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hedonist222

should I get 5d mkii aquatica housing?

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Hello everyone

 

I have found a 5d mkii aquatica housing with 6" dome.

Thats all the seller has.

 

I realize the 5d mkii is dated, but its what I have.

I have the following lenses:

17-40 L

24-105 L

35 L mki

135 L

sigma 150 macro

 

I'd love to use the ef 35mm f/1.4 L or the 17-40 and eventually use the sigma for macro

 

So two questions.

 

Should I get the housing?

Are ports discontinued?

What ports would I need for say the 35 L ?

The aquatica pdf doesn't mention the 35 L port.

 

Thank you

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I have an Aquatica 8" dome I can sell you at a modest price. Works well for splits and will work for fisheye if you get one later.

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Is it the glass or acrylic?

What do you use it with?

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the 6" dome is a little small, you need to get the right extensions to use with the various lenses.  Consult the aqutica portcharts for dome and extensions needed.  Just note that  a full frame camera needs big ports to use with rectilinear lenses  if you want good sharp corners.  Fisheyes can use smaller ports.  You also need to think about how you are going to trigger your strobes - check to see if triggers are available.  see here:  https://www.bluewaterphotostore.com/images/articles/AquaticaPortChart/canon_type_1.pdf

Note it lists the 6" dome for use with a fisheye lens.  The sima 150mm macro is probably a bit long for UW use and the 100mm macros are more popular  If I recall correctly the Sigma 105mm macro extends when focusing which can be a significant problem and the Canon 100mm is a better option.

 

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1 hour ago, ChrisRoss said:

the 6" dome is a little small, you need to get the right extensions to use with the various lenses.  Consult the aqutica portcharts for dome and extensions needed.  Just note that  a full frame camera needs big ports to use with rectilinear lenses  if you want good sharp corners.  Fisheyes can use smaller ports.  You also need to think about how you are going to trigger your strobes - check to see if triggers are available.  see here:  https://www.bluewaterphotostore.com/images/articles/AquaticaPortChart/canon_type_1.pdf

Note it lists the 6" dome for use with a fisheye lens.  The sima 150mm macro is probably a bit long for UW use and the 100mm macros are more popular  If I recall correctly the Sigma 105mm macro extends when focusing which can be a significant problem and the Canon 100mm is a better option.

 

Thanks, Chris.

 

A question.

So Aquatica lists ports and compatible lenses.

But why have they simply just not listed every compatible lens?

How do I know which port to get for the 35 L I have?

Do I need to measure its height/radius and then look up the lenses listed on the chart to figure out?

Feels backwards?

I hope I'm wrong.

 

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I believe that the port reference from the time the housing was launched is not made anymore. But I think it is only a change related with a new system to lock the ports and extension rings. 
I think that the new extension rings are compatible with the old housings. The start of the references now are 48 and previously were 18. The 3 last numbers are the same. 
the lens 35L is not so common, at least underwater. Usual the lens used for wide angle are wider. Due to that Aquatica did not made test with it and that way does not make a proposal as to which extension to use for that lens. 
Bothe Canon 100 mm macro lens (the use and the L) are very good.

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On 5/22/2021 at 9:48 AM, hedonist222 said:

Is it the glass or acrylic?

What do you use it with?

It's acrylic in good condition. I use it on Nauticam with an Aquatica to Nauticam adapter. I added a manual focus control to the dome so I could manually focus the Tokina 10-17 on a Nikon Z50. The FTZ adapter doesn't support screw-focus lenses. For over/under manual focus is fine, since you focus on the underwater bit and let the depth of focus include the topside part. If you are using a lens with AF I can put a blank-plug is the hole for the focus control if you prefer. New price with dome shade is US$ 530. I can sell for US$ 300. I did a comparison test between this dome and the Nauticam 8.5 acrylic dome and there's no quality difference that I can detect.

PeteAtkinson-10.jpg

PeteAtkinson-11.jpg

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Yes, you should get teh housing, the 5D mk II is still a great camera and a great housing, and you can buy the dome to Pete, very good seller and photographer.

The ports are not discontinued, but the port chart doesn't show the port for the 35 mm cause it's a lens not very usefull underwater, I don't know anybody using this lens, you need something much more wider like the 11-40L which anyway I only like it for wreck diving or annimals, for the rest of wide angle shots I prefer the fish eye lens. 

Anyway, if you still want to use it, I don't know what's the dome than you should use, but I think it would be a big dome to achieve the widest with no soft corners. And anyway you should check the focus distance for that 35mm, the lens must be capable to focus the virtual image done inside the dome, and if not check if you can achieve that with an extra diopter lens

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On 5/22/2021 at 9:44 PM, hedonist222 said:

Thanks, Chris.

 

A question.

So Aquatica lists ports and compatible lenses.

But why have they simply just not listed every compatible lens?

How do I know which port to get for the 35 L I have?

Do I need to measure its height/radius and then look up the lenses listed on the chart to figure out?

Feels backwards?

I hope I'm wrong.

 

UW housing manufacturers only test popular lenses for UW use and then only list those that can actually function in a port, main criteria is they focus close enough.  Just because you like a lens on land doesn't mean it is a good idea to take it UW.   You also don't benefit from using fast lenses UW as you need to stop down for use in the dome.  Nautica for exa,ple has an extensive port chart but does not list either the 35mm 1.4 or f2 apart from the f2 lens for use with the WACP.  In general zooms are much more convenient UW as you are trying to get as close as possible to a range of creatures and still frame them properly.

If you still want to take the 35/1.4 UW you could work out what is required, but it's not a particularly useful focal length UW.

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What do you guys mean with focus close enough?

 

And why stop down when used in the dome?

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The dome produces a virtual image that is 3 dome radii from the dome surface for an object at infinity.  This is what the lens behind a dome needs to focus on.  A lot of lenses can't reach focus - particularly older designs and can't e used behind a dome without a diopter.

The virtual image is curved and concentric to the dome which means the corners of the image are much closer than the centre.   You need to stop down to get both the centre and edge of the image in focus.  If you don't stop down the corners are soft.  It becomes more of a problem the wider the lens and for rectilinear lenses it starts to be a losing battle as you drop below 14-15mm full frame equivalent focal length.  The problem is worse for fullframe cameras.  On full frame a 16mm focal length is shot at f11-16 and even then the corners are not perfect. 

This link has some details:  https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiQy4qv_-HwAhVU83MBHX-nCg4QFnoECBEQAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Foceanity.com.au%2Fblog%2Fview%2Funderstanding-flat-port-and-dome-port-theory&usg=AOvVaw3Z4dn07Qbhosq60gj6J2lk

 

 

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Cracking explanation, Chris! It's worth keeping that one bookmarked.

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12 minutes ago, TimG said:

Cracking explanation, Chris! It's worth keeping that one bookmarked.

Thanks Tim, - even with the typos !

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1 hour ago, ChrisRoss said:

The dome produces a virtual image that is 3 dome radii from the dome surface for an object at infinity.  This is what the lens behind a dome needs to focus on.  A lot of lenses can't reach focus - particularly older designs and can't e used behind a dome without a diopter.

The virtual image is curved and concentric to the dome which means the corners of the image are much closer than the centre.   You need to stop down to get both the centre and edge of the image in focus.  If you don't stop down the corners are soft.  It becomes more of a problem the wider the lens and for rectilinear lenses it starts to be a losing battle as you drop below 14-15mm full frame equivalent focal length.  The problem is worse for fullframe cameras.  On full frame a 16mm focal length is shot at f11-16 and even then the corners are not perfect. 

This link has some details:  https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiQy4qv_-HwAhVU83MBHX-nCg4QFnoECBEQAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Foceanity.com.au%2Fblog%2Fview%2Funderstanding-flat-port-and-dome-port-theory&usg=AOvVaw3Z4dn07Qbhosq60gj6J2lk

 

 

Ahh ok

So how do I figure out if the lens I intend to use can focus?

 

Canon 35mm f/1.4 L:

Aspherical lens element to correct aberrations

 

Minimum focus 0.30 m (11.81″)
Maximum magnification 0.18x
Autofocus Yes
 
Focus method Read

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1 hour ago, ChrisRoss said:

Thanks Tim, - even with the typos !

Hey, Shakespeare couldn't spell.......

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Why do you even want to use that 35mm lens.

Obviously all lenses that can be housed can also be used underwater, but most are not sensible, so three main types of lenses tend to be used.

1. The macro lens: This is used to photograph the tiny subjects that can be found underwater (in some locations in plentiful variety). Because they focus really close, you can get very close to your subject. Usually macro photography is done with additional lightsources. This is one of the most used lenses.

2. The wide angle lens: This lens is commonly used for reef scenes and large fish (sharks etc). The wide lens allows you to get very close so that your lights can hit your subject and still have a big scene. 

3. The fisheye lens: This is used in a similar way to the wide angle lens. The benefit is, you can get even closer. The downside is you need to get closer so anything that you don't want to be close to, or that doesn't come near is not ideal. Not ideal for subjects like wrecks where you want to keep the straight lines intact.

 There is also a fourth type which is used but not as commonly, because it often results in a longer distance to your subject.

The standard lens: You can use this for fish portraits and also larger subjects where it's impossible to get closer. You still try to get as close as possible so that your light reaches the subject. 

 

Remember that you want to reduce the amount of water you shoot through at all times. Always trying to get closer. A 35mm lens is kind of wide (so not that great for skittish fish) but not nearly wide enough that you can get close to the reef to light it up. That is why pretty much no one uses such a lens underwater. 

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Hi hyp

Good question.

I love the 35 L - takes such great photographs

I understand macro (I have a sigma 150) and I understand the appeal of wide angle underwater

But I think I want to use the 35 to take great shots - I'll frame the shot according to the 35mm 

 

 

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the 35 L fit into the housing with the 6" dome

I took a few photographs - focused well

I can't tell if the lens is touching the dome?

there doesn't appear to be resistance?

the housing securely closes?

 

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If the lens is almost touching the dome you need an extension ring, you are lousing angle. The lens must be as far as posible of the dome without vigneting becasue of the chasis of the dome port.

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turns out its touching the dome but the back plate is also sealing 

tempted to take it diving this week

I measured this:

camera with 35 mm lens:

protrudes 1.14 mm outwards  but the back seals

the gap (between main housing and back plate) in indiscernible 

tempted to dive..

 

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How did you determine the back plate is sealing?  Did you use a vacuum test?  It is flat contact o-ring and the back plate needs to be able to move in to seal properly so it can compress the o-ring.  It's your housing and expensive L- Lens but I would not dive with it like that.

BTW the reason for the correct extension is to get the best optical quality from the lens - it seems counter intuitive to me to want to use a lens because of the optical quality but compromise on the dome placement.

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good question, Chris

No I have not done a vacuum test but the gap with the lens and without a lens is visually the same 

And yes I would not want to lose the camera and lens - I'll just have to wait till backscatter or blue waters get the ports back in stock

A little frustrating that they both list the ports as in stock but don't really have stock

Generally speaking, how far back should a lens be from the dome or flat port?

 

Thanks for your and everyone's help here.

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9 hours ago, hedonist222 said:

good question, Chris

No I have not done a vacuum test but the gap with the lens and without a lens is visually the same 

And yes I would not want to lose the camera and lens - I'll just have to wait till backscatter or blue waters get the ports back in stock

A little frustrating that they both list the ports as in stock but don't really have stock

Generally speaking, how far back should a lens be from the dome or flat port?

 

Thanks for your and everyone's help here.

It's quite variable, you want the entrance pupil to coincide with the centre of the radius of curvature of the dome.  You can measure the nodal point your self or even estimate by looking at the apparent location of the aperture blades.  Once you have that you can compare it to nodal points of other lenses here:https://wiki.panotools.org/Entrance_Pupil_Database

If yu find a lens on that port chart with the same nodal point distance  you need the same extension.  You also need to know the radius of curvature of your port it - this can be calculated if the port is not a hemisphere- or if it is, then radius is half diameter.  Formulafor radius is here:  https://sciencing.com/radius-arc-7846775.html

 

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Many thanks but that is too technical for me, Chris.

Port charts don't mention nodal distances.

Just the port and compatible lenses.

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45 minutes ago, hedonist222 said:

Many thanks but that is too technical for me, Chris.

Port charts don't mention nodal distances.

Just the port and compatible lenses.

that's right they don't, but the chart I linked does - if you can approximate where the entrance pupil lies and measure the distance from th lens mount to that point - you can estimate what extension is required.  Look down your lens and place your finger on the lens barrel at the depth it looks like the aperture blades are located.  Measure from the lens mount to this point .  This will get you in the ball park for the correct extension.  You just look for a lens with the same nodal point distance that is also in the Aquatica lens chart and use the extension recommended for that lens.

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