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GH5 can't set custom white balance warmer than 10000k?

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I tried setting a custom white balance on my GH5 today off the sandy bottom around 20 meters depth (60'). Camera appeared to do a CWB just fine, no error messages like you sometimes get with a Sony. I took a test shot and later opened it up in Lightroom. To my surprise, the CWB that the camera had set was 9200k/+149 tint.

 

This was obviously nowhere near warm enough given the conditions and the depth, so the results were pretty blue/green.

 

This got me thinking -- can the GH5 actually do a CWB warmer than 10000k, or is that a limit? When setting the white balance manually, you can't go warmer than 10000k, but I had assumed a CWB bypassed that limit. Has anyone successfully gotten a custom white balance warmer than that? If not, this has obvious implications for video, where you can't just shoot raw and set the white balance warmer after the fact in light room. It might also explain why I've never been able to get satisfactory ambient-light only results using custom white balance at depths greater than 10 meters.

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I don't have a GH5 but I've always wondered about this with my LX10. I set custom WB and it's always been more green/blue than I would have expected. I haven't been bothered by it because I can still pull pretty much all the colour back with footage shot down to about 60ft. What tool are you using to check the actual temperature?

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I don't have a GH5 but I've always wondered about this with my LX10. I set custom WB and it's always been more green/blue than I would have expected. I haven't been bothered by it because I can still pull pretty much all the colour back with footage shot down to about 60ft. What tool are you using to check the actual temperature?

 

Just looking at the "as shot" white balance in Lightroom/Adobe Camera Raw.

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I tried setting a custom white balance on my GH5 today off the sandy bottom around 20 meters depth (60'). Camera appeared to do a CWB just fine, no error messages like you sometimes get with a Sony. I took a test shot and later opened it up in Lightroom. To my surprise, the CWB that the camera had set was 9200k/+149 tint.

 

This was obviously nowhere near warm enough given the conditions and the depth, so the results were pretty blue/green.

 

This got me thinking -- can the GH5 actually do a CWB warmer than 10000k, or is that a limit? When setting the white balance manually, you can't go warmer than 10000k, but I had assumed a CWB bypassed that limit. Has anyone successfully gotten a custom white balance warmer than that? If not, this has obvious implications for video, where you can't just shoot raw and set the white balance warmer after the fact in light room. It might also explain why I've never been able to get satisfactory ambient-light only results using custom white balance at depths greater than 10 meters.

 

It is not a GH5 limitation no camera goes beyond 10000K only processing a RAW you see values higher than this.

 

The only way to balance higher temperatures is to introduce a shift, this typical is done with a filter

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Results would have me believe Canons do set internal MWB higher than 10000k, but I'd love it if someone could confirm that with a test.

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I checked my Olympus Em-1 MkII and it allows setting up to 14000K WB manually. It's seems odd as all the reviews claim the GH5 can set an accurate custom white balance underwater.

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Canon Panasonic and Sony set to 10000K max

The output though are very different Canon is best Panasonic has magenta or green cast and Sony simply fails...

 

I was not aware Olympus allowed 14000K

 

To balance higher temperature on panasonic, canon you need a filter...

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Interceptor, I'm not speaking of the custom white balance you can dial in in the camera in kelvins -- what happens if you do a manual white balance underwater off a grey card? I was under the belief that method would allow you to end up with a white balance warmer than the 10000k you can dial in.

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Interceptor, I'm not speaking of the custom white balance you can dial in in the camera in kelvins -- what happens if you do a manual white balance underwater off a grey card? I was under the belief that method would allow you to end up with a white balance warmer than the 10000k you can dial in.

 

The custom white balance operates in the same range of the specs. Only processing a RAW file in the GH5 can result in temperature higher than 10000K

Generally 10000K is the limit for blue sky but you do see on raw files values flying to 13000K for example in some cases now in those cases you need to shift down at least 3-4K to be able to white balance without errors hence red filters. When the camera reaches the max temperature usually pumps up the tint and this results in magenta cast

 

I was not aware of Olympus going over 10K I never had an Olympus camera but with my experiences with sony, nikon, panasonic and canon I have never seen a value higher than 10K and canon white balance works pretty well

 

Once you hit the temperatures that lightroom would consider 10K+ even if you balance there are no other colours left to enhance from what I recall but need to look at my shots to see what they are like exactly

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The custom white balance operates in the same range of the specs. Only processing a RAW file in the GH5 can result in temperature higher than 10000K

Generally 10000K is the limit for blue sky but you do see on raw files values flying to 13000K for example in some cases now in those cases you need to shift down at least 3-4K to be able to white balance without errors hence red filters. When the camera reaches the max temperature usually pumps up the tint and this results in magenta cast

 

I was not aware of Olympus going over 10K I never had an Olympus camera but with my experiences with sony, nikon, panasonic and canon I have never seen a value higher than 10K and canon white balance works pretty well

 

Once you hit the temperatures that lightroom would consider 10K+ even if you balance there are no other colours left to enhance from what I recall but need to look at my shots to see what they are like exactly

 

Very interesting -- pumping up the tint certainly explains why we end up with purple water column issues. I experienced those a lot on the Sony a7rii (with a red filter) and my old GH4, but haven't noticed them as much on the GH5.

 

So if Canons are also limited to 10k/+150 magneta, what accounts for the better results from their white balance underwater? Is it simply that the stylistic choices they include in their color profiles tend to boost the reds at any color temperature when compared to the color 'science' from other manufacturers?

 

I've never been pleased with the results I get with CWB+ a red filter below 10 meters and attributed it to the fact that warm light is simply too attenuated by that point regardless of how much you boost that signal. But other people seem to think on canons you can get nice natural light results down to 20 meters. Having never shot a canon underwater, I've always been a bit in awe of this supposed ability.

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So if Canons are also limited to 10k/+150 magneta, what accounts for the better results from their white balance underwater? Is it simply that the stylistic choices they include in their color profiles tend to boost the reds at any color temperature when compared to the color 'science' from other manufacturers?

 

I've been reading up on this issue (as a tangent on how the Red H2O OLPF works..) it seems that most cameras use the most dominant channel to balance the others (so for Panasonic etc, its using Blue to top up the Red) where as Canon is using a more balanced approach of utilising both Green and Blue. Thats my basic understanding... whatever special sauce Canon use - it works

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Richard is fundamentally correct all the brands have an interpretation of colour usually some of the colours are saturated or shifted

 

The only site that has some good review on hue accuracy is imaging-resource this is measure accuracy of colour after performing a custom white balance

 

The GH5 scores 4.51 a Sony A7R II 5.45 a Canon EOS M5 3.73 (smaller value more accurate). The GH5 is more accurate in the green magenta issue you describe than the GH4

 

So the Sony is worse than average the GH5 a bit better and the Canon eOS M5 very accurate

 

In water Sony cameras fail CWB, Panasonic have some residual cast if you read here https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/panasonic-gh5/panasonic-gh5A5.HTM

 

Looking at the analysis the camera is generally oversaturated in jpeg (all cameras are) 13.1% so you can understand why you get the advice to put saturation to -5 on all picture profile

 

Whatever you do the hue will stay there the only way I have found to correct is to adjust the tint to my liking after CWB this is a combination of CWB and filter or no filter

Edited by Interceptor121

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