Draq 111 Posted March 21, 2021 Please note, this is a lament rather than a complaint, or rant. Although I don't "need" new strobes, I have been intrigued by the Retras and thought it would be great to experiment with the HSS. I don't need TTL but it is nice to have the option, and that is why I paid to have a TTL compatible trigger in my D500 housing. I actually came very close to buying the first iteration of them, but missed some early discount dates and decided to wait, and then they were no more, etc. I was recently thinking (and I guess, still am, sort of) of getting a pair of the Retra prime before my next trip. But then I did the math. OK, the strobes are expensive, but I understand that and am OK with it. So roughly $2k for the pair. Then there are the bits and pieces; bumpers, beam narrowing rings, reflectors, maybe superchargers, so now we are more like $2800. And then I remember that I also need to upgrade my trigger in order to use HSS or TTL, so now we are up over $3000. (US$) I find my enthusiasm waning. Again, this is not a criticism of the prices, just a lament. Since I have strobes that work fine, I think this is an extravagance I can't really justify. I may give in and get the strobes and just wait a while before upgrading the trigger, but even then, the price is a bit beyond my "thought it would be fun" budget. If anyone has a discount coupon for Retra lying around, let me know. Or even just words of encouragement, condolences, etc. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hyp 104 Posted March 21, 2021 I am in exactly the same place. What I have works fine (except the snooting situation which is dire, but could be solved with just the Backscatter Flash). The Retras are not in any way overpriced. They seem to be one of the best strobes in the markets and for me certainly the most desirable one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 21, 2021 Hey Draq and Hyp Been there, felt that. Had a pair of Inon Z240s which I thought were great. Apart from the snooting thing. Then I thought I'm only passing this life once - I'm quite a good bit into it too. Then I thought "sod it", I'm ordering a pair of Retra Primes - with the bits. And yeah, price for the strobe is fair enough. They are serially high quality. Then I added the bumpers, the neat little neoprene overcoats..... Do I regret it. Nope. I am utterly delighted with them. Maybe a bit poorer in the bank account. But hey....... And..... then I bought the supercharger, the reflector and narrowing ring. I think I might just get my bank to send my salary to Retra, Subal, Nikon and Scubapro and see if, between them, they will give me an allowance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lewis88 12 Posted March 22, 2021 I am on the same page OP. I have a pair of YS-110a's, and decided to use my 2020/2021 scuba budget on a new housing, ports, new reg, new computer, and new bcd, and the rest for travel. That 2-3k strobe budget pays for 2 trips to cozumel and my 110a's still work great for now. Strobes are next year but I am still torn between retras or YS-D3's. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newdiver 5 Posted March 22, 2021 In a similar situation here, though I was pretty set on the Z330 and then changed my mind after some advise from people here with first hand experience with the Retras. I was set on Retras but they have gone out of stock and may not come back at all? I am now back to the very beginning and thinking of getting the Z330. I am confused and it seems that Retra's not being available makes it easier to go with Z330s. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Oskar@RetraUWT 53 Posted March 22, 2021 Orders for the Retra Flash will be open very soon. We have been planning something special for the 10 year anniversary... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Draq 111 Posted March 22, 2021 " Orders for the Retra Flash will be open very soon. We have been planning something special for the 10 year anniversary... " Oh, fine...more temptation. Actually, I think I have a plan. I have a bunch of micro four thirds lenses, ports, housing, etc. that I am not using and have never bothered to sell. I hung on to it when I went to a D500, but I think it is time to say goodbye to it. I am going to put it on ebay and that will probably cover the cost, or much of it. Hopefully. Still an extravagance, but at least it won't be "new" money going into the sinkhole. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hyp 104 Posted March 22, 2021 2 hours ago, Oskar@RetraUWT said: Orders for the Retra Flash will be open very soon. We have been planning something special for the 10 year anniversary... Unless that special something is a 70% discount, I'm probably not in. That said, this is not because your products are not worth what you're asking for. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 22, 2021 3 hours ago, Oskar@RetraUWT said: Orders for the Retra Flash will be open very soon. We have been planning something special for the 10 year anniversary... Oh lord, I can feel the siren call of my credit card..... Hey Oskar, has the LSD case been withdrawn? Any plans to develop a new one? I could offer some design thoughts! I'd quite like to be able to remove it once in a while during a dive and know it was secure rather than just dangling...... same with the masks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Oskar@RetraUWT 53 Posted March 22, 2021 We stopped making the LSD bag about 3 years ago. There was not enough interest for this item since most photographers make use of their existing carrying solutions, mainly the diving pockets, or they attach more ropes and clips to the Optical tube. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 22, 2021 Thanks, Oskar. Yeah, I'm on the Paracord and carbiner trail. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Architeuthis 138 Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) On 3/21/2021 at 4:26 PM, Draq said: Please note, this is a lament rather than a complaint, or rant. Although I don't "need" new strobes, I have been intrigued by the Retras and thought it would be great to experiment with the HSS. I don't need TTL but it is nice to have the option, and that is why I paid to have a TTL compatible trigger in my D500 housing. I actually came very close to buying the first iteration of them, but missed some early discount dates and decided to wait, and then they were no more, etc. I was recently thinking (and I guess, still am, sort of) of getting a pair of the Retra prime before my next trip. But then I did the math. OK, the strobes are expensive, but I understand that and am OK with it. So roughly $2k for the pair. Then there are the bits and pieces; bumpers, beam narrowing rings, reflectors, maybe superchargers, so now we are more like $2800. And then I remember that I also need to upgrade my trigger in order to use HSS or TTL, so now we are up over $3000. (US$) I find my enthusiasm waning. Again, this is not a criticism of the prices, just a lament. Since I have strobes that work fine, I think this is an extravagance I can't really justify. I may give in and get the strobes and just wait a while before upgrading the trigger, but even then, the price is a bit beyond my "thought it would be fun" budget. If anyone has a discount coupon for Retra lying around, let me know. Or even just words of encouragement, condolences, etc. Hi Draq, Just my thoughts: Instead of investing 3k for experimenting with HSS, you could experiment with ND filter on the lens for few $ and report here. As far as I understand the HSS issue, the outcome should be the same (darker background as the fastest non-HSS sync. speed, lowest ISO and smallest tolerable aperture allow). And unless you have in mind what to do with TTL, you do not need it, most UW photographers never use it... In case you suffer from GAS (I also have severe attacks from time to time), there is no other choice than to go for the new equipment. As you already say you can sell the old gear to limit the losses... Wolfgang Edited March 23, 2021 by Architeuthis Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Draq 111 Posted March 23, 2021 6 hours ago, Architeuthis said: Hi Draq, Just my thoughts: Instead of investing 3k for experimenting with HSS, you could experiment with ND filter on the lens for few $ and report here. As far as I understand the HSS issue, the outcome should be the same (darker background as the fastest non-HSS sync. speed, lowest ISO and smallest tolerable aperture allow). And unless you have in mind what to do with TTL, you do not need it, most UW photographers never use it... In case you suffer from GAS (I also have severe attacks from time to time), there is no other choice than to go for the new equipment. As you already say you can sell the old gear to limit the losses... Wolfgang Mostly GAS, I am ashamed to say. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 23, 2021 45 minutes ago, Draq said: Mostly GAS, I am ashamed to say. You're on the slippery slope, Draq. You called the original post "can't quite justify the cost". Can we ever? Don't we just rationalise it?!?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Joss 13 Posted March 23, 2021 On 3/22/2021 at 3:50 PM, Lewis88 said: Strobes are next year but I am still torn between retras or YS-D3's. I get surprised at every time I see folks comparing the new Retras Vs the YS-D3's. Just make a search here on WP about S&S strobes. If you want to save some money better think about the Inons. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 23, 2021 On 3/22/2021 at 7:50 AM, Lewis88 said: Strobes are next year but I am still torn between retras or YS-D3's. Picking up Joss' point, do have a search around on WP for views on the YS-D3 before you buy...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Draq 111 Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) Just ordered the new Prime X. I think I need to start going to meetings. Hi, my name is John and.... Edited March 23, 2021 by Draq 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hyp 104 Posted March 23, 2021 Just saw the news. I'll take all your now outdated Original Retra Primes/Pros off your hands for 50% off. I'm sure they are completely worthless now that better ones are out. PS: Offer only stands on the first two strobes coming my way! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 23, 2021 29 minutes ago, Draq said: Just ordered the new Prime X. I think I need to start going to meetings. Hi, my name is John and.... LOL, brilliant!!! Congrats.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 23, 2021 1 minute ago, hyp said: Just saw the news. I'll take all your now outdated Original Retra Primes/Pros off your hands for 50% off. I'm sure they are completely worthless now that better ones are out. PS: Offer only stands on the first two strobes coming my way! It begins...... Oskar has just chucked a hand grenade into WP. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicool 26 Posted March 23, 2021 We stopped making the LSD bag about 3 years ago. There was not enough interest for this item since most photographers make use of their existing carrying solutions, mainly the diving pockets, or they attach more ropes and clips to the Optical tube.I too wouldn’t bother with a bag.Orginally I was fitting my gadgets in large drysuit pockets, and I must say the LSD was nearly filling one cargo pocket.Then i had a few wetsuit dives, seeing me clipping that much accessories on D-rings: -1x LSD + 1 mask-2x Reductors + macro rings-Backscatter coloured filtered system (for another strobe)Very easy to grab gear and use my Retras in different ways during the dive. I would just clip/unclip, sometines leave an accessory on the seafloor for a while if i will be stationary (all are slightly negative).I like to keep macro rings and masks in pocket when i have one though.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lewis88 12 Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, TimG said: Picking up Joss' point, do have a search around on WP for views on the YS-D3 before you buy...... Most of the hate on S&S seems to be WP group think based on the D2's bad reputation. They just did a firmware update to fix the D3 triggering issues. Never had a S&S strobe flood, but have had 2 different inons flood. their battery compartment o-ring design is garbage IMO. Edited March 23, 2021 by Lewis88 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisRoss 150 Posted March 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Lewis88 said: Most of the hate on S&S seems to be WP group think based on the D2's bad reputation. They just did a firmware update to fix the D3 triggering issues. Never had a S&S strobe flood, but have had 2 different inons flood. their battery compartment o-ring design is garbage IMO. It's not S&S hate, just experience - we see every post on here and try to help on a great many of them and we certainly see a lot more issues with S&S strobes. No doubt a great many people use them successfully, but based on posts on here a lot more issues come up on S&S vs INON. The D3 certainly seems to have some good design features but the jury is still out on reliability as they've only just been released. My personal experience is with INON Z-240, my pair are 5 years old now and I have no issues with the battery cap and like that I can inspect the o-ring after installation. The main thing with the INONs is using enough grease - if you do this they go on smoothly everytime. Taking the cap off requires a little care but again they are fine and I'm still using my original o-rings. I like the fact that the battery contact is separate from the cap. I'm sure the S&S cap also works well and either strobe could flood from the normal causes for o-rings failing to seal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Draq 111 Posted March 26, 2021 On 3/23/2021 at 5:38 PM, Lewis88 said: Most of the hate on S&S seems to be WP group think based on the D2's bad reputation. They just did a firmware update to fix the D3 triggering issues. Never had a S&S strobe flood, but have had 2 different inons flood. their battery compartment o-ring design is garbage IMO. Not to criticize your preferences; I think everyone should choose what works for them, but I have used Inon strobes for over 10 years. D2000, Z240, Z330, S2000, and my son who also does underwater photography has been using Inons for about 7 years. Neither of us has ever had a strobe flood. Proper lube and using some reasonable caution when screwing down the cap seems to be the key. A brief examination through the clear cap to confirm the O ring is not twisted is a good idea. The O rings seem to last forever. I change mine every few years out of caution, but then keep the old ones as spares. For those who are concerned, an additional O ring can be installed inside the cap, creating a double O ring situation. Sorry you had problems, but I cannot agree with the garbage thing. I have never has a S&S strobe, so have no knowledge other than what I read, and it appears that once S&S closed their China plant and moved production to Japan, things improved and I assume the D3 is made there as well. It might take a while for their reputation to improve following the Chinese D2 issues. Or maybe the D3 is crap. I have no idea. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimG 62 Posted March 26, 2021 I'm with Draq and Chris. Had Inon Z220s and Z240s between 2003-2020. No floods, no failures, no problems. I'd recommend them highly and have done often. Now on Retras which I think are even better. Like Chris, I only know what the WPixers post about the S&Ss. "You pay your money and you take your chances......." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
