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stuartv

Experience with TRT S-Turtle TTL trigger?

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On 1/24/2021 at 7:55 AM, Lewis88 said:

Which wired TTL converter would you use? The UW Technics TTL converter supports wired, but if it doesn't support the D3's via fiber, will it support via wired?

 

 

For electronic triggering, my plan would be to stick with the UWT trigger I have and just change it over from the LEDs to their electronic bulkhead.

However, on further reflection, I have decided to sell the YS-D3s to a buddy and stick with my Z240s and f/o triggering for now.

I do believe that electronic triggering would work for the UWT to trigger the YS-D3s (though that is really just an educated guess, at this point). But, the UWT does not have a profile built in for the YS-D3, so it would (should) work fine for shooting in Manual, but who knows how well it would work for TTL, since it would have to be set to some other model of strobe's profile.

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2 minutes ago, stuartv said:

 

For electronic triggering, my plan would be to stick with the UWT trigger I have and just change it over from the LEDs to their electronic bulkhead.

However, on further reflection, I have decided to sell the YS-D3s to a buddy and stick with my Z240s and f/o triggering for now.

I do believe that electronic triggering would work for the UWT to trigger the YS-D3s (though that is really just an educated guess, at this point). But, the UWT does not have a profile built in for the YS-D3, so it would (should) work fine for shooting in Manual, but who knows how well it would work for TTL, since it would have to be set to some other model of strobe's profile.

Ah darn, I was hoping a verdict for TRT and the YS-03 would be reached.

If you were closer than VA, I was going to see if we could meet to test the S-turtle and YS-D3 setup. The D3's are at the top of my list to replace my YS-110a's.

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8 minutes ago, Lewis88 said:

Ah darn, I was hoping a verdict for TRT and the YS-03 would be reached.

If you were closer than VA, I was going to see if we could meet to test the S-turtle and YS-D3 setup. The D3's are at the top of my list to replace my YS-110a's.

I ordered a Turtle. I was sent the wrong one. I sent it back and they said they are issuing me a refund. They said they don't have the correct one. I assume if they had any hope of getting the correct one any time soon, they would have offered to wait and send me the correct one, but they didn't.

That was Bluewater Photostore. The only source I know for a Turtle is Backscatter, but Backscatter does not offer refunds for any reason and I'm not ordering a Turtle from them only to find out that it doesn't work for me.

If you find a source to buy an S-Turtle TTL for Sony mirrorless that offers refunds, let me know and I'll probably order it. I would definitely not mind being able to keep and use the YS-D3s.

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11 minutes ago, Lewis88 said:

Ah darn, I was hoping a verdict for TRT and the YS-03 would be reached.

If you were closer than VA, I was going to see if we could meet to test the S-turtle and YS-D3 setup. The D3's are at the top of my list to replace my YS-110a's.

ps. If you're looking at paying normal, retail price for the YS-D3s, I would say to seriously consider spending just a little more and getting the Retra Pros (and the UWT trigger). I only bought the YS-D3s because I got them at Key Man pricing. Otherwise, I feel like they are just way too much trouble.

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9 minutes ago, stuartv said:

ps. If you're looking at paying normal, retail price for the YS-D3s, I would say to seriously consider spending just a little more and getting the Retra Pros (and the UWT trigger). I only bought the YS-D3s because I got them at Key Man pricing. Otherwise, I feel like they are just way too much trouble.

From all I have read of late, I totally agree with Stuart; and a big thumbs up for the Retra strobes Pro or Prime.

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15 minutes ago, stuartv said:

If you find a source to buy an S-Turtle TTL for Sony mirrorless that offers refunds, let me know and I'll probably order it. I would definitely not mind being able to keep and use the YS-D3s.

You can buy directly from TRT, and they will accept returns within 14 days of receipt, less shipping. Shipping from Europe is quick.

Terms and Conditions (trt-electronics.com)

13 minutes ago, stuartv said:

ps. If you're looking at paying normal, retail price for the YS-D3s, I would say to seriously consider spending just a little more and getting the Retra Pros (and the UWT trigger). I only bought the YS-D3s because I got them at Key Man pricing. Otherwise, I feel like they are just way too much trouble.

I already own the Turtle, so adding the UWT to retras, plus a bulkhead, double sync cable, etc adds more complexity and cost. But it's food for thought. 

 

I haven't even had a chance to Dive my Ys-110a's on my a6100 with sturtle. last dives I did were with my S95 in 2019. Darn covid.

Edited by Lewis88

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1 minute ago, Lewis88 said:

You can buy directly from TRT, and they will accept returns within 14 days of receipt, less shipping. 

Terms and Conditions (trt-electronics.com)

I already own the Turtle, so adding the UWT to retras, plus a bulkhead, double sync cable, etc adds more complexity and cost.

 

Well, that's interesting. I emailed back and forth with Balazs about where to buy from. I told him I didn't want to buy from BS because of no refunds. He suggested Bluewater, but never mentioned ordering it directly from their website.

If you get the Retras, you could/would still trigger them with f/o. No need for the electronic cable, etc.. And since you own the Turtle already, sure, stick with that.

So, to replace your YS-110as, you would only need to buy the Retras, and nothing else.

 

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1 minute ago, stuartv said:

 

Well, that's interesting. I emailed back and forth with Balazs about where to buy from. I told him I didn't want to buy from BS because of no refunds. He suggested Bluewater, but never mentioned ordering it directly from their website.

If you get the Retras, you could/would still trigger them with f/o. No need for the electronic cable, etc.. And since you own the Turtle already, sure, stick with that.

So, to replace your YS-110as, you would only need to buy the Retras, and nothing else.

 

He likely assumed you wanted a stateside supplier. I also just noticed that the retras are compatible with my sturtle, and does HSS! Very interesting.

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Just now, Lewis88 said:

He likely assumed you wanted a stateside supplier. I also just noticed that the retras are compatible with my sturtle, and does HSS! Very interesting.

Or he was trying to not steal business from his US retailers. And I can totally respect that.

But, I also see now that if I buy it directly from his website, with shipping and conversion from Euro to USD, it would only cost $345 - instead of $450 from one of the US retailers....

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I just went ahead and bought one from Balazs's website. I'm too intrigued if it will work. It would be a helpful option with my YS-D3's.

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12 hours ago, ScottAudette said:

I just went ahead and bought one from Balazs's website. I'm too intrigued if it will work. It would be a helpful option with my YS-D3's.

Please report back!

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2 hours ago, Lewis88 said:

Please report back!

For sure. Seems he's on a dive trip! LOL so it's gonna be a few weeks!

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On 1/25/2021 at 5:12 PM, stuartv said:

 

Well, that's interesting. I emailed back and forth with Balazs about where to buy from. I told him I didn't want to buy from BS because of no refunds. He suggested Bluewater, but never mentioned ordering it directly from their website.

If you get the Retras, you could/would still trigger them with f/o. No need for the electronic cable, etc.. And since you own the Turtle already, sure, stick with that.

So, to replace your YS-110as, you would only need to buy the Retras, and nothing else.

 

Dear Stuart,   
 

You asked me to give you a dealer in USA and We did it as i remember well. :) 
I can show you the emails what you have written. :) 

If you would have bought the TURTLE directly from Us the rules could have given you the refund possibility.
But sorry  we never tell the dealer which refund policy would be perfect with their customers. 

By the way the D3  is a wrong way!   They have very poor quality sensor 

So if you would have asked me which strobe is the perfect novadays we could have  mentioned to you numerous types. 

Please in the future don't write non real negative informations about Our firm in these forums.  
Thank you for your understanding.

Balazs Kurucz 
Owner of TRT-Electronics

 
 

Edited by Balage_diver

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1 hour ago, Balage_diver said:

Dear Stuart,   
 

You asked me to give you a dealer in USA and We did it as i remember well. :) 
I can show you the emails what you have written. :) 

If you would have bought the TURTLE directly from Us the rules could have given you the refund possibility.
But sorry  we never tell the dealer which refund policy would be perfect with their customers. 

By the way the D3  is a wrong way!   They have very poor quality sensor 

So if you would have asked me which strobe is the perfect novadays we could have  mentioned to you numerous types. 

Please in the future don't write non real negative informations about Our firm in these forums.  
Thank you for your understanding.

Balazs Kurucz 
Owner of TRT-Electronics

 
 

 

Hello Balazs,

It's good to hear from you! I had emailed you on 1/21, asking what the differences are between the 3 different Turtle triggers for Sony that are shown on your website. I never heard anything back. I was concerned something had happened to you!

I think we may have some kind of misunderstanding here. Your email to me on 1/13 said:

"My suggest if you can find a dealer where you live you can test it there."

In my response, I said:

"Is there another dealer in the USA besides Backscatter? I would buy it from Backscatter to try except that they do not offer refunds on returned items. If there was someone else to buy it from that would offer a refund in case I tried it and it didn’t work, then I would buy it from them."

You'll notice that I did not say "if there was someone else to buy it from in the USA..." I asked about a dealer in the USA in direct response to your suggestion to find one where I could test your trigger with my YS-D3 strobes. My statement about where I would buy it from did not, in any way, preclude the possibility that I would buy it from your website, had you told me about that option.

Perhaps we have experienced somewhat of a language barrier? I may be mistaken but I have gotten the impression that possibly English is not your native language? Your English is very good, but maybe there is some nuance here that has left us misunderstanding each other?

That might also explain another misunderstanding we seem to have been having.

In email from myself to you on 1/20, I said:

"I received my S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless today, from Bluewater Photo Store."

After a couple more emails back and forth, in an email from you to me on the next day (1/21), you said:

"i don't know what did you order!  You never mention this!"

I am still unclear on whether "S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless" is somehow ambiguous with regards to communicating to you what product I had purchased. I thought it was adequately specific to clearly identify what I had purchased, but I don't know your products well enough to be certain of that. Or possibly it was adequately specific and, as I hypothesized earlier, we may just be experiencing some level of misunderstanding due to a small language barrier.

Anyway, I do not believe I have posted any "non real informations" about your firm in these forums or anywhere else.

Regards,

Stuart 

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1 hour ago, stuartv said:

 

Hello Balazs,

It's good to hear from you! I had emailed you on 1/21, asking what the differences are between the 3 different Turtle triggers for Sony that are shown on your website. I never heard anything back. I was concerned something had happened to you!

I think we may have some kind of misunderstanding here. Your email to me on 1/13 said:

"My suggest if you can find a dealer where you live you can test it there."

In my response, I said:

"Is there another dealer in the USA besides Backscatter? I would buy it from Backscatter to try except that they do not offer refunds on returned items. If there was someone else to buy it from that would offer a refund in case I tried it and it didn’t work, then I would buy it from them."

You'll notice that I did not say "if there was someone else to buy it from in the USA..." I asked about a dealer in the USA in direct response to your suggestion to find one where I could test your trigger with my YS-D3 strobes. My statement about where I would buy it from did not, in any way, preclude the possibility that I would buy it from your website, had you told me about that option.

Perhaps we have experienced somewhat of a language barrier? I may be mistaken but I have gotten the impression that possibly English is not your native language? Your English is very good, but maybe there is some nuance here that has left us misunderstanding each other?

That might also explain another misunderstanding we seem to have been having.

In email from myself to you on 1/20, I said:

"I received my S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless today, from Bluewater Photo Store."

After a couple more emails back and forth, in an email from you to me on the next day (1/21), you said:

"i don't know what did you order!  You never mention this!"

I am still unclear on whether "S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless" is somehow ambiguous with regards to communicating to you what product I had purchased. I thought it was adequately specific to clearly identify what I had purchased, but I don't know your products well enough to be certain of that. Or possibly it was adequately specific and, as I hypothesized earlier, we may just be experiencing some level of misunderstanding due to a small language barrier.

Anyway, I do not believe I have posted any "non real informations" about your firm in these forums or anywhere else.

Regards,

Stuart 

Hi Stuart. 

From my side is a "bit different". But its not problem for me.  

We always help to Our customers who buy the TURTLE from Us or from Our dealer.

But we can't see in the business between the dealer and the customer. !!!!!

You asked me about your purchase what we could not answered.   I think it is normal. :)

I check all emails what you wrote and we could answer all technical question  before you bought the product from Bluewater.
That's all what we can do.   
Sorry, but we didn't know what happened between the dealer and the customer this is not Our side.  i write it again.
All purchases belong only to the buyer and seller.

Every information is on Our website about the products,  may be there is technical or just shipping info. 

Fortunately we got so many positive emails from Our customers who use the TURTLE products.  Usually got pictures or just some good words.  So also here i would like to say thank our customers for the positive words


Well..   I hope you can find a correct trigger to your setup. 

Regards

Balazs Kurucz 
TRT-Electronics

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Balage_diver said:

Hi Stuart. 

From my side is a "bit different". But its not problem for me.  

We always help to Our customers who buy the TURTLE from Us or from Our dealer.

But we can't see in the business between the dealer and the customer. !!!!!

You asked me about your purchase what we could not answered.   I think it is normal. :)

I check all emails what you wrote and we could answer all technical question  before you bought the product from Bluewater.
That's all what we can do.   
Sorry, but we didn't know what happened between the dealer and the customer this is not Our side.  i write it again.
All purchases belong only to the buyer and seller.

Every information is on Our website about the products,  may be there is technical or just shipping info. 

Fortunately we got so many positive emails from Our customers who use the TURTLE products.  Usually got pictures or just some good words.  So also here i would like to say thank our customers for the positive words


Well..   I hope you can find a correct trigger to your setup. 

Regards

Balazs Kurucz 
TRT-Electronics

Hi Balazs,

I emailed this question and never got a response. Maybe I can learn here.

There are 3 images of the S-Turtle Trigger for Sony Mirrorless from your website. Can you please explain what the difference is between them?

Also, how do I know which is the correct one for my camera and housing?

Also, when trying to order one from your website, it does not give me an option to choose between these 3 different triggers, so how do I know which one I will receive?

 

165_original.jpg

167_original.jpg

166_original.jpg

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I agree it is not clear and I'm surprised it is not specified (and I own one).

When you order a Turtle (on the website or your retailer), I believe you need to specify which housing you want to use it with (I emailed my retailer).

The first one is for Sony A7x Nauticam housings I am sure (I have that one). The second and third one are for other housings brands but I don't know which one (hugyfot likely)

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6 minutes ago, Balage_diver said:

Hi Stuart. 

From my side is a "bit different". But its not problem for me.  

We always help to Our customers who buy the TURTLE from Us or from Our dealer.

But we can't see in the business between the dealer and the customer. !!!!!

You asked me about your purchase what we could not answered.   I think it is normal. :)

I check all emails what you wrote and we could answer all technical question  before you bought the product from Bluewater.
That's all what we can do.   
Sorry, but we didn't know what happened between the dealer and the customer this is not Our side.  i write it again.
All purchases belong only to the buyer and seller.

 You said that you always help your customers who buy the Turtle from you or your dealer. Unfortunately, that was not how I felt after my experience.

You also said you answered all my technical questions before I bought the product from Bluewater - which is true. And then you say "that is all we can do." That seems to be correct, as well. No more help from you after I bought from Bluewater.

I sent you an email that said:

"Hi Balazs,

I received my S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless today, from Bluewater Photo Store. Picture attached.

This is for use with my Sony a7rIV camera, in a Nauticam housing.

I have a couple of questions:

First, it appears they sent me the Mobie version. What I received has the hotshoe separated from the trigger with a short cable.

Should I return this for the non-Mobie trigger, or does it matter?

Second, your website says these triggers come with a charging cable. There was no charging cable in the box. 

Did they send me an old version of the product that didn’t come with the cable? Should I have gotten a charging cable with it?

Third, the LED emitters on this do not look correct for my setup. Your website has pictures of LED emitters that are set in the top of stalks that would stick up inside the ports of my housing. 

Don’t I need a version of the trigger with that other type of LED?

Thanks.

-    Stuart"

The email had this picture attached.

Your response was this:

"Dear Stuart, 

Please contact with Bluewater in these cases.  
You bougth it from there not directly from Us. 
Regards
Balazs"

That does not seem to match your statement that you will support your customers who buy from your dealer.

Then later you said:

"i don't know what did you order!  You never mention this!"

As I mentioned earlier, that was on 1/21, when the day before, in the same email chain, I had said:

"I received my S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless today, from Bluewater Photo Store. " I did tell you exactly what I ordered. I sent you a picture of what I received, and I asked you if what I received is what I ordered. You would not answer my question.

It was not my intention to air all this on this forum. But, since you chose to imply that I have posted "non real informations" on this forum, and then posted information that is "non real" - for example, "We always help to Our customers who buy the TURTLE from Us or from Our dealer" you have made me feel like my only recourse was to share the whole story here.

20210120_174057-1600.jpg

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3 minutes ago, waterpixel said:

I agree it is not clear and I'm surprised it is not specified (and I own one).

When you order a Turtle (on the website or your retailer), I believe you need to specify which housing you want to use it with (I emailed my retailer).

The first one is for Sony A7x Nauticam housings I am sure (I have that one). The second and third one are for other housings brands but I don't know which one (hugyfot likely)

Right. And when I try to order one from their website, it never asks me what housing or camera I have. At least, not up to the point where I am ready to click the "Place Order" button.

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I'm going to try and steer this back on topic. As I'm sure other people are are interested in the technical aspects and issues regarding this device.. Like I said earlier my s-turtle arrived Monday. And now the fun begins. 

 

For the those following:
I am using a Sony A6400 in a Nauticam housing. I bought the S-Turtle Mobie to use fiber optics over a long run, think underwater studio and don't want to use the pop up strobe.

OUT OF THE HOUSING I've triggered my Sea & Sea YS-D3's over 20ft using Asahi 613 multicore with the end directly touching the Turtle. LED's. IN THE HOUSING I've had absolutely ZERO luck trying to get the YS-D3's to fire. ZERO. 

Also there seems to be no way to easily align the LED pads of the Mobie to be exactly centered. I am open to all suggestions. The A6400 housing seems to have a prism built in as well? 

-Scott

 


 

sea&sea2.jpg

sea&sea1.jpg

Edited by ScottAudette
why not?

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15 minutes ago, ScottAudette said:

I'm going to try and steer this back on topic. As I'm sure other people are are interested in the technical aspects and issues regarding this device.. Like I said earlier my s-turtle arrived Monday. And now the fun begins. 

 

For the those following:
I am using a Sony A6400 in a Nauticam housing. I bought the S-Turtle Mobie to use fiber optics over a long run, think underwater studio and don't want to use the pop up strobe.

OUT OF THE HOUSING I've triggered my Sea & Sea YS-D3's over 20ft using Asahi 613 multicore with the end directly touching the Turtle. LED's. IN THE HOUSING I've had absolutely ZERO luck trying to get the YS-D3's to fire. ZERO. 

Also there seems to be no way to easily align the LED pads of the Mobie to be exactly centered. I am open to all suggestions. The A6400 housing seems to have a prism built in as well? 

-Scott

Just to confirm you cannot trigger the YS-D3 over any length of cable when the trigger is in the housing?  Certainly would seem to be an alignment problem.  How are they attached - it looks like it uses stick on pads?   It seems it would be critical to centre the LED directly over the fibre.  The prism is probably not helping  if indeed it is a prism as you would need to centre the LED optically.

Questions about the flash window - looking at pics in the manual to it looks like the flash window is flat on both sides and the plastic moulding with the ports for the fibre optics looks like it is sloping upwards.  It is impossible to confirm this without the housing in the hand.  I would suggest to take off the moulding with ports to check.  You can undo the two allen screws above.  See this pic:

image.png.081eb74d20ce8e470461eae4c4d9f734.png

Then try to align the fibre end over the LED in the window and try triggering again.  If this works you need to come up with a way to hold the fibre optic ends square on to the window and aligned with the LEDs.   I know other housings have fibre optic port plate that holds them square on,  The arrangement probably works with the built in flash as there is so much more light.

 

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6 hours ago, stuartv said:

 You said that you always help your customers who buy the Turtle from you or your dealer. Unfortunately, that was not how I felt after my experience.

You also said you answered all my technical questions before I bought the product from Bluewater - which is true. And then you say "that is all we can do." That seems to be correct, as well. No more help from you after I bought from Bluewater.

I sent you an email that said:

"Hi Balazs,

I received my S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless today, from Bluewater Photo Store. Picture attached.

This is for use with my Sony a7rIV camera, in a Nauticam housing.

I have a couple of questions:

First, it appears they sent me the Mobie version. What I received has the hotshoe separated from the trigger with a short cable.

Should I return this for the non-Mobie trigger, or does it matter?

Second, your website says these triggers come with a charging cable. There was no charging cable in the box. 

Did they send me an old version of the product that didn’t come with the cable? Should I have gotten a charging cable with it?

Third, the LED emitters on this do not look correct for my setup. Your website has pictures of LED emitters that are set in the top of stalks that would stick up inside the ports of my housing. 

Don’t I need a version of the trigger with that other type of LED?

Thanks.

-    Stuart"

The email had this picture attached.

Your response was this:

"Dear Stuart, 

Please contact with Bluewater in these cases.  
You bougth it from there not directly from Us. 
Regards
Balazs"

That does not seem to match your statement that you will support your customers who buy from your dealer.

Then later you said:

"i don't know what did you order!  You never mention this!"

As I mentioned earlier, that was on 1/21, when the day before, in the same email chain, I had said:

"I received my S-Turtle Smart trigger for Sony Mirrorless today, from Bluewater Photo Store. " I did tell you exactly what I ordered. I sent you a picture of what I received, and I asked you if what I received is what I ordered. You would not answer my question.

It was not my intention to air all this on this forum. But, since you chose to imply that I have posted "non real informations" on this forum, and then posted information that is "non real" - for example, "We always help to Our customers who buy the TURTLE from Us or from Our dealer" you have made me feel like my only recourse was to share the whole story here.

 

Hi Stuart,

this seems to be descending into a "he said" ....."he said" ...."he said" contest and is not being productive.  Remember interpretation of online forum posts is a two way street it is easy to interpret written word in a way the first poster did not intend no matter what your mother tongue is. 

remember that for most products support to choose and sell you the right version of a product and even the warranty lies with the importer and communication channels with the manufacturer are often closed or limited.  I think all Balazs is trying to say is if you were sold the wrong one you need to solve that with whoever you sold it to.  If I am not mistaken you have already returned the trigger to Bluewater.   Airing it on the forum only gets people's back up.     I think people now know they need to be sure they get a version that matches their housing as well as matches their camera which seems to be the main issue at hand.

Might I suggest everyone leaves it there.

 

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1 hour ago, ChrisRoss said:

Just to confirm you cannot trigger the YS-D3 over any length of cable when the trigger is in the housing?  Certainly would seem to be an alignment problem.  How are they attached - it looks like it uses stick on pads?   It seems it would be critical to centre the LED directly over the fibre.  The prism is probably not helping  if indeed it is a prism as you would need to centre the LED optically.

 

 

Hi Chris, 

That's exactly right. Any length of cable outside of the housing. And yes, it does use stick pads to attach. Probably going to need to find more as these already not sticky from all the fussing around. 

So, the tubes on the front are angled down to what looks like a glued in prism I will remove the front tomorrow and see what I actually find. 

 

-Scott

 

Edited by ScottAudette

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48 minutes ago, ScottAudette said:

Hi Chris, 

That's exactly right. Any length of cable outside of the housing. And yes, it does use stick pads to attach. Probably going to need to find more as these already not sticky from all the fussing around. 

So, the tubes on the front are angled down to what looks like a glued in prism I will remove the front tomorrow and see what I actually find. 

 

-Scott

 

First thing to do would be to try and trigger holding a bare cable on the prism - square on - before you remove the pads on the inside - if that doesn't work you are going to have a struggle triggering them in any way.

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