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mever

Canon EOS 20 D -please advise on lenses,port, strobe w/Ikeli

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Hi all- after research I am now the proud owner of the 20D, in part from advice gleaned here. Now, of course, the dilema of which lenses, ports, and strobes to get. I am sold on Ikelite, so the maze is focused somewhat.

Since this website seems to be a great resource, I will be grateful for any suggestions.

My previous UW camera, reefmaster 310, was the one that got me hooked, but obviously it is to limited for but beginer use.

I also own a film Rebel, Fujii Finepix Digital: so my experience with the 20d is my first quality camera.

Thanks a million, I know there's good advice out there!

Marty Everhard, Salt Lake City, Utah

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Not sure I'd recommend going straight out and buying the 10-22...that's a big decision. Definitely a go on the 100mm macro however, and assuming you have the 18-55mm kit lens (or the 17-85?). Those two will get you started, from there it's up to you whether or not you enjoy the wide side (18mm) of that lens enough to delve into more serious wide angle...

 

You don't really have a choice with regard to ports. You have a choice with lenses. Then the ports go with the lenses. Really quite simple :(

 

With regard to strobes, you'll be able to use Ikelite's new eTTL2 circuitry with Ikelite strobes, the DS-50 or the DS-125. There are others who prefer Inon's strobes, but you won't be able to use the aforementioned TTL...

 

Hope this helps somewhat...

 

~Matt Segal

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I knew I made the correct decision after viewing those pictures from T & C, along with a few others last few weeks. Is there a vendor on the Ikelite and Canon lenses ya'll could recommend? There was quite a bit of bull in shopping for the camera itself, wound up online Wellsdigital.com,

fair price IMHO,...it seems a little difficult finding a vendor on the Ikelite that has a published price list..

The Eagle Ray picture is awesome, congrats.

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Mever,

I am researching the same items as you. The place that looks the most appealing at this time for Ikelite housing, lenses, & ports is Helixcamera.com (Chicago), but I have not contacted them yet and know nothing about them from personal dealings. Looking forward to answers to your questions...as they will help both of us.

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The lenses you want:

 

15mm Sigma Fisheye

Canon 50mm macro

Canon 100mmm USM macro

Canon EF-S 10-22

Canon EF-S 18-55

 

Nothing wrong with that for an underwater lens kit. If you really like the 18-55 range you can consider the 17-40L.

 

Note that the above represents the lenses I want, rather than the lenses I use. I use the 17-40L and the Tamron 90mm macro underwater. I wouldn't really recommend either to you. I haven't yet got the 17-40L working well in the ikelite port, and the Tamron isn't supported on Ike's port chart.

 

I hope to have the top three lenses added to my bag in the next couple of weeks. The bottom two aren't an option for us poor 10D shooters... :(

 

DS-125 is on my shopping list too. DS-50 was my recent strobe, which is currently experiencing some 'technical difficulties', but that's OK, I have the best minds of Wetpixel working on it!. Wasn't up to the job of lighting wide angle anyway IMHO, but would probably be OK if macro is your thing. If you're going 20D + Ikelite, you'd want to go e-TTL housing, and that means your strobe choices are limited to those above - and I'd choose the DS-125.

 

Oh, and the simple answer where to buy your gear - B&H. I'd use Adorama at a pinch. I've given B&H a lot of cash over the last couple of years and they inevitably send some shiny new piece of camera gear in return. There's a recent thread on them in one of the other forums.

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I am confused. I thought I read that Ike's ettl converter will work with other brands of strobes, not just Ikelite. As long as the strobe recycles fast enough (I think this includes Sea and Sea and Inon).

 

So maybe your strobe choices aren't as limited - let's wait and see what Ike says.

 

Cheers

James

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Only Ikelite DS strobes operate eTTL with the Canon conversion circuitry. Other strobes including non-DS Ikelite, Inon, Sea & Sea can be used, but operate as manual only............

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Pretty sure only DS-125 and DS-50 will work, even the older ds-125 strobes using old nikonos protocol have some issues.

 

Here's the link to the Ike e-TTL page:

 

http://www.ikelite.com/web_pages/2canonTTL.html

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Somebody please tell me there is another price list published on Ikelite products! It is a bigger world than just one vendor!

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Maybe email or call Ryan over at Reef Photo & Video (formerly, UW Camera Pros). He's helped quite a few people on the board with their setups....and they do have more than what's listed on their website...:(

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Not to be so brash as to toot my own horn, but Haas Photography Inc. is a full service Ikelite dealer :( PLUS I'm a user of the equipment as the links below show helping Ikelite test new housings, etc.

 

I freely admit to not "lowballing" prices. But if you want advice on set-up and use, etc. along with the sale I can help any Wetpixellite :D I believe knowledgeable advice to be a valuable asset when purchasing any underwater system.

 

Contact information:

 

David Haas

Haas Photography Inc.

4596 Greenlawn Drive

Stow OH 44224

330-678-0591 Phone/Fax

330-329-5981 cell

davidhaas@sbcglobal.net

 

Sample Image Galleries at:

http://www.pbase.com/dhaas

 

Ikelite equipment test images at:

http://www.ikelite.com/web_pages/triv_haas_ettl.html

http://www.ikelite.com/web_pages/triv_haasdrebel.html

http://www.ikelite.com/web_pages/triv_haas_g6.html

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Hi Dave,

 

Please send the commission to James Wisecrack 555 Main Street, Houston TX 11111

 

Just kidding!!!!!

 

Cheers

James

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Whitey et al: I would suggest the Sigma 50 over the Canon 50 macro. The sigma shoots 1:1 without the conversion glass and in our hands at least focuses as fast and is just nicer to use. I use both on land and almost always these days pull out the sigma.

 

BVA

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Whitey et al: I would suggest the Sigma 50 over the Canon 50 macro. The sigma shoots 1:1 without the conversion glass and in our hands at least focuses as fast and is just nicer to use. I use both on land and almost always these days pull out the sigma.

 

BVA

 

forgive me because I haven't used the Sigma lens, but why is 1:1 such a big deal at that focal length? In order to get 1:1 with a 50mm you have to be like 4 inches from the subject which is nearly impossible in a housing behind a flat port. And why is the Sigma "just nicer to use"?

 

And isn't that what digital's all about? if you want a closer framing you can crop the original to whatever ratio works best for the image.

 

Marty

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Having used both the lenses in question, I have to agree with Martys. 1:1 macro with a 50mm lens is not often practical and is so much easier with the Canon 100mm macro USM. The other thing about the the Sigma 50mm macro to be aware of is the considerable barrel extension that is required for 1:1 macro - this can have port selection considerations.

My favourite 50mm lens by far is in fact the Canon 50mm f/1.4 USM. Admittely not a macro lens ( closest focus 0.45m ) but it is the shapest lens I own (including three L lenses). I have used it behind flat ports for small to medium fish pictures and topside it is awesome as well. It could probably be used in a dome port with an apropriate diopter as well, but I haven't got round to trying that yet.

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And isn't that what digital's all about? if you want a closer framing you can crop the original to whatever ratio works best for the image.

 

Marty

 

No, not at all. You should never plan to crop for any reason other than to change the shape.

 

For example if you hava a 8MP 20D and you want to take a picture of a 22.5mm shrimp.

 

If you are using a simga macro you can focus down to 1:1 and the shirmp will fill the frame. You now have 8MP of shrimp and you could print the shimp out well over 24inches.

 

Now you are using the canon macro and can only focus down to 1:2. You go ahead and get as close as the lens will let you and plan on cropping later to fill the frame with the shrimp.

 

You get on the computer and crop out just the shrimp. THe shrimp is 22.5mm but the frame includes 45mm worth of space. So you crop away half of the width and half of the hight. You now have the same composition as the first picture with the sigma lens but you only have 2MP of data.

 

By planning on cropping you have effectively turned your 8MP camera into a 2MP camera. If all you want to do is print out 4x6 then you are fine, but if you wanted a nice big picture to hang on the wall you are out of luck.

 

I agree that it is much more difficulut to do 1:1 with a 50mm lens than it is with a 100mm lens but if you want to get a 50mm lens and 1:1 is something you plan on doing definately go with the sigma.

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I've bought cameras, lenses, and everything Ikelite from B&H. No problems, ever.

 

I use the Canon 50mm and 100mm macro. I'd start with the 50mm as the 100mm takes more getting used to. I also use the Canon 16-35, but if I had to do it over again I'd buy a 15mm WA since I usually shoot at the widest end of the lens anyway.

 

Just my $.02

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Thanks Will. I see your point - I guess, if your photography calls for large images on a regular basis. But I've always considered post-processing on the computer, including cropping, no different then darkroom work in the film world. With my 10D, I've done 50% crops with pretty good results up to 8x10. However, considering that of the 1000's of images I shoot, a few 100 end up on a web site and maybe 5-10% of those actually get printed I don't think filling the frame is a prerequisite to good results. Certainly you get potentially better results, but that's not to say cropped results are of poor quality.

 

The other point to my question is why is the Sigma lens a better lens? Is it the f/45 you get, or is the glass of higher quality? Given two identical compositions side by side, is the Signma lens in fact a better lens and why? I've heard from multiple people that the Sigma focus is slower and less accurate in low light conditions, but there is a new EX DG version and I'm wondering if they have addressed those problems.

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Marty: I agree with some of what you say but throwing pixels away is never something I plan on doing. If I know I am going to shoot really tiny things, I will use the Canon 100 mm macro but for general mix of fish and macro, I like the sigma. As for quality, I think the Sigma has a nicer look to it than the equivalent Canon 50 macro, but that is just personal. It does focus a bunch slower than the Canon, but if you choose your port so that the lens is close to the glass at maximum focus you can get shots that you can't get with the Canon. This is the only lens that I have where I like the sigma better than Canon, the 100 mm Canon is much better than the Sigma 105 at least to me.

 

Bill

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Marty: I like your choice of housings, if we could only get a 20d to fit and use the 10-22 lens

Bill

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In terms of optical quality both Sigmas have slightly overtaken the Canon originals especially wide open (which is not that important with a macro lens). However the differences are so small as all those telecentric designed macro lenses perfom very well with DSLRs in general.

 

Canon 100mm Macro has faster focus for sure including manual override (USM).

I am really not sure if the Canon 50mm is faster than the Sigma 50mm as stated? Both do not have USM/HSM, just regular focus drives. Did someone tried both side by side? I did not notice the Canon to be faster focusing.

 

Julian

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I have a Canon 50mm macro and really the autofocus is not fast as USM lenses, the big issue with autofocus happens when you are taking pictures very close to subject and then try to get a closeup picture from a medium fish... When you need to change the distance between you and the fish from 0,5m up to 0,50m.. If the focus distance change just few centimeters, slow focus could not be a problem.

 

I tried the sigma one and occurs the same about Canon, but I think canon a little bit more fast.

 

Best Regards

Fabio

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I finally took the plunge after advice on Wetpixal and purchased a 20D and Ikelite on very short notice rushed me a eTTL housing and Ryan coordinated the sale and is sending me the strobe package. I only started looking last week in last minute deperation ahead of my trip this friday to Tahiti and New Zealand. I should have everything in hand tomorrow! Ikelite went out of their way to help me out. I'm sold on their customer service. I got Ryan's name from Matt Segal's trip report (thanks Matt). Very responsive. I didn't get a steal on the deal but got a fair price and excellent customer service. Thanks to Ryan and Ike I will shooting my first uw digital pics in a few days! Of course, I'm still bringing my Nik V and 15mm lens. ANY SUGGESTIONS ON WHAT TO CARRY ALL THIS STUFF IN????

 

Jim

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re: 20D in a Subal C10 housing - I'm hoping someone can confirm if this will really work or not. I've emailed Subal asking as much and they have not answered my questions. I'd like to try one of the 20D's before the Wetpixel Shark trip in March. Even if I had to buy a replacement backplate it would be cheaper than buying a completely new housing (which I'm not prepared to do).

 

btw - has anyone else noticed the price of Subal housings has increased significantly since last summer? Is this the result of the falling US$ ??

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