Stepping up from GoPro 11 - Suggestions Please

[SB001 0]

Hi All,

I really enjoy filming and editing underwater video (predominantly wreck and cave diving, but also open water environments).

I have very good big blue video lights and I am currently using gopro 11 for my filming. 

I am considering upgrading to a better camera. There is so much information out there that it can easily become confusing. 

Given I film underwater I really appreciate the stabilisation capabilities of the gopro, so with any upgrade I need to factor this in. 

I use canon 80d as my primary camera on land so I am familiar with canon. 

At present, options that have been suggested to me are as follows:

Sony a6600
Sony A&SIII
Canon R6 II
Canon R7
Panasonic S1H (for more expensive option)

At present I'm probably leaning towards either of the two canon cameras, but open to feedback if better available.  

Could anyone offer any guidance / suggestions as to the above cameras and/or anything else that you think I should consider. 

Pros/Cons etc much appreciated

Thanks in advance.

[JohnE 8]

What are you shooting primarily?  Photos or Video?  Advice:  get a camera / housing optimized for what you are shooting.  All the cameras you list are photographic, and can shoot video.  If that's what you do, those are great options. 

But if you want a proper video platform, there are other options, like this: https://www.gateshousings.com/ax700-z90/  It has a suite of features not found any other kit e.g. Built-in pivoting LCD screen, huge zoom range (very versatile underwater), dedicated assignable buttons (like for one touch WB or focus peaking), customizable focus tracking (the AX700 is remarkable),  HDR 4K, and more.  

John

[mchiado 2]

Once you narrow the choices down, try renting for a weekend and see which you appeals. I thought i wanted a Canon recently and rented to be sure. I also throw a Sony in the rental cart, too, on a lark. The comparison once both were in my hands was easy and surprising—i loved the Sony and lukewarm on the Canon. 

[ChrisRoss 150]

If you are primarily shooting video you want to read the fine prints on what each of the cameras can do - some cameras crop in different formats or have various means on down sizing from the high MP sensor to a 4K output, others do it directly.  It's quite a big jump from Go-Pro to a full frame setup in terms of expense and size of equipment.  Rather starting at the camera I would suggest starting with your subject and working back through lenses and ports you need to the camera.    I would suggest you also include the GH-5/6 in your list they are very capable cameras for video work.

On your video lights what output are they?   Go-Pros are f2.8 and with full frame you'll probably be shooting at f8-11 due to dome port optics and DOF considerations, which requires significantly more light output.

[SB001 0]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the comments thus far.

My focus is definitely video over photography. Certainly happy to have photographic capabilities, but first priority is video. 

Current lighting system is twin Big Blue VL 18000P PROs.

SB

[ChrisRoss 150]

Those lights should be fine.  Think about the sort of quality you really need then start adding up costs for various systems.   The lenses you can use with each system will be quite different - for example for Canon you need to use a WACP in wet lenses, but Sony and the GH-5 you can use a WWL.  Similarly a full frame 16-35 rectilnear if that is the direction you want needs a 230mm dome, but you can use the 170mm Zen dome with the Panasonic 8-18 on the GH-5, much cheaper and more portable. 

[ColdDarkDiver 23]

I'll just jump in to say that in general this forum has a lot of sony lovers - and for very good reason.  I ended up going canon for a hybrid shooting solution with heavy video focus and I would definitely do it again. 

I will echo what has been said, that especially with full frame, things start getting bigger and more expensive constantly.  Dome size and f/stop all become really important and some of the WACP/WWL solutions help that in a few different ways, and the smaller port size of Sony's (on Nauticam) help all of that by about a stop. Personally, I want to shoot everything at 60p and Sony's implementation of that on the A7iv as a crop, removed that from my interests.  A1 - too expensive but very nice. And A7s III is an interesting option but didn't make the cut.  Any camera that crops to do 60p means I am spending a whole lot of money on lenses and domes and full frame, not to use a significant point of it - which removed many of the Sony options.

What is not always talked about is low light performance of full frame sensors and in low light the ability to shoot at F/14 - 1/125th and with a crazy high ISO and get clean 4k is really remarkable.  You will love that coming from the gopro!  

I shoot an R6 (not ii) above water - and love that camera for stills and just about everything video except I hate that one doesn't get full control of the settings for the red record button when in stills mode. You have to rotate the mode dial. In addition, I love love love that the R5 (what I shoot underwater) does not require a significant dial turn to change modes - its just two button presses. Underwater I like this since the mode selection dial has been the part of the housing that has had to be replaced on multiple of my camera housings.  I think the R6ii has a switch - which is great.

I also shoot with both a 180 and 230 dome.  And in video? I find the 180 is pretty solid for a lot of things.   I can dig up some video I shot this way if you are interested. And if you shoot at 20mm - it makes things a lot easier from the dome size perspective.  But if you don't need the corners to be epic sharp (and often they are out of the depth of field plane) then you can shoot much wider when the scene calls for it.  

While I don't know anyone who has used it, the R7 also has a lens (well 2) that can work with the WACP-C. The R6 does as well but it essentially is a 28mm fixed lens since none of the zoom range works.  Plus you can put an RF-S on any RF mount and it just shoots the crop center - something I didn't appreciate when i bought into the canon RF system (I am a long time canon user).  No one needs to point out the contradiction in me complaining about sony instilling a crop to shoot 60p, and then recommending a crop body and also shooting in crop mode by using an RF-S lens...the internal conflict is real. (you are also welcome to point out the contradiction)

The other camera I would seriously look at, if I was you, is the FX3 and FX30.  If you are really shooting video pretty much entirely - these seem like really interesting options.  In many ways the A7sIII has a lot of similarities to the FX3, so that is something to consider. I think the bodies are identical so you could get the FX30 now + all the housing stuff and then pick up a FX3 later?  Not sure on this but something I have been thinking about.

I'm also pretty interested in the body announcements coming down the pipe.  If the Canon R8 is an A7c (ii....hopefully soon) then that may be a real gem for underwater use.

Finally, I will say the jump to any of the cameras discussed is huge. I still bring a GoPro 11 on many dives and rarely touch the footage after it.  The Canon (in my case R5 underwater) is just a different level of quality. I feel the same about the R6 above water - it is just wonderful and by all measures, for wildlife video, the R6ii should be even better than that.

[gobiodon 62]

I think Sony a6600 would be a good compromise. I was in the same situation, and finally ended up with Sony A6400 and my only problem, so far is the small battery. My dream camera is FX30 but it's beyond my budget. I use it mainly for close-up (and macro in the future) with the 30mm macro lens (which is surprisingly good for video) and the 90 mm macro in an affordable housing (SeaFrogs Salted Line).

[Davide DB 424]

On 2/3/2023 at 10:21 AM, SB001 said:

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the comments thus far.

My focus is definitely video over photography. Certainly happy to have photographic capabilities, but first priority is video. 

Current lighting system is twin Big Blue VL 18000P PROs.

SB

I think GH5 is your best option.

Still a great camera for video. For its overall features I still don't see contenders without breaking the bank.

Tons of proven lens for underwater video and photo. As Chris pointed out you can use the WWL-1 with a cheap 14-42mm zoom lens.

I add that now you can find several bargain on the used market. New GH5M2 body price dropped lately

I do not see cons.

[fruehaufsteher2 15]

We did video with GoPro10 and A7IV. As others said 60fps at 4k is a must. But if you accept the crop in the A7 IV the output quality is really great. What I would not underestimate is the in-camera-processing from GoPro, especially stabilizing - I don't think any competitor has such a good stabilization.  Be prepared to have a much more shaky output.

A1 with Nauticam and WACP-C is surely a fine option