. Looking at the unit, it's fatter than the PD and anyone thinking of it retrofitting the VX/PD housings can forget it. The LCD placement is impossible for even the cavernous Sea&Sea and L&M housings, but I didn't get the dimension specs so I can't be sure.

It's a nice handling camera and looks like they will do the FX1 and the Pro version like the VX and PD series.

[craig 0]

Sure is an odd shape to house. Perhaps the monitor can be viewed directly through the top of the housing as it should properly be.

 

The codec required for this camera is not proprietary but rather conforms to the HDV standard. Editing packages have been slow to integrate support for HDV especially FCP. Both Premiere and Vegas can do it (at least the 720p form) but output is another matter. FCP requires a thrid party addon that provides offline editing.

 

Curious that Sony would suggest that HDV justifies a new tape at the hansome price of $18!

[richorn 0]

Curious that Sony would suggest that HDV justifies a new tape at the hansome price of $18!

 

Can I assume you are being sarcastic? The only thing that would surprise me about Sony would be if it DIDN'T require a different tape stock.

 

The purchase of the D5 was the happiest day of my career. A NON Sony tape machine!

[mtiffee 0]

Curious that Sony would suggest that HDV justifies a new tape at the hansome price of $18!

 

Can I assume you are being sarcastic? The only thing that would surprise me about Sony would be if it DIDN'T require a different tape stock.

 

The Sony DOESN'T require a diffferent tape stock.. it's offering a higher quality tape stock that offers fewer dropouts.. It will play and record on standard miniDV tapes currently available.

 

Premiere supports the 1080i format of HDV. Not sure about vegas.

 

FCP will support HDV in the next release:

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=654

 

This is going to be one sweet camera.. can't wait to see some test footage.. I wonder what the "PRO" version will offer. I can't see paying an extra $3000 for XLR inputs.. Maybe 1/2" CCDs??

[craig 0]

Of course it will record on standard DV tapes! That's what HDV does. What's ridiculous is that Sony would suggest that HDV would need or benefit from an exotic DV tape and such an astonomical price. Sony's done it before, though, and that was my point.

 

I've had equally good/bad experiences with Premiere and Vegas regarding 720p editing so I think the issues with 1080i are similar for both. Premiere comes with no HD presets.

 

I shot the Gates/JVC last week and was quite disappointed with the ergonomics of the controls. Very frustrating.

[pmooney 6]

 I shot the Gates/JVC last week and was quite disappointed with the ergonomics of the controls.    Very frustrating.

 

 

 

 

 

Could you expand on that. What was not to you liking ??

[craig 0]

The on/off control is extremely difficult to use, yet you have to use it every time the camera goes into standby (since it doesn't respond to any of the other controls).

 

The menu control is easily bumped and very difficult / time consuming to clear once you've activated it. Operating any of the menu functions is nearly impossible underwater.

 

The viewfinder doesn't naturally line up with the magnifier so you need to be careful installing the camera or you will not have a finder at all. The JVC changes its diopter setting when you move the finder in and out. Another infuriating detail. The external monitor is a must (but it is NTSC 4:3).

 

There are controls for aperture and shutter priority which are of questionable use, yet there is no support for exposure lock of exposure compensation. The camera offers no true manual exposure capability so there's no way to tone down overexposure.

 

There is no true wide angle solution that works with the housing. The widest lens is not recommended for the JVC and the next step down is less than 80 degrees. Not especially a problem for me on the trip I was on but disappointing.

 

The JVC offers a zoom range which is too long and doesn't provide sufficient close focus. Macro shooting will be more difficult that it should be though I did not do any on my last trip. My experience with pool sessions was to use the dome port rather than the flat port, then use a combination of a fixed diopter and a flip diopter to get the close focus I needed. A wide angle wet lens may make a better macro solution. The combination of poor close focus, a 400mm telephoto zoom, and the Gates flat port is not what you want!

 

On the plus side, the JVC autoexposure is quite good and the performance (within its comfort zone) is beyond any DV camera. The Gates housing is beautifully made and has a wonderfully flexible flip filter arrangement.

 

The Sony camera looks interesting and I'd expect electronic controls to be easily doable. I'd also expect that Sony doesn't make the same boneheaded mistakes that JVC made regarding lack of manual exposure, inflexible lens, terrible ergonomics and bad power management decisions. The top-mounted monitor looks like a housing challenge (or perhaps and opportunity). The lens filter thread is 72mm so I'm concerned about compatibility with existing optics.

[mtiffee 0]

Curious that Sony would suggest that HDV justifies a new tape at the hansome price of $18!

 

Early reports of some drop outs from users in Japan. nothing heard from users in US yet. MPEG2 dropouts look like a frozen screen for 1/2 second.. (GOP = 15 frames). I assume SONY saw this coming so they're offering this higher quality tape with fewer chance of dropouts. 12.99 per tape at B&H order 10 or more.

 

I ordered this camera and should have it in my hands tomorrow.

[curtisleo 0]

Check out Pinnacle Systems Liquid Edition 6. It supports HDV, 1080i, 720p, native HD editing.

 

http://www.pinnaclesys.com/ProductPage_n.a...480&Langue_ID=7

 

I've been using it for the past 6 months and it's great. Even on low powered laptops. Creating DVDs are very easy.

 

Curtis

[mtiffee 0]

I've been playing with this camera for over a week now.. AMAZING!! the footage is awesome.. can't wait to get it wet.

[pmooney 6]

Got my camera yesterday.

java script:emoticon(':lol:')java script:emoticon(':lol:')

Housing is is half built - waiting on optics and the machine shop.

 

Can't wait to get this in the water.

[mtiffee 0]

Please send pics!! I need a housing!! I also got the .8 wide angle adaptor which should arrive tomorrow.

[Drew 0]

I just got my FX1 and have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, the resolution and color is amazing. Not exactly HDCAM but at 1/500th of the price, I'll take it. I did notice a little pixelling on faster pans in the cinema mode. There goes the progressive scan mode. Ah well I guess a second render with magic bullet will bring me right back to DV when computers were 600mhz-1ghz.

Housingwise, still waiting on amphibico and S&S. On the waiting list but not holding my breath. The camera is heavier than the old PD170. I may just return it and wait for the ZX1 which suits me more anyways.

[mtiffee 0]

Finally a housing for the FX-1.

 

http://www.seacamsys.com/HDV1.htm

[Drew 0]

The optics of the new camera (72mm) means old legacy lenses from the old housings will not work without compromises to the pic. There goes that 110° WAL.

I'm not sure I'd put a $5k camera (the Z1U which I'm patiently waiting for release having sold my FX1E) in a housing with a plexiglass back monitor (even if it is 6.5"). It would suffer from reflections and the viewing position would be awkward. Looks like a painted USVH housing. With polyurethane and the bulky design, I think the buoyancy of that housing to be VERY positive. I'll wait for an aluminum housing which is hopefully more compact with electronic controls instead of all that bulky 2 handle controls. The optics will be limited to screw on lenses and would suffer a bit of quality since the dome port design would limit the angle achievable by the WA adapters. Purpose built WAL are better quality wise. But kudos to the guys to be first on the market. I half expected Ikelite to be first.

I already bought the achromatic diopters from Century Optics. The quality of image of the +3.5 is pretty close to the +4 but once you stack them the image is pretty unusable unless fully zoomed thru. Then you suffer from bad DOF. sigh!

[mtiffee 0]

I'm not sure if you've ever seen an FX-1 in person, but nothing about the camera is compact. The LCD screen requires the top of the housing to be as wide as it is- as it's almost as wide as the camera body itself. I'm not sure you're going to get much more compact unless you use a 2 piece clamshell design.

[CamDiver 5]

The Pro version of this camera the HVR-Z1(E) will be shipped to European stockists toward the end of Feb. I'm waiting to purchase that model. Housing wise I am in touch with Sealux - www.sealux.de - who have mentioned that their housing will, should, be available roughly at the same time as the pro camera versions release. I've been using Sealux housings for 7 years. They are compact, offer a 50/50 mix on electronic and manual controls and are, in my book, as rugged as a housing needs to be. They (Sealux) are also open to discussions regarding custom development of peripherals. I'm looking to house a 7" 16:9 monitor with their expertise. I haven't had the luxury of seeing one of these new cameras in the flesh yet but by all reports they seem to be well received. A few toothing problems but C'est la vie. Here's to adopting this format as the way forward.

 

Cheers,

Mark.

[Nick Hope 151]

Got this from Gates on 4th January:

 

"Pricing is not yet set, however, I anticipate a ~$4000.00 retail price

NOT INCLUDING PORTS. Port choices will include a Fathom wide angle and

a Fathom Super Wide Angle. These ports are also in the design phase and

are being designed specifically for that camera. What we know at this

point is that the current Fathom ports will not work in front of the

FX1.

 

The professional version of the FX1 comes out in February. It is called

the Z1. Not having this camera in our hands means that we cannot be

100% certain that it will fit in the same housing, but we are making

every effort to make sure that is the case.

 

We plan to be able to ship at the end of March. I will be taking

deposits after the first of the year. If you want this housing, I urge

you to place a deposit; I have never received more inquiries on a

housing than I have on this one and I have a full page of firm orders

already."

From the spec sheet it basically sounds like a VX2100 housing built to fit the new cams.

 

Nick

[Drew 0]

The Pro version of this camera the HVR-Z1(E) will be shipped to European stockists toward the end of Feb..... I'm looking to house a 7" 16:9 monitor with their expertise. I haven't had the luxury of seeing one of these new cameras in the flesh yet but by all reports they seem to be well received. A few toothing problems but C'est la vie. Here's to adopting this format as the way forward.

The Sony HVR-Z1U is dual format so the end letter is no longer E or non-E but U.

7"?? That's a big monitor but I suppose necessary for focus. That was the one thing I really detested about the FX1... the viewfinder was terrible for fine tuning manual focus unless the 4x enlargement is used. But that's another button to press.

The VX2100 is 2/8" shorter. It's also a little narrower (didn't measure it without the lens hood. The box design of Gates and Sea Lux (assuming they built in some extra space) should fit the Z1/FX. On the other hand, the Fathom 110WAL was designed for a 58mm lens. The 72mm FX1 didn't work too well when I did a rough test with my WAL110. It was hand held and was probably off center. I had a little vignetting in HD mode. It also wasn't that sharp. But that was a very unscientific test. I'll email Paul Remijian and see what he says.

[Drew 0]

Spoke with the designer of Fathom Images and their WAL110 for the PD170/VX2100 will not fit the FX1/Z1. Ah well another housing! I wish they'd make it like the Canon 1 D series and keep the body. Be helluva lot cheaper!